2016-2017 Indians Off-Season Thread

[BimboColesHair]

Too busy voicing my disgust with Kenny Lofton falling off the ballot to research anything else tonight.

Dark day for me.

And yet Tim Raines just made it in...

The whole "falling off the ballot" aspect of MLB HOF voting is pissing a lot of writers off today.

 

[AZ_]

And yet Tim Raines just made it in...

The whole "falling off the ballot" aspect of MLB HOF voting is pissing a lot of writers off today.

The Raines thing is exactly why I'm so annoyed by it.

Ugh...fucking archaic BBWAA.

 

[BimboColesHair]

The Raines thing is exactly why I'm so annoyed by it.

Ugh...fucking archaic BBWAA.

Look on the bright side...Indians should get 2 in next year...but I'm sure someone will fuck it up.

 

[The Oi]

This has been explained to me before, but I'm sure I've blocked it out:

(1) What the hell is the argument against Kenny Lofton?

(2) Why don't these morons just vote these guys in the first time around if they deserve to be in the HOF?

 

[BimboColesHair]

This has been explained to me before, but I'm sure I've blocked it out:

(1) What the hell is the argument against Kenny Lofton?

(2) Why don't these morons just vote these guys in the first time around if they deserve to be in the HOF?

Pretty sure Lofton's first and only year on the ballot was the year the BBWAA "boycotted" their ballots and didn't vote anyone in on purpose, which hurt him. But most of the argument against him is that he didn't stick out enough in his era, which I think is bullshit.

As for number 2...too many guys on each ballot every year. Like this year, 23 guys got votes, and their were 34 on the ballot in total. Saps down numbers to where only certain guys (Griffey, Randy Johnson, Ryan, Ripken, Schmidt, etc.) who are no-brainers get in on their 1st ballot.

 

[Amherstcavsfan]

I dont think Omar gets in next year. Thome MIGHT make it first ballot, but Im sure there will be blow back of some kind against him.

 

[BimboColesHair]

I dont think Omar gets in next year. Thome MIGHT make it first ballot, but Im sure there will be blow back of some kind against him.

Thome is an absolute lock. 600 HR club and one of the most liked guys in baseball by baseball writers themselves.

Omar it depends. He's top 3 all-time defensively at his position, and the 2 guys in that group with him, Ozzie Smith and Luis Apricio, are both in...the one who he compares more to offensively, Ozzie, got in on his first ballot. But he doesn't have the hardware Ozzie has (All-Star games, WS ring).

 

[Amherstcavsfan]

Thome is an absolute lock. 600 HR club and one of the most liked guys in baseball by baseball writers themselves.

Omar it depends. He's top 3 all-time defensively at his position, and the 2 guys in that group with him, Ozzie Smith and Luis Apricio, are both in...the one who he compares more to offensively, Ozzie, got in on his first ballot. But he doesn't have the hardware Ozzie has (All-Star games, WS ring).

Oh I think they both get in.

However, those two are on some of the toughest ballots ever. And if the BBWAA all of a sudden turns positive on Rocket or Bonds, I dont think they get the overwhelming support next year.

I just have a feeling Thome does not get in on the first ballot. Thats just how the BBWAA is. I hate it. I definitely dont think Omar gets in on his first shot. Same with Thome, I think the BBWAA has a stick up their ass about first time ballot guys. Hope I am wrong.

 

[BimboColesHair]

Oh I think they both get in.

However, those two are on some of the toughest ballots ever. And if the BBWAA all of a sudden turns positive on Rocket or Bonds, I dont think they get the overwhelming support next year.

I just have a feeling Thome does not get in on the first ballot. Thats just how the BBWAA is. I hate it. I definitely dont think Omar gets in on his first shot. Same with Thome, I think the BBWAA has a stick up their ass about first time ballot guys. Hope I am wrong.

I think he does, just based on what happened with Frank Thomas. Thomas got in on his first ballot, on a tough ballot (Glavine, Maddux, Biggio, Piazza, Bagwell). Only difference between the 2 is Big Hurt is in the lifetime .300 club, while Thome is in the 600 club. Think he get's around 80% voting and gets in his first go round.

Think next year sets a record for must inductees in one year.

Of course, the BBWAA could fuck it all up, and they probably will somehow, but I don't think it effects Thome.

 

[macbdog]

If Omar ever gets in it will be years down the road, slowly building in his total. If he makes it first ballot while Vlad Guerrero doesn't? Woe to those voters. I'm not an advocate for Omar but if they can build a legit statistical case other than 'they let in Aparicio and Ozzie'- I see no reason to lower standards like they did for these two- then I can accept it.

 

[Snarly]

You know the Indians have a winning team when fight bre... Nevermind. Anyways that said and getting back to the off season news and no offense to posters but there should be a Hall of Fame thread. I mean I get this is where it should go now but I kinda want to get Indians off season moves here.

Okay so I feel with Brantley and his situation and I love we got Guyer locked up a little longer he is a great piece to have and a nice find. I do think we should try to add or trade for another CF just incase. If this team is so high in Zimmer and think Naquin improved a great amount then we can stick with what we have but depth is never a bad thing as we saw last year so again unless this team is sure Zimmer will be a ready come October then get a OF just incase.

Finally as someone stated tee batting practice is nothing new to players in rehab or early spring training. It is more how he hits off the tee and how he looks doing so. Brantley can come back fine, Worst case he never comes back, I of course would start him in AAA ball even if he is doing well there I would not rush him back up here so soon. We might see him after the All Star break that is my assumption. I also feel if not him then we will see Zimmer.

 

[sportscoach]

Well Fred McGriff isn't in the hall of fame and Lofton I figured was borderline since he doesn't have true HOF numbers, but had a great career. Growing up watching Lofton, we are going to be a little biased towards him and he may get another chance down the line but everyone knows he was a catalyst on the 90s Indians cause of his ability to get on base and steal bases in front of our hitters. That 90s lineup is almost impossible to duplicate to be sincere. Vizquel is a bit short on hits, and if he doesn't get in first ballot it's cause of that. Thome has never been accused of any PED links (though I think a vast majority had some type of usage in the era since in baseball it got to the point of a vitamin supplement and was just the norm) so he should get in the first time I would think.

Now it looks like the Indians just brought back former farm hand and 40 man roster Kelvin De La Cruz, but isn't invited to spring training so he isn't all that important in this discussion and if he somehow finds his talent again could be a guy if he stays with the organization did what Garner did with us last season.

 

[The Oi]

Any chance HOF voting is modified in any way in the future? Everybody hates it.

 

[Snarly]

Any chance HOF voting is modified in any way in the future? Everybody hates it.

Unless you are in it then no.

 

[Amherstcavsfan]

Any chance HOF voting is modified in any way in the future? Everybody hates it.

Everyone hates it but BBWAA adores it.

Until the good ol' boys club gets ousted, it will stay the same.