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Hue vs. Sashi: You must keep 1

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You must / can only keep 1:

  • Hue Jackson and Coaching Staff

    Votes: 7 15.2%
  • Sashi Brown and Front Office

    Votes: 39 84.8%

  • Total voters
    46
Hey I get it, if they FO stays and the HC is the one to get the axe, then you go out and find a coach who appreciates the addition of analytics and what the Browns are trying to build. If you can find a guy that is younger and understands their process and how to work his team around that, you're on to something.

I would love that, but I do fear that the football community would look down on the Browns if they keep the FO and axe the traditional football guy. Remember, there were a lot of hit pieces out by media guys like Peter King, Bill Polian and JLC when the Browns built this FO. Agents and other exces did not take kindly to the outsiders trying to make it.

I fear the Browns would be blacklisted from quality coaches because of what our front office might be. In which case, it would be best to can them both and start over.

I would love to add John Dorsey to this team. He is a good mix of traditional and analytic. He would instantly give the organization credibility and a real chance at a Grand Slam draft in 2018.
 
The elite talent comes in the first two rounds and that is where the Browns have had their misses. They've gotten solid players in the 3rd and later, as you just pointed out, but those guys aren't elite.

Coleman, Ogbah, Garrett, Peppers, Njoku, and Kizer are their first two round picks.

Garrett, Ogbah and Njoku have all flashed as elite at some point. And before you scoff at Ogbah, the dude has been probably a top 5 edge run stopper. He has been EXCELLENT this year without getting the production or flashy stats.

50% in the 1st round is exactly where you want to be.
 
The Browns are going to be an easy target because of the analytics emphasis (despite most teams also using them). They unfortunately are stuck with proving a proof of concept to a bunch of jackholes who don't understand disruptors in the industry. If they get the time to prove they are on to something, I think you're going to see the analytical community explode quickly. If they can prove this works, I wouldn't be surprised if you see some big name fantasy analysts be thrown into scouting rooms and process improvement. This is obviously a huge if, but if they get the time, find a QB and see that it works, teams will adjust and they will be fighting to adjust overnight.
 
I agree with this, but when that 25% is coming in the first couple rounds, it is kind of brutal. It'd be one thing if they were finding 1st round talent in day three to make up for it, but they haven't.

They have done a great job finding solid players in those middle rounds for sure though...but that's not enough to turn around a team that is devoid of elite talent.

Who did they miss on early?

4 first rounders, Coleman is not great to me, but no way do i think Peppers is a bust yet and Myles and Njoku look great.
75%

2nd rounders, Ogbah and Kizer. Kizer has looked, meh, but Ogbah solid, so 50%

3rd rounders, Column, starting, good draft, Schobert, wow, nice, and might not agree but Kessler looks like a solid backup, what you expect from 3rd round QB, and Ogunjobi, has been in the rotation of our most loaded position and looked decent. so either 100% or 75% there.

You want him to hit every pick in the first 3 rounds, and that is just not realistic. We really have had 2 good drafts the last 2 years except WR and QB which is why it seems we havent.
 
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Coleman, Ogbah, Garrett, Peppers, Njoku, and Kizer are their first two round picks.

Garrett, Ogbah and Njoku have all flashed as elite at some point. And before you scoff at Ogbah, the dude has been probably a top 5 edge run stopper. He has been EXCELLENT this year without getting the production or flashy stats.

50% in the 1st round is exactly where you want to be.

You want him to hit every pick in the first 3 rounds, and that is just not realistic. We really have had 2 god drafts the last 2 years except WR and QB which is why it seems we havent.
Are we really giving the FO credit for Garrett? :chuckle:

You guys make good points though; overall the drafts have been good, just the couple bad misses, at crucial positions, make it seem like they haven't. I've made my opinions on that pretty clear :chuckle:

Hopefully they hit on those crucial positions this time around.
 
Are we really giving the FO credit for Garrett? :chuckle:

You guys make good points though; overall the drafts have been good, just the couple bad misses, at crucial positions, make it seem like they haven't. I've made my opinions on that pretty clear :chuckle:

Hopefully they hit on those crucial positions this time around.
Why wouldn't you? They made the pick after all.
 
And they were open yesterday. They were open. That was a winnable game with better QB play.
I'm never certain how open these guys really are. Louis did have a spectacular drop late in the game. They're scrubs. They can't get no love from me. Treggs who wandered onto the team 2 weeks ago is not getting the same number of snaps but seems to make an impact when he's in.

Took a random look at pass targets and snap counts. Corey Coleman when he was healthy was targeted on 14% of his offensive snaps, to lead all receivers aside from Duke Johnson (15%) Both Treggs and Kasen Williams are targeted on 14%, but given their low snap counts and being in on mostly passing downs, that may be inflated. Louis, Devalve and Njoku are targeted on 12% of their snaps. Britt and Coates at 11%, and Higgins 10%.

For comparison's sake, AJ Green is targeted on 19% of his snaps, Antonio Brown is at 23%.





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I mean, we've had front offices here before that has taken Tim Couch, Courtney Brown, Gerrard Warren, and Braylon Edwards in the top 3.

So yeah, I'm going to give them the credit for being disciplined and taking the best guy.
 
I'm never certain how open these guys really are. Louis did have a spectacular drop late in the game. They're scrubs. They can't get no love from me. Treggs who wandered onto the team 2 weeks ago is not getting the same number of snaps but seems to make an impact when he's in.

Took a random look at pass targets and snap counts. Corey Coleman when he was healthy was targeted on 14% of his offensive snaps, to lead all receivers aside from Duke Johnson (15%) Both Treggs and Kasen Williams are targeted on 14%, but given their low snap counts and being in on mostly passing downs, that may be inflated. Louis, Devalve and Njoku are targeted on 12% of their snaps. Britt and Coates at 11%, and Higgins 10%.

For comparison's sake, AJ Green is targeted on 19% of his snaps, Antonio Brown is at 23%.





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Keep in mind that both AJ Green and Antonio Brown have public; complained about how much they have been targeted this year though.
 
Keep in mind that both AJ Green and Antonio Brown have public; complained about how much they have been targeted this year though.

LOL Brown has 13 more targets than anyone in the league.

More names:

Jarvis Landry 24% targets/snap
Keenan Allen 21%
Dez Bryant 20%
Hopkins 18%
Larry Fitzgerald, Amari Cooper, Davante Adams 16%

Point is that Coleman still hadn't emerged as a top target. He's just in his 2nd year but ODB, Mike Adams were recent picks, undisputed #1s, with 16-17% targets in year 2.

Picking him was not a mistake. Virtually every other receiver getting 1st round consideration that draft has been worse ND as I pointed out very few players selected after him have been particularly good. They got a #2 wide receiver at #15 overall. That's fine. Not a hit. Not a miss.
 
Bottom line, this team needs playmakers. Offensively, we have none, and it's not even close. Maybe you can say Duke is a half playmaker, but he's easily bottled up. Guy only had 1 carry forever yesterday. We need a #1 option, #2 option, and a #3 option.

I fully expect these clowns to get that all in one draft. We must address our offense and secondary collectively. Njoku can be a 3rd option, but we need freaks outside. In a perfect world we'd like a big possession WR1 and a lightning fast WR2 like a Tyreek Hill, is that available for us with all these picks?

I'm willing to rock with Kizer to see him play with NFL WRs, not the shit we have now.
 
LOL Brown has 13 more targets than anyone in the league.

More names:

Jarvis Landry 24% targets/snap
Keenan Allen 21%
Dez Bryant 20%
Hopkins 18%
Larry Fitzgerald, Amari Cooper, Davante Adams 16%

Point is that Coleman still hadn't emerged as a top target. He's just in his 2nd year but ODB, Mike Adams were recent picks, undisputed #1s, with 16-17% targets in year 2.

Picking him was not a mistake. Virtually every other receiver getting 1st round consideration that draft has been worse ND as I pointed out very few players selected after him have been particularly good. They got a #2 wide receiver at #15 overall. That's fine. Not a hit. Not a miss.

Lol dude I'm agreeing with you. I like the Coleman pick. i was just saying that AJ Green complained about his targets and rightfully so. They increased when they fired their OC. Antonio Brown was getting his usual share of targets but he complained about getting more lol.
 
Are we really giving the FO credit for Garrett? :chuckle:

You guys make good points though; overall the drafts have been good, just the couple bad misses, at crucial positions, make it seem like they haven't. I've made my opinions on that pretty clear :chuckle:

Hopefully they hit on those crucial positions this time around.

No, i am not giving the FO credit for Myles, i did make a comment on that, but atleast they didnt get cute with the pick.
 
No, i am not giving the FO credit for Myles, i did make a comment on that, but atleast they didnt get cute with the pick.

I understand where both of you come from there, but everyone woulda killed them for not taking Myles. That's a no-win scenario at it's best.

Like, we can't pull the Myles "outlier" from the sample, then lament missed late rounders as if they're the nail-in-the-coffin.
 

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