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Dwight Howard Tracker

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'small ball' is commonly mistaken for having short players.

logically, being shorter than the other team does not provide any benefit.

its their shooting and quickness that takes consideration over height, and is to be expected when subbing a 6'10 guy for a 7'1 guy.

dwight may be shorter than 7'1, but that doesnt make him conducive to a small ball lineup.


otoh, having a 7'4 wingspan does. even if small ball leaves someone wide open, theres a 50% change he'll miss his three.. an old school center would clean up, big time. and would be very difficult to defend if that old school center can back a smaller defender down.



Also it's funny how the love fest for the Warriors has made people forget that there have been plenty of small type teams who've done extremely well in the playoffs. Hell Dwight's team in ORL was breaking 3 point shooting records for years playing small ball.

The thing abut the Cavs that's different than any other team in the league is Lebron. I mean honestly this guy is so special he allows you to get away with things that other teams just can't do. You can play Lebron at any position with any combo of players.

You can play him with Love and Howard or with Kyrie, Delly, Jr Smith etc..
 
I can't believe where this thread headed. Dwight Howard is one distracted pussy of a man. He's the broadest shouldered vagina in the whole world. He's one of these people that needs to be loved in such a bad way, that it makes him an insufferable, perpetually distracted man.

I think it's only a matter of time before Howard's back disables his career. That's just a lot of mass to throw so high into the air. Dwight only knows how to play one way, and it involved his athleticism. Once that diminishes, you are left with one big smiling has-been of a man.

Don't even get me started on James Harden. That guy is a fucking sham in a half. He's an incredibly gifted offensive player who is a mental trainwreck of a player.

The problem with Houston is that their big 2 players are actually not franchise cornerstone players. Right now Harden has been granted the keys to the kingdom like he's Kobe Bryant. In reality James' best spot in the league was on the Thunder. He was the super-Ginobili of the Thunder, that position was tailor made for his gifts. Dwight Howard lead his team to the finals because of his old coach Stan Van Chubby. What Van Chubby did was surround Dwight's talents with the perfect compliment of teammates. Sure, Dwight was super dominant, but he needed that recipe around him that Stan cultivated.

Seriously, both of these guys are ideally 3rd maybe 2nd options on a championship contender. Dwight Howard is a lot more Ben Wallace than Shaquille O'Neal. Big-Ben= fantastic athletic specimen with zero offensive game, corrals in rebounds like a beast, blocks shots at the top of the square.... a very important piece, an anchor to a defense but cannot support himself offensively alone.

I'm intrigued by the idea of Dwight Howard, but I'm telling you his game isn't going to age well, his body will not age gracefully, he'd be another injured player for us to deal with.

Harden will never win a championship in his NBA career. He's that cancerous. His defense is so deplorable, plus now his head is all pumped up thinking he's "the guy" when in reality he's not built for that kind of role. Harden's name became too big, now he's dating a Kardashian and I wouldn't be surprised if he's found unconscious in a brothel. Seriously the only one who can wrangle in a Kardashian is Kanye because Crazy+Crazier= actually cancels out.
 
What do you consider small ball? Dwight Howard is 6'9, Kev is 6'9, Lebron is 6'8.

Small ball hasn't anything to do with height, but how many guards/wings you put on the floor while playing fast, uptempo, and creating spacing by sacrificing interior defense - this is traditionally done by playing a three-guard or even four-guard rotation with a PF/C or a power-forward at center. The point to this is to create a mismatch for opponents with the goal of outscoring your opponent while sacrificing defense, or to correct a mismatch created/initiated by an opponent.

Dwight Howard playing at center is not effective against smaller lineups that don't play traditional centers or go very small, like the Warriors, because he's not effective defending outside of the interior nor can he space the floor as he only requires a defender when positioned directly under the hoop. The Warriors abused the Rockets when Howard was on the floor during the playoffs by playing Draymond Green at the 5.

Yes, you can play small with Howard on the floor, but in the most likely matchup we'll face in these upcoming finals, is Howard a better option than Tristan Thompson who is an elite PnR/PnP defender? Honestly, in that specific matchup, defensively, he's not. Against the Spurs? Sure, against Golden State, no.

Any trades we make at this point need to address those two specific matchups.

Dwight can guard 5's and 4's.

Dwight can guard centers. Dwight's not guarding modern power-forwards out at the perimeter. He's not even being put into that position, so I'm not sure why you'd think this. He'd get torched. We saw this happen in the playoffs.

Now if your idea of small ball is what the Warriors play then they're the only team (besides a healthy Cavs team and maybe the Spurs) who can get away with playing small ball because of their personnel.

We've been getting rocked by several teams including even the Wizards who've started playing smaller. Let's not pretend that the Warriors are isolated in this, they aren't. Other teams around the league are starting to realize they too can field a team without playing a traditional center and find success against teams/coaches unable to adjust defensively.

With respect to the Warriors though, you've got to take that into consideration. The only point of making a trade at this point would be to improve our chances of winning the Finals. Does Dwight Howard help us against the odds-on favorites to win the championship? Maybe, maybe not.

Look around the league and tell me if a frontline of Lebron, Love and Dwight can't matchup with any lineup small ball or not. I think it can.

Who is concerned about the league, or the regular season for that matter? We have a cakewalk to the NBA Finals. The only relevant matchups are the Spurs, Warriors, and the Thunder. Everyone else isn't really of interest.

It really comes down to what you think small ball is.

I'm kind of scratching my head because what small ball is is not a matter of debate. The question isn't what is small ball, it's how does Dwight Howard help us beat the Warriors?

Can we play him against 90% of the league? Of course, and be dominant. But does he help us against the one or two teams that matter the most? Of that I'm not sure. I could care less about the other squads though - they aren't important.
 
I can't believe where this thread headed. Dwight Howard is one distracted pussy of a man. He's the broadest shouldered vagina in the whole world. He's one of these people that needs to be loved in such a bad way, that it makes him an insufferable, perpetually distracted man.

I think it's only a matter of time before Howard's back disables his career. That's just a lot of mass to throw so high into the air. Dwight only knows how to play one way, and it involved his athleticism. Once that diminishes, you are left with one big smiling has-been of a man.

Don't even get me started on James Harden. That guy is a fucking sham in a half. He's an incredibly gifted offensive player who is a mental trainwreck of a player.

The problem with Houston is that their big 2 players are actually not franchise cornerstone players. Right now Harden has been granted the keys to the kingdom like he's Kobe Bryant. In reality James' best spot in the league was on the Thunder. He was the super-Ginobili of the Thunder, that position was tailor made for his gifts. Dwight Howard lead his team to the finals because of his old coach Stan Van Chubby. What Van Chubby did was surround Dwight's talents with the perfect compliment of teammates. Sure, Dwight was super dominant, but he needed that recipe around him that Stan cultivated.

Seriously, both of these guys are ideally 3rd maybe 2nd options on a championship contender. Dwight Howard is a lot more Ben Wallace than Shaquille O'Neal. Big-Ben= fantastic athletic specimen with zero offensive game, corrals in rebounds like a beast, blocks shots at the top of the square.... a very important piece, an anchor to a defense but cannot support himself offensively alone.

I'm intrigued by the idea of Dwight Howard, but I'm telling you his game isn't going to age well, his body will not age gracefully, he'd be another injured player for us to deal with.

Harden will never win a championship in his NBA career. He's that cancerous. His defense is so deplorable, plus now his head is all pumped up thinking he's "the guy" when in reality he's not built for that kind of role. Harden's name became too big, now he's dating a Kardashian and I wouldn't be surprised if he's found unconscious in a brothel. Seriously the only one who can wrangle in a Kardashian is Kanye because Crazy+Crazier= actually cancels out.


I mean what's the problem with the bolded part? You just described the perfect Center for this team.

Defensive anchor - check
Won't disrupt the offense - check
Elite rebounder - check
Elite shot blocker - check

So what if Dwight Howard is not Shaq. No big man in the league has been close to Shaq level dominance since him. If you take Dwight Howard's game for what it is then there's probably no better proven player next to Lebron and Love.
 
I mean what's the problem with the bolded part? You just described the perfect Center for this team.

Defensive anchor - check
Won't disrupt the offense - check
Elite rebounder - check
Elite shot blocker - check

So what if Dwight Howard is not Shaq. No big man in the league has been close to Shaq level dominance since him. If you take Dwight Howard's game for what it is then there's probably no better proven player next to Lebron and Love.

I don't disagree with you.. The question is, does Dwight Howard help us against the Warriors?

I don't think he does.

p.s.
Your "won't disrupt the offense" isn't historically sound considering he's notorious for doing just that and going to his agent, his camp, and the media to press the issue when coaches ignore his complaints.

He may or may not disrupt the offense, we don't know.
He may or may not be a distraction in the locker room or in the media, we don't know.
He may or may not be a cancer, we don't know.
Players may or may not genuinely hate him, we don't know.

There's a lot more going on here than just his ability to play the 5.

I'm not even against any trade that could maximize our value and convert Thompson's contract into something more movable.
 
I mean what's the problem with the bolded part? You just described the perfect Center for this team.

Defensive anchor - check
Won't disrupt the offense - check
Elite rebounder - check
Elite shot blocker - check

So what if Dwight Howard is not Shaq. No big man in the league has been close to Shaq level dominance since him. If you take Dwight Howard's game for what it is then there's probably no better proven player next to Lebron and Love.
But that's an oversimplification.

1) Dwight Howard is a great interior defender. Probably better than Moz. I'll give you that. But he can't guard the perimeter, at all. He's too slow. TT is a significantly better perimeter defender, which is significantly more important in today's NBA, especially when Moz, at his best, is not much worse than Dwight at defending the interior.
2) Have you listened to what the complaint is? He wants more touches. He would be the fourth (maybe even fifth) best offensive weapon in the starting lineup. He won't get nearly as many touches here as he is in Houston.
3) Agreed here, but TT is also nearly elite.
4) Agreed.

Essentially, Dwight is a great player, you have no disagreement from me on that. But, he is not as valuable for this team in today's NBA as he would be for, say, a Boston who significantly lacks an interior presence. In fact, his presence demanding shots and being a mediocre perimeter defender may hurt us more than help.
 
I don't disagree with you.. The question is, does Dwight Howard help us against the Warriors?

I don't think he does.

p.s.
Your "won't disrupt the offense" isn't historically sound considering he's notorious for doing just that and going to his agent, his camp, and the media to press the issue when coaches ignore his complaints.

He may or may not disrupt the offense, we don't know.


I think he does help us against the Warriors. You looking at how they beat us last year and not taking into consideration that we didn't have Kyrie and Love. The thing that changed the series was when they inserted Iggy for Bogut. Do they even make that adjustment if We had Kyrie and Love? I say no.

I get it that the Warriors won last season but we shouldn't be building our roster to match theirs. Our roster when healthy already does. e should be looking to build a roster than no team can matchup with. What happens when The Spurs knock off GSW and we don't have the personnel to match up?


PS: I wish I knew how to do that multi quote thing it would really help. :biggrinthumb:
 
Essentially, Dwight is a great player, you have no disagreement from me on that. But, he is not as valuable for this team in today's NBA as he would be for, say, a Boston who significantly lacks an interior presence. In fact, his presence demanding shots and being a mediocre perimeter defender may hurt us more than help.

Exactly.
 
I think he does help us against the Warriors. You looking at how they beat us last year and not taking into consideration that we didn't have Kyrie and Love. The thing that changed the series was when they inserted Iggy for Bogut. Do they even make that adjustment if We had Kyrie and Love? I say no.

I get it that the Warriors won last season but we shouldn't be building our roster to match theirs. Our roster when healthy already does. e should be looking to build a roster than no team can matchup with. What happens when The Spurs knock off GSW and we don't have the personnel to match up?


PS: I wish I knew how to do that multi quote thing it would really help. :biggrinthumb:
This is a fair point. If you read anything on my website (it's in the Jking's thread on here) I've come out and said Spurs are the team to beat. They are running a similar offense to the 08-09 Lakers and 09-10 Celtics very effectively.

Here's the thing, though, Aldridge and Duncan are both significantly talented at creating midrange shots as well as post shots. Dwight Howard, when he is drawn out six-feet or more from the rim, struggles. So does he help us defend post-ups? Heck yeah, even better than Moz. But it doesn't change the fact that Kevin Love and Tristan will need to be guarding Aldridge.

If we play two bigs in Moz and Dwight, San Antonio will just attack us using the midrange game, which is what they have excelled at all year.
 
Man I'm praying that everybody doesn't get too caught up on this "New NBA" playing style. I understand that it's not the old days with big 7'0 Centers. I'm not saying that what we should be doing.

I'm saying because of Lebron James we are not like any other team. The guy is special. He allows us to get away with things other teams can't. He's basically another elite PG out there who can guard 1-5 (most centers). Dwight Howard at his best is another player who is special. By the way Dwight Howard is a better PnR defender than Tristan by a stretch. I think some have forgot just how elite he was on defense during his dominant defensive stretch.
 
I think he does help us against the Warriors. You looking at how they beat us last year and not taking into consideration that we didn't have Kyrie and Love.

Believe me.. I've taken every aspect of that matchup into consideration. I wouldn't even play Howard in the 4th against the Warriors. If they start pick and rolling him with their infinite illegal screens, and Curry and Klay roll to the basket, or simply fire immediately after the screen, ugh.. He's got no place on the floor against that team unless they're playing Bogut or Ezeli, which they won't.

The thing that changed the series was when they inserted Iggy for Bogut. Do they even make that adjustment if We had Kyrie and Love? I say no.

The Warriors are substantially better this year than last year. Draymond Green is substantially better than last year. Klay Thompson is coming out of a shooting slump and playing phenomenally well.

...we gotta focus on our competitors today; not the guys from last year.

I get it that the Warriors won last season but we shouldn't be building our roster to match theirs.

That's exactly what we should be doing.

Who would you rather have on the floor? Thompson or Howard?

Our roster when healthy already does. e should be looking to build a roster than no team can matchup with. What happens when The Spurs knock off GSW and we don't have the personnel to match up?

So the Spurs can pick and roll us to death with high screens and spacing? :chuckle:

Howard hates defending the pick and roll, and has historically asked not to be the roll man on offense in the PnR. Re-read what I just wrote and realize how fucking crazy that sounds. Think about playing Kyrie, Love, and James with a center that doesn't want to set screens and roll to the basket. Now think about both the Spurs and Golden State and how their offense runs and how Howard fits into our defensive schemes.

Yeah..

Again, I'm not saying it couldn't work, but I think you're ignoring the myriad of problems associated with Dwight Howard.

PS: I wish I knew how to do that multi quote thing it would really help. :biggrinthumb:

It's an art as much as a science.
 
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This is a fair point. If you read anything on my website (it's in the Jking's thread on here) I've come out and said Spurs are the team to beat. They are running a similar offense to the 08-09 Lakers and 09-10 Celtics very effectively.

Here's the thing, though, Aldridge and Duncan are both significantly talented at creating midrange shots as well as post shots. Dwight Howard, when he is drawn out six-feet or more from the rim, struggles. So does he help us defend post-ups? Heck yeah, even better than Moz. But it doesn't change the fact that Kevin Love and Tristan will need to be guarding Aldridge.

If we play two bigs in Moz and Dwight, San Antonio will just attack us using the midrange game, which is what they have excelled at all year.


I hear what you saying but when did Aldridge become a good defender? Him and Kev are pretty equal defensive with LA having more length but Love being the far better rebounder. LA is a better mid range shooter but Kev is a better 3 point shooter. They are about equal with all due respect.

With that being said I have the upmost respect for Duncan but Dwight Howard can shut him down at this point.
 
I hear what you saying but when did Aldridge become a good defender? Him and Kev are pretty equal defensive with LA having more length but Love being the far better rebounder.

No....

LA is a better mid range shooter but Kev is a better 3 point shooter. They are about equal with all due respect.

I'd agree with this though.

With that being said I have the upmost respect for Duncan but Dwight Howard can shut him down at this point.

...

Look, Los, I'm with you on the general idea.. it's worth exploring. I'm just not as sold on you with respect to how well it would work out. I'd do it only because I think you're buying low and selling high (Tristan/Moz +Shump +low picks for Howard). Howard has tremendous value, and in a winning environment over a season, could potentially be parlayed into a more useful piece (a wing, LBJ replacement).
 
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Believe me.. I've taken every aspect of that matchup into consideration. I wouldn't even play Howard in the 4th against the Warriors. If they start pick and rolling him with their infinite illegal screens, and Curry and Klay roll to the basket, or simply fire immediately after the screen, ugh.. He's got no place on the floor against that team unless they're playing Bogut or Ezeli, which they won't.



The Warriors are substantially better this year than last year. Draymond Green is substantially better than last year. Klay Thompson is coming out of a shooting slump and playing phenomenally well.

...we gotta focus on our competitors today; not the guys from last year.



That's exactly what we should be doing.

Who would you rather have on the floor? Thompson or Howard?



So the Spurs can pick and roll us to death with high screens and spacing? :chuckle:

Howard hates defending the pick and roll, and has historically asked not to be the roll man on offense in the PnR. Re-read what I just wrote and realize how fucking crazy that sounds. Think about playing Kyrie, Love, and James with a center that doesn't want to set screens and roll to the basket. Now think about both the Spurs and Golden State and how their offense runs and how Howard fits into our defensive schemes.

Yeah..

Again, I'm not saying it couldn't work, but I think you're ignoring the myriad of problems associated with Dwight Howard.



It's an art as much as a science.


I'm not ignoring Dwight Howard's problems. I'm asking you how can any team defend that font line. I mean other teams have to defend us to you know. Like you said the Warriors would put Dwight in Pnr but are they not gonna play Bogut with Dwight and Love out there. They won last year against an unhealthy Cavs team.

I hear you when you say they playing better this year but it's the same personnel and Curry is till not playing defense. Insert Kyrie and that neutralizes Curry. yes i agree that Draymond Green has gotten better and is an All Start this year but he was guarding tristan Thompson not Kevin Love. Don't give those dudes a pass for beating our second string plus Lebron.

I'm asking do they even play the same with Kyrie and Love in the lineup.
 
No....



I'd agree with this though.



...

Look, Los, I'm with you on the general idea.. it's worth exploring. I'm just not as sold on you with respect to how well it would work out. I'd do it only because I think you're buying low and selling high (Tristan/Moz +Shump +low picks for Howard). Howard has tremendous value, and in a winning environment over a season, could potentially be parlayed into a more useful piece (a wing, LBJ replacement).


Actually I was looking at the salaries and you wouldn't have to include Shump in that deal. Tristan's new salary plus Moz and fillers can get you just Dwight. But if you include Shump and Moz with Tristan it could net you Dwight and Ariza :love::love::love:
 

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