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Reallistically- How long before will it take to be a top 2-3 seed in the East?

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RuanuLaw said:
Love the idea, but help me understand these 2 issues:

1-Did Kyrie want to leave Cleveland because he hated the ENTIRE org, including Dan? Or did he simply leave cause of LeBron? What makes you think there is even a shred of hope that he would be OK coming back here?

2-What happens with Sexton if he actually pans out? If he starts scoring 20+ppg, you are not asking him to come off the bench because of Kyrie. That seems like the quickest way to alienate Sexton.
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He took some shots at CLE if you remember. He said that Boston was a real sports town and liked the fact that there were things to do after midnight. I know his father wanted him out of CLE. Always knew he wanted to play with Butler and always thought it would be NY.
 
gourimoko said:
I have to honestly ask, you'll pass for what .. exactly? Like, who do you think would come down the line, years down the line to the Cavs? And with the new flattened out lottery odds, whose to say we even get a #1 pick over the next 5 years?

Guys, next years draft doesn't look so great; and we were a lottery team for years and completely failed to scout talent.. We are now very much in the post-LeBron era.

If we can get a guy like Irving to sign a max deal, then I think we should do it. I don't think it'd be reasonable to prefer tanking versus getting a legit franchise player.

But I could be wrong. Definitely open to discussion about it?
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Look if in the next two years an all Star is willing to come to cle we should jump on it ASAP. But I don’t think it will be Irving. Honestly i doubt we get an all star in free agency, but maybe a solid starter.

We need to add talent in any way, draft trades. And in the right stitation a few feee agents here and there. But we won’t build this through free agents. Although the more Crocker park expands the bigger the fish lol jk
 
My biggest concern is that I don’t think we have the right people in the front office for long term success...


Thoughts???
 
It’ll take 2-3 years to get back to the 8 seed. So probably 4-6 years to get back to the top of the conference once those high lottery players start to come into their own. IF we hit on them.
 
FrontPageNews said:
It’ll take 2-3 years to get back to the 8 seed. So probably 4-6 years to get back to the top of the conference once those high lottery players start to come into their own. IF we hit on them.
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The if is gigantic. Let’s hope Sexton is step one.
 
ajz20 said:
My biggest concern is that I don’t think we have the right people in the front office for long term success...


Thoughts???
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Well if you’re are counting Gilbert, then yeah, clearly there is some red flags in our front office.. however with Koby, I think he’s still to unknown to judge yet. It seems like Cedi was his pick/guy, so that’s a plus and obviously, Sexton is to be determined.

But as much as I love Dan’ wallet and spending, he’s my biggest red flag. Until he gives our front office their own space to operate and allow them to stay longer then their first contact, I don’t see how we have true long term success.
 
falcon2294 said:
Well if you’re are counting Gilbert, then yeah, clearly there is some red flags in our front office.. however with Koby, I think he’s still to unknown to judge yet. It seems like Cedi was his pick/guy, so that’s a plus and obviously, Sexton is to be determined.

But as much as I love Dan’ wallet and spending, he’s my biggest red flag. Until he gives our front office their own space to operate and allow them to stay longer then their first contact, I don’t see how we have true long term success.
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I think he's not as hands on as people say. He's far from perfect but after the letter everything was blamed on Dan when draft picks busted.

Everyone said he was making the picks but aside from Tristan he listened to the FO on Kyrie he himself wanted Derrick Williams. In 2012 Scott wanted Dion. In 2013 Brown wanted Bennett. And from what I've seen someone mention Sexton was Lues guy. He does listen to other people's input but the media spins everything as his fault cause of "The Letter".

I'm not saying hes completely hands off but I don't think he's as hands on as the media portrays him to be. He just hires bad coaches who make bad suggestions. Scott saw himself in Dion so he wanted him and Bennett had some kind of connection to Mike Brown. I think its wrong to blame the draft mistakes all on Dan when he actually listened to his basketball people. I'm just hoping Lue is the first coach to get the pick right since Scott and Brown failed miserably with their hand picked guys.
 
NMCav said:
I think he's not as hands on as people say. He's far from perfect but after the letter everything was blamed on Dan when draft picks busted.

Everyone said he was making the picks but aside from Tristan he listened to the FO on Kyrie he himself wanted Derrick Williams. In 2012 Scott wanted Dion. In 2013 Brown wanted Bennett. And from what I've seen someone mention Sexton was Lues guy. He does listen to other people's input but the media spins everything as his fault cause of "The Letter".

I'm not saying hes completely hands off but I don't think he's as hands on as the media portrays him to be. He just hires bad coaches who make bad suggestions. Scott saw himself in Dion so he wanted him and Bennett had some kind of connection to Mike Brown. I think its wrong to blame the draft mistakes all on Dan when he actually listened to his basketball people. I'm just hoping Lue is the first coach to get the pick right since Scott and Brown failed miserably with their hand picked guys.
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There’s definitely some truth to what you say. And if anything, I believe he wanted Oladip instead of Bennett. I thought I heard he’s a huge fan of Sexton and where that’s more of his pick.

I guess to me, my biggest issue is the coach and GM carousel we’be had since Lebron first left. The best run organizations all have one thing in common; stability in the front office. We’ll only be stable if Dan chooses to be.
 
falcon2294 said:
There’s definitely some truth to what you say. And if anything, I believe he wanted Oladip instead of Bennett. I thought I heard he’s a huge fan of Sexton and where that’s more of his pick.

I guess to me, my biggest issue is the coach and GM carousel we’be had since Lebron first left. The best run organizations all have one thing in common; stability in the front office. We’ll only be stable if Dan chooses to be.
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I've mentioned in the past my main issue with Dan Gilbert is his short leashes. We've had what 4 GMs since 2010? That's not good.

As for Sexton I've heard he was a Lue guy. Especially since Lue has that connection to Averey Johnson he played for him in Dallas. But Dan loves every pick.

At the end of the Day Dan is a superfan. Albeit one that owns the team and likes to fire GMs at an alarming rate. I hope Koby ends up being the GM we keep assuming of course Sexton shows well and he makes better trades. Dan would be treated like Mark Cuban if not for "The Letter" and the fact that he fires GMs every 2 years.
 
Pjlea28 said:
He took some shots at CLE if you remember. He said that Boston was a real sports town and liked the fact that there were things to do after midnight. I know his father wanted him out of CLE. Always knew he wanted to play with Butler and always thought it would be NY.
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I don't think the Cavs would be the #1 choice .. but New York is a truly awful franchise for one, secondly they have zero in the way of assets, third, they don't actually have cap space for both Irving and Butler - nor do they have assets to trade for either.

Irving's reasons for wanting out were complex, but largely centered around (1) the organization wanting to trade him, openly; (2) LeBron James overshadowing him.

Now, James is gone, for good; so there's no one to overshadow him here.

Secondly, he's had an opportunity to play in a big market, and apparently he's not thrilled about it. So maybe he realizes fans in Boston and New York won't really give a shit about him -- which is true?

Third, James going to Los Angeles really changes things around the league. He's out West .. the East is wide open now.

Fourth, leaving the Celtics, Kyrie could really put together a contender if he picks the right team.

Fifth, only the Nets and Cavs and a small handful of others are likely to have space for two max contracts.

People have been talking about the Knicks and Lakers landing big-time free agents for years; and usually (until very recently at least), they strike out.

I dunno.. I can't see the Cavs not getting a meeting with Kyrie, July 1-2, with a max offer for both him and Jimmy Butler, and him/them him not taking that seriously. If we have assets to build around the two of them, I think we could make legitimate offer.

And if he declines, well.. then you move on.. There's going to be a shit ton of max contract free agents next summer. Two of them might want to play together.
 
I heard that the front office wanted to trade down in 2013 but Dan told them to do their job and find the winner. Front office felt trapped and Dan blamed his front office for failing. I never heard that Mike Brown wanted Bennett, but I wasn’t there so I don’t know. Seeing as that Mike Brown was only on the payroll for a couple weeks before that draft, it seems really unlikely that he was a driving force behind the Cavs on draft night.

Cavs will pretent to make a go of it to start the season next fall and act like they want to keep their vets, but the ones on the roster after the trade dead line are probably going to be sitting a lot. Fans will be angry bfore then becuase the team isn’t playing the young guys enough. They’ll be angry afterwards because the team is losing. Tanking is no fun.

Cavs are 4 years from competing again if they liquidate the vets for good value, hit on talent in the next two drafts, keepa stable front office & coaching staff, and some of the young guys on the roster today work out as solid role players. Takes some luck and opportunism. Also helps if Prokhorov is riding the Nets GM to win now at all costs.
 
Soooo many variables to consider:
1) Is Lue a good coach for youth? If not, 6-10 years allowing a new coach to set up a new system with players he wants.
2) Do we hit draft picks? Even if we do and they have mature and get playoff experience. 5-7 years.
3) Sign a go to star when we have a good enough team. 5-7 years.
4) Management doesn’t panic and change variable #1 every 2 years. If they do, never.

In the end, 6 years and we are on top or 10-15 years based on Cavs history..
 
First step should he making sure we have a shot at one of the boys from Duke or see how Bol Bol develops then go from there... this talk of signing Kyrie and Butler is great and all but it's probably unrealistic... But could you imagine having 2 potential studs to go with them or 1 and a great trade piece in Sexton?..

For now though we just need to make sure we have a top 3 pick next year
 
Barring free agents coming here to play (highly doubt it), then at least 5 years. Sexton would have to become a +3 to +4 player and Cedi +2 to +4. Both becoming those types of players seems highly unlikely to me, so we’re going to have to tank these next two years and get lucky in the draft.

One thing is for sure: it’s very, very difficult to forecast what the landscape of an entire conference will be like two, three years down the road. Look through this thread—people were talking about the Nets (after the trade that built the current Celtics), Pacers, Bulls. None of those teams was around in challenging form after 2014. Things will change, players will get injured, players will fall off cliffs, players will get tired of playing with one another.

I guess another thing that’s for certain is that it’s neaely impossible to have sustained excellence atop a conference unless you have a generational player.

Basically every team over the past 40 years to have 3 consecurive top 3 conference finishes has had a generational player except for Detroit in the late ‘80s and mid 2000s and Toronto the last three years).

There was quite a bit of optimism in this thread even though historical precedent would suggest a more somber outlook. It’s gonna be tough.
 
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