Racial Tension in the U.S.

[Nathan S]

I know a lot of folks in that Trump/Cruz battle, and they agreed on a lot of issues. The vast majority of those who liked Trump also liked Cruz, at least initially.

There were primarily two things that tipped Trump supporters always from Cruz, and race wasn't one of them. The first was that many of them simply had a greater affinity for a more blunt-spoken guy versus a guy who always sounds like a lawyer. They wanted someone willing to flip the bird and deliberately offend "the Establishment."

The second was that Trump was much more of a protectionist/economic nationalist. Cruz was more free trade. Cruz's initial support for TPA killed him with those folks. From what I saw/heard, that was the single biggest factor.

These are all good points...it's just also true that Trump's blunt-spoken style and economic nationalist ideology were very appealing to the (relatively small) fraction of Americans who are outright racists. It's up for debate whether or not Trump was knowingly courting those voters, but they ultimately ended up being the most vocal/visible part of his base.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Farrakhan couldn't get elected because he supports BLM.

That's ridiculous on its face.

I think that's pretty much the final straw for me and you on the politics forum, actually. It's too much work to try to discuss things with someone who doesn't even attempt to screen their own arguments to reject facially stupid shit before posting.

 

[AZ_]

That's ridiculous on its face.

I think that's pretty much the final straw for me and you on the politics forum, actually. It's too much work to try to discuss things with someone who doesn't even attempt to screen their own arguments to reject facially stupid shit before posting.

I don't really know what your problem is here.

Farrakhan can't get away with saying stupid shit, or supporting something like BLM or emboldening black power/those who wish to see white people suffer.

Donald Trump can, and has, emboldened racists and bigots. He is a racist, and a bigot. He was elected President of the United States.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

These are all good points...it's just also true that Trump's blunt-spoken style and economic nationalist ideology were very appealing to the (relatively small) fraction of Americans who are outright racists. It's up for debate whether or not Trump was knowingly courting those voters, but they ultimately ended up being the most vocal/visible part of his base.

Candidates win with coalitions, and you could argue that every element of that coalition was the key one that put him over the top.

I would suggest that the reason racists were the most visible part of his base is because a media that despised him deliberately promoted the most unsavoury of his supporters. It was a double win for them because it meant ratings while also advancing their own agendas.

I know an awful lot of ordinary Republicans absolutely sick of Washington in general who voted for the guy pretty much as a Hail Mary to stir things up, and for the Supreme Court. They didn't seem to get nearly the coverage that their numbers warranted, though....

 

[Whittaker]

"Children, beware the "closet white supremacists" and "closet racists"."
"But Sensei, since they're in the closet how do we know who they are?"
"Child, are you a racist?"
"Never Sensei."
"Do you want a wall"?
"Never Sensei".
"Would a racist want a wall?"
"Yes!"
"You have your answer"
"Thank you Rachel...err Sensei."

 

[David.]

That's ridiculous on its face.

I think that's pretty much the final straw for me and you on the politics forum, actually. It's too much work to try to discuss things with someone who doesn't even attempt to screen their own arguments to reject facially stupid shit before posting.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

I don't really know what your problem is here.

I'm going to respond just to this post. Here is what you said:

Farrakhan couldn't get elected because he supports BLM.

If you don't see what makes that a ridiculous statement on its face, then you're incapable of honest analysis.

If you know why that is ridiculous, but tossed it out there anyway, you're a troll.

Either way, I have no further interest in discussing this stuff with you because there are others here on the "other side" actually willing to have decent discussions, even if we disagree.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Just had it. The entire Democrat Party knob-gobbled BLM because they got crucified if they didn't. Hillary, who openly and strongly supported BLM, won the nomination at least in part because of overwhelming support from black voters. And if she wasn't such an otherwise lazy, shitty candidate she would have won the Electoral College and not just the popular vote.

The idea that it is support for BLM that keeps Farrakhan out of the White House is simply laughable. FFS, he didn't have a prayer in hell of ever getting elected before BLM even existed.

Yeah, so I'm done with him.

 

[AZ_]

I'm going to respond just to this post. Here is what you said:



If you don't see what makes that a ridiculous statement on its face, then you're incapable of honest analysis.

If you know why that is ridiculous, but tossed it out there anyway, you're a troll.

Either way, I have no further interest in discussing this stuff with you because there are others here on the "other side" actually willing to have decent discussions, even if we disagree.

Are you trying to portray me as believing it's the "only" reason he can't get elected?

Again, I'm not really sure why you're so fired up.

 

[David.]

Are you trying to portray me as believing it's the "only" reason he can't get elected?

Again, I'm not really sure why you're so fired up.

Stop.

Farrakhan couldn't get elected because he supports BLM.

Not engaging with you. But Jesus christ stop.

 

[Nathan S]

Candidates win with coalitions, and you could argue that every element of that coalition was the key one that put him over the top.

I would suggest that the reason racists were the most visible part of his base is because a media that despised him deliberately promoted the most unsavoury of his supporters. It was a double win for them because it meant ratings while also advancing their own agendas.

I know an awful lot of ordinary Republicans absolutely sick of Washington in general who voted for the guy pretty much as a Hail Mary to stir things up, and for the Supreme Court. They didn't seem to get nearly the coverage that their numbers warranted, though....

Eh, we'll probably have to agree to disagree on this. Media hype aside, the more moderate Trump voters you speak of were never gung-ho, loud-and-proud Trump supporters like the alt-right were, imo.

Whether by strategically pleading ignorance, or actually being ignorant, Trump was able to toe the line on the alt-right throughout his candidacy. He kept their "dream" alive by never whole-heartedly shutting them down like moderates wanted him to, but he said enough to convince moderates that he didn't have a hidden racist agenda.

 

[David.]

Just had it. The entire Democrat Party knob-gobbled BLM because they got crucified if they didn't. Hillary, who openly and strongly supported BLM, won the nomination at least in part because of overwhelming support from black voters. And if she wasn't such an otherwise lazy, shitty candidate she would have won the Electoral College and not just the popular vote.

The idea that it is support for BLM that keeps Farrakhan out of the White House is simply laughable. FFS, he didn't have a prayer in hell of ever getting elected before BLM even existed.

Yeah, so I'm done with him.

For all the absolute bitching about everyone being a damned nazi

-"You see everybody always talk about Hitler exterminating six million Jews. That’s right. But don’t nobody ever ask what did they do to Hitler.”


-“The Jews don’t like Farrakhan, so they call me Hitler. Well, that’s a good name. Hitler was a very great man.”


-On on the Jewish people: “You are wicked deceivers of the American people. You have sucked their blood.”


.. That is just insane. The quotes are insane and any support implicit or otherwise, is just absolutely insane.

Fucking dog whistle left and right and this guy is talking about killing white people and jews and "Hitler didn't do anything wrong".

And yea it was blm. If this is blm, then yea he shouldn't be elected and blm is a hate group. In any event, it was definitely BECAUSE he supported blm and no one can handle that, even though most people support the damn thing.


-White people are potential humans – they haven’t evolved yet.

-the Mother Wheel is a heavily armed spaceship the size of a city, which will rain destruction upon white America but save those who embrace the Nation of Islam.”

He's a an antisemitic black supremacist. Just incredible.

 

[AZ_]

Stop.


Not engaging with you. But Jesus christ stop.

For a second there I thought you were going to expand on your hit and run attack on Judge Curiel.

But nope, just a personal attack.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Eh, we'll probably have to agree to disagree on this. Media hype aside, the more moderate Trump voters you speak of were never gung-ho, loud-and-proud Trump supporters like the alt-right were, imo.

Whether by strategically pleading ignorance, or actually being ignorant, Trump was able to toe the line on the alt-right throughout his candidacy. He kept their "dream" alive by never whole-heartedly shutting them down like moderates wanted him to, but he said enough to convince moderates that he didn't have a hidden racist agenda.

Democrats don't go out of their way to disavow the more extreme elements of their support either. There were plenty of fairly horrible things said by various BLM supporters, and some pretty extreme things said by members of other parameters of the Democrat coalition. And Dems were mostly silent about that because they didn't want to antagonize potential voters or risk losing their progressive street cred.

The "you must disavow everything offensive said by anyone who supports you" standard was only applied to one side in this election.

 

[AZ_]

Also part of LA raza. It's an absolutely ridiculous discussion.

What does this mean?

What has he done for La Raza that makes him incapable of doing his job?

Bump.