Open Discussion (Cavs + related issues)

[InBoobieWeTrust]

I think this loss tonight makes us more likely to make a move. Silver lining, maybe?

We know how Dan can get angry really quickly. I didn't think we'd use what's left of the TPE without being able to dump Birdman....but at some point LeBron and Ty calling for extra depth may keep him up a little longer at night.

 

[K1rieIrving>AllOtherPG's]

I think this loss tonight makes us more likely to make a move. Silver lining, maybe?

We know how Dan can get angry really quickly. I didn't think we'd use what's left of the TPE without being able to dump Birdman....but at some point LeBron and Ty calling for extra depth may keep him up a little longer at night.

I hope so, We need a big to clog up the paint and another playmaker, like yesterday.
oh yea and we also need a wing defender like P.J tucker, fuck we sure do need a lot of stuff lmao

Here's hoping for another David Griffin mid season special, with some extra Bogut on it

 

[TheProdigy]

I hate how every little thing is chalked up to it being the regular season, the team isn't playing serious, they know how to turn it on, etc. I mean is it not okay to acknowledge they've been playing like crap for a while now and only winning against garbage teams.

1) Bench is not that good
2) Jefferson seems to have lost a step
3) Frye steps on the floor and any lead we have evaporates
4) Shump is playing well right now but is it because he's starting? When JR gets back he's going to go back to the bench where he might have another slump
5) Fast break defense has to be the worst in the league from what I see
6) K Love is always injuring his back, is this latest seemingly back injury something he suffered recently? Or are back injuries something he'll have to deal with forever
7) Lue doesn't seem to know how to deal with rotations, I guess you can chalk this up to experimenting or not having JR which throws it out of whack
8) LBJ's minutes are way up, I guess if the plan is getting total minutes down instead of MPG then he'll be taking games off later. Which means more losses.

Call me pessimistic if you want but it doesn't look good at the moment. It's still January and there's close to 3 more months to improve so I guess things can only go up from here....right?

 

[3 Ball...GOT IT]

I know that this is likely a result of the Cavs' regular season laziness, but the transition defense is getting out of control. LeBron may be the worst transition defender in the league during the regular season... seriously. Love and Kyrie have been awful in that regard as well.

Cavs have given up 14.1 transition PPG to opponents this season - 22nd in the league. Teams behind the Cavs: NYK, DEN, LAC, SAC, BKN, LAL, PHI, and PHX. Pretty much the bottom of the league.

As comparison, the previous seasons for the Cavs:
2015-16: 11.2 transition PPG (6th in NBA)
2014-15: 11.8 transition PPG (8th in NBA)

Tonight against the Spurs, they gave up 25 fast break points. And it's not in large part due to the Cavs' 18 TOs, as the majority of those resulted in dead ball situations.

Although this is sure to at least improve in the playoffs (Cavs allowed 8.4 transition PPG in the 15-16 postseason), it's infuriating to watch guys not even attempt to run back on defense not just on TOs, but on misses too.

It doesn't help that LeBron's got a career high TO% rate as well, 16.1% compared to his 12.7% career average. Also useful to note his usage rate this season is below his career rate.

It's just a matter of effort. They don't have to be top ten in the league during the regular season, but being in the same conversation as those other teams mentioned is a joke.

 

[Otsego Mar]

Please. Calm the asses down.

Good game tonight - couldn't buy a bucket when we needed it.

We'll upgrade the roster and we'll see these guys in June.

 

[nobody85]

The only penalty is that the team has to split the difference with the players on the roster. I can't think of any reason why it would be better to bring in someone who will never play.

Because of how team salary is calculated and how player contracts are paid.

For both luxury tax and salary floor purposes, team salary is calculated based on the value of contracts on the last day of the team's season. That leaves some room for a loophole where a team acquires a player (Mo Williams) with a $2.2M contract but ~50% of it has already been paid by the previous teams. So the Sixers have a contract which counts for $2.2M against their team salary, but only need to pay the remaining $1M or so, giving a savings of ~$1M versus just meeting the salary floor by distributing extra money to their players.

I believe the Sixers were the first team to exploit this loophole under Hinkie, but other teams have done it as well - for some reason I'm thinking the Magic may have 2 years ago. It's a nice bit of salary cap magic.

 

[JMoneyYourHoney]

It doesn't help that LeBron's got a career high TO% rate as well, 16.1% compared to his 12.7% career average. Also useful to note his usage rate this season is below his career rate.

The elephant in the room is that LeBron's days as a perimeter player are numbered. Him playing as a 3 is not acting in his or the team's best interest.

 

[cavsfever]

The elephant in the room is that LeBron's days as a perimeter player are numbered. Him playing as a 3 is not acting in his or the team's best interest.

But we don't have anyone else to step into that SF role, and have to find minutes for KLove at the 4 since that is his only position really. (TT is a natural 4 as well although we are pressing him into service at the 5). We had a poorly constructed roster this season where absolutely everything needed to go right and we depended heavily on Lebron being able to defend both on the perimeter and the inside. With older players self-destructing and declining and Felder/McRae not looking usable against good teams everything is not going right.

 

[Rich]

But we don't have anyone else to step into that SF role, and have to find minutes for KLove at the 4 since that is his only position really. (TT is a natural 4 as well although we are pressing him into service at the 5). We had a poorly constructed roster this season where absolutely everything needed to go right and we depended heavily on Lebron being able to defend both on the perimeter and the inside. With older players self-destructing and declining and Felder/McRae not looking usable against good teams everything is not going right.

Some of you guys use terms way to loosely. If this roster is poor, which are not?

 

[JMoneyYourHoney]

But we don't have anyone else to step into that SF role, and have to find minutes for KLove at the 4 since that is his only position really. (TT is a natural 4 as well although we are pressing him into service at the 5). We had a poorly constructed roster this season where absolutely everything needed to go right and we depended heavily on Lebron being able to defend both on the perimeter and the inside. With older players self-destructing and declining and Felder/McRae not looking usable against good teams everything is not going right.

I don't want to take this thread into dangerous territory, but we're not maximizing LeBron's effectiveness or this team if he doesn't make the full-time move to the 4. And I'll leave it at that.

 

[Rich]

I don't want to take this thread into dangerous territory, but we're not maximizing LeBron's effectiveness or this team if he doesn't make the full-time move to the 4. And I'll leave it at that.

Unless LeBron wants to play the four this is moot. And while he may be better there, this team isn't. We do not have a starting caliber SF if he switches. Now, you go out this summer, get LBJ to buy in to playing the four, and then throw the kitchen sink at the Bulls for Jimmy Butler, then we can talk.

 

[JMoneyYourHoney]

Unless LeBron wants to play the four this is moot. And while he may be better there, this team isn't. We do not have a starting caliber SF if he switches. Now, you go out this summer, get LBJ to buy in to playing the four, and then throw the kitchen sink at the Bulls for Jimmy Butler, then we can talk.

That's what I was getting at...

 

[pinoycavsfan]

LBJ doesnt need to be a 4 exclusively.. I think he just needs to lessen possessions with him having the ball at the top of the key.. He can play the 4 on offense with love spacing the floor.. Lbj needs to give kyrie more play making responsibilities.. Having a 2nd pg would also help.. I hate our walk it up offense and pick n roll with a single pass then shoot.. I hope the cavs maximize their offensive capabilities and run.. Increase pace and improve ball movement.. We are not a good defensive team but i believe we can be one of the best offense if we ran and make lbj the roll man being a 2ndary playmaker..

Btw, kyrie played a relatively controlled game.. Hope he strings consistent games with efficiency and high assists.. More of kyrie-lbj pnr please.. I hate seeing tt trying to finish inside or missing open shooters..

 

[Rich]

Hey look, if the Cavs can convince the Bulls to make a swap centered around Love for Butler, I'm all for it. But, we are a long way away from that.

 

[godfather]

LeBron has taken a hit defensively this year. He's still really good, but not what he once was. That might be part of the defensive woes, given his age, he can no longer cover so many of the holes we always had.

I'm a little puzzled to how bad we are on that end, but that could be part of it.

A lot of people want to point to the center position. And sure, I'd like a more viable option but Tristan hasn't been that bad defensively.

Sure, Kyrie isn't very good but this is nothing new.

The Cavs defensive woes is at an all-time high.

At first I liked the Korver trade, but now I'm starting to think it could be a waste if can't make any other moves. Sure, I'm not against a guy that can shoot like he can, but I don't feel our offense is, or will be a problem going forward.

We really aren't a very good defensive team and we got to fix that. We can't win a title defending the way we have thus far. This game meant something to the Cavs. They respect the Spurs. They were God awful defensively tonight. They were lottery worthy on that end.

Even when the game got close, and it mattered, they couldn't defend worth a damn at all. That to me is so troubling.

The Cavs last year had problems playing defensive consistently in the regular season, but they would defend in money time. We couldn't even do that.