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2017-2018 Boston Celtics: No Irving! No Hayward! No Brooklyn Pick!

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Regrade the finalized trade

  • A+

    Votes: 20 8.0%
  • A

    Votes: 70 27.9%
  • B

    Votes: 74 29.5%
  • C

    Votes: 39 15.5%
  • D

    Votes: 18 7.2%
  • F

    Votes: 30 12.0%

  • Total voters
    251
For the record, what he said wasn't wrong. He just is using a click-bait headline, oh gee, ESPN has never been guilty of that?

But it is true. Kyrie is not as good defensively, at least by the numbers, than the guys he mention.

Now, does that mean I think he's not elite? No. I don't qualify Harden and Curry as good defenders either.

And I think GS does a better job hiding Curry.
 
It was actually "legal", but point made.


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Review #GSWatCLE, 13.5 of Q4: Curry substitution was permissible due to 24-second clock violation.
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It's funny. The same could be said about that two minute report assessing LeBron with a technical for hanging on the rim. The Warriors called a full timeout after the play, which is why LeBron shot the free throw after Golden State's awarded timeout. LeBron was hanging on the rim because the game had stopped. The DURING THE GAME prerequisite the technical requires didn't exist. The in-game refs agreed.
 
Well considering his verdict is literally that Kyrie is not an elite overall player I would say he is wrong

I'm saying he's arguing that he's not as good of a defender, by the numbers. That's not wrong, man.

He uses a click-bait headline and that's done on purpose. How else do you think people read this trash? Because they just love ESPN and what they have to say?

His argument meaning he's not elite, because of that, is wrong. Whether he actually feels that way, or is trying to get more subscribers, I don't know.

Honestly, I really don't even care. ESPN loves doing this.
 
What happened to the guy we had for a week that was making plays for other guys and kicking out to shooters?

Still there, guys haven't been making shots. Notice LeBron's assists have been nearly identically low lately, too? Is he a bad playmaker now? Our offense has been stale, we've also been turning the ball over a lot.
 
I'm saying he's arguing that he's not as good of a defender, by the numbers. That's not wrong, man.

He uses a click-bait headline and that's done on purpose. How else do you think people read this trash? Because they just love ESPN and what they have to say?

His argument meaning he's not elite, because of that, is wrong. Whether he actually feels that way, or is trying to get more subscribers, I don't know.

Honestly, I really don't even care. ESPN loves doing this.

Godfather, as @jking948 points out, his argument is that Kyrie Irving is not elite because of his RPM.

What he doesn't do, for one second, is analyze the calculation to see why Irving's RPM is not in the top-tier.

He doesn't do this because he's fucking lazy or doesn't care, or as @The Wizard of Moz said, it's simply confirmation bias.
 
Godfather, as @jking948 points out, his argument is that Kyrie Irving is not elite because of his RPM.

What he doesn't do, for one second, is analyze the calculation to see why Irving's RPM is not in the top-tier.

He doesn't do this because he's fucking lazy or doesn't care, or as @The Wizard of Moz said, it's simply confirmation bias.

Honestly. I am not even sure he really believes he's not elite. ESPN is infamous for just being controversial. With viewership down, and the fact they had to cut a lot of employees recently.

I expect a lot more click-bait articles like this to come crawling out of the woodshed.

Of course, obviously he has to back it with some facts, no matter how skewed they are.

But the only fact that matters, is if Kyrie's lack of defense is such a negative to his team, then how are we defending champs?

Kyrie's RPM is lower than the elite guards. Conclusion, he's not elite. Is it lazy? Yes.. Is it done on purpose? I wouldn't be surprised if it was.

As long as people are talking about this, and choosing to subscribe, then he wins.

Regardless how lousy the actual article is.

This is the same network that employed Skip Balyess, on the sole fact he was great at trolling, not actually knowing a damn thing about sports. But he got viewership.

I don't think ESPN has ever cared about being correct or intellectual. That's why half their experts are journalists, and not former players. That right there tells what they are.
 
Honestly. I am not even sure he really believes he's not elite. ESPN is infamous for just being controversial. With viewership down, and the fact they had to cut a lot of employees recently.

Like these talk shows Skip & Smith, now Skip & shannon and smith & max something something. I'm not watching this very often so I can be wrong but I don't remember episode when they are agree with each other. It's like fucking script, for example
Skip: heyy Shannon I will say that LeBron is not the best player in the word and you have to say otherwise.
Shannon: Ok Skip, my god.
Viewers and clicks, it's all about.
 
His real argument is that he doesn't think he's as good as players like Curry, Harden, Paul, and Westbrook.

Is he wrong in that? No, probably not. I think most of us have been in agreement. He's not yet there.

That's the real conclusion, if any. But he uses the words "overrated" and "not-elite" to make it seem more edgy.

First of all, how the hell is Kyrie Irving "overrated" when I don't think I've heard anyone proclaim he's as good, or better than any of those players. So that makes him overrated? Please...

So the real conclusion means he's not as good? Notice he doesn't put in Lowry, Lillard, or anyone else that's been more comparable to Kyrie? Nope, because then it'd look silly. Especially Lillard given he's been atrocious defensively in all ways, worse than Kyrie.

See, he's just trying to throw in shock value with those words. I didn't read the entire article, I don't have ESPN insider and don't care to ever get it.

So he's saying, real conclusion, Kyrie is not yet as good as those 4 point guards. Well, one point guard is a two-time MVP, the other two are in the top-2 for MVP at the moment. Then Paul is one of the greatest pure point guards ever!

Gee, at 24, how disappointing Kyrie is not yet "there" like those four.

It's pretty pathetic honestly what he's trying do.
 
My thing with those numbers is pretty simple.

Is there that big a difference between Kyrie's ranking of 402 and somebody else ranking around 200-250? If Kyrie ranks there, do we even have the discussion?

The eye test tells me that Kyrie isn't much worse defensively than someone like Steph or Lillard, so touting percentiles is embellishment.
 
My thing with those numbers is pretty simple.

Is there that big a difference between Kyrie's ranking of 402 and somebody else ranking around 200-250? If Kyrie ranks there, do we even have the discussion?

The eye test tells me that Kyrie isn't much worse defensively than someone like Steph or Lillard, so touting percentiles is embellishment.

Steph gets a lot of steals, and that does factor into RPM. And Lillard is worse than Kyrie.

I think actual on-ball defender, Kyrie is a little better. Steph is great/elite at deflecting passes and grabbing steals. His actual on-ball defense, is pretty bad. Which is why they often hide him on the poor offensive player.
 
His real argument is that he doesn't think he's as good as players like Curry, Harden, Paul, and Westbrook.

Is he wrong in that? No, probably not. I think most of us have been in agreement. He's not yet there.

Kyrie's numbers through his first six seasons have comparable categories to those four through their respective first six seasons, including the post-season. He was also younger.

However, Kyrie's biggest impact is the graph posted earlier. None of them touch him.

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