The 2020 Cleveland Indians

[Real Deal]

Bobby Bradley isn't apart of the 2020 plans? Rather have him slotted in there somewhere vs a dumpster diving attempt from the Dolan's.

 

[Steve_424]

Bobby Bradley isn't apart of the 2020 plans? Rather have him slotted in there somewhere vs a dumpster diving attempt from the Dolan's.

They need to give him ML ABs this season and see what they have. I'd love for him to be DH moving forward. And if they don't like what they see, deal him this winter while he still has value.

 

[sportscoach]

@sportscoach in two posts you've said the Indians outfield is solid and then said you get that they're at the bottom of every statistical category.

Which one is it? Or do you consider being at the bottom to be "solid"?

Sorry would have responded earlier, but I had to work. It goes like this, have these guys produced any significant numbers in the pros? Honestly they have not. Do I feel like they will be a very good unit next season production wise overall? Yes I do. I feel potentially we have an extremely good OF going forward and they could become one of the better units in all of baseball.

 

[Cassity14]

Sorry would have responded earlier, but I had to work. It goes like this, have these guys produced any significant numbers in the pros? Honestly they have not. Do I feel like they will be a very good unit next season production wise overall? Yes I do. I feel potentially we have an extremely good OF going forward and they could become one of the better units in all of baseball.

And you feel this way based on....what exactly?

 

[sportscoach]

And you feel this way based on....what exactly?

Gut and potential, but that doesn't always seem to well liked by everyone on here. I mean physically these guys have all the tools, and defensively all of them are average to above average at very least. Naquin and Bauers in the OFs are the slow guys, and they have gotten over 15-20 SB in a season in the minors. Allen, Zimmer, Mercado all have stolen over 40 bases in a minor league season, and Luplow is considered as fast as those guys via statcast, he just doesn't have a base stealer mentality. Also Bauers, Luplow and Johnson would hit at least 20 HRs in a season if playing everyday, the rest outside of Allen, will hit at least 15 with everyday play. Projections and potential are all there, they just have to put it together. Will they ever put it together? We don't know, but is it possible out of those guys to get a really good if not great overall MLB OF Unit? Yes it is.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Gut and potential, but that doesn't always seem to well liked by everyone on here. I mean physically these guys have all the tools, and defensively all of them are average to above average at very least. Naquin and Bauers in the OFs are the slow guys, and they have gotten over 15-20 SB in a season in the minors. Allen, Zimmer, Mercado all have stolen over 40 bases in a minor league season, and Luplow is considered as fast as those guys via statcast, he just doesn't have a base stealer mentality. Also Bauers, Luplow and Johnson would hit at least 20 HRs in a season if playing everyday, the rest outside of Allen, will hit at least 15 with everyday play. Projections and potential are all there, they just have to put it together. Will they ever put it together? We don't know, but is it possible out of those guys to get a really good if not great overall MLB OF Unit? Yes it is.

Jordan Luplow is not as fast as Mercado and Zimmer.

I'm sure any metric--including Statcast--would agree with me.

If you want to counter, don't give me top speed. Give me time to cover a specific distance. Because, I'm pretty sure Derrick Henry had one of the top "top speeds" in the NFL last year according to Statcast, and nobody is confusing him for Tyreek Hill.

You're very, very high on all these guys.

 

[sportscoach]

Jordan Luplow is not as fast as Mercado and Zimmer.

I'm sure any metric--including Statcast--would agree with me.

If you want to counter, don't give me top speed. Give me time to cover a specific distance. Because, I'm pretty sure Derrick Henry had one of the top "top speeds" in the NFL last year according to Statcast, and nobody is confusing him for Tyreek Hill.

You're very, very high on all these guys.

Luplow, Jordan CLE RF 26 31 0 4.33 28.6

Leader is at 30.2, for sprint speed and average is 27. Luplow has always been about 28.6-28.7 and Mercado is at 29.

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/sprint_speed_leaderboard

I mean he isn't the fastest guy in the league, but he is up there. Mercado, Allen, Luplow, Zimmer etc are all 28-29+ range and a healthy Bauers and Naquin are all in the mid to upper 27s.

He also has a lot more power the other way than is given credit for. If he would use the whole park more he would actually have a better average and in the minors was always one that had a very high slugging percentage and a high amount of walks.

Yes I am higher on the OF crew than most, but we will have all the guys but one (Naquin) making league minimum and all going into their primes to prove they belong in the big leagues. I feel next season with those factors of being more experienced as a group and fighting for the big league spots, they will push each other, and become a really good group in the end.

 

[Urban]

Luplow's speed splits are more in line with Lindor and Ramirez, which is still solid, than Mercado and Zimmer.

 

[sportscoach]

Luplow's speed splits are more in line with Lindor and Ramirez, which is still solid, than Mercado and Zimmer.

That was kind of my point, he is a much faster runner/athlete than some of his other numbers will say and you have to remember certain numbers he will always be slower with since he is a RH bat when it comes to out of the box numbers, etc. Zimmers sprint speed is 29.4, Mercado is 29.0 and his is 28.6. He actually defensively ranged just as well metrics wise as Zimmer did in the OF going into this season and also he is one of the better LFs in baseball defensively if you look at his history overall on that side of the field.

Though is is getting into the nitty and gritty, my point is the fact on paper the potential for the unit is all there, just no one has proven anything yet. I think though after the ABs and experience of this season, we will end up with a solid/good unit in the OF in the end. The pitchers will always love this unit overall, just have to wait to see if the bats come around or not.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Luplow, Jordan CLE RF 26 31 0 4.33 28.6

Leader is at 30.2, for sprint speed and average is 27. Luplow has always been about 28.6-28.7 and Mercado is at 29.

https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/sprint_speed_leaderboard

I mean he isn't the fastest guy in the league, but he is up there. Mercado, Allen, Luplow, Zimmer etc are all 28-29+ range and a healthy Bauers and Naquin are all in the mid to upper 27s.

He also has a lot more power the other way than is given credit for. If he would use the whole park more he would actually have a better average and in the minors was always one that had a very high slugging percentage and a high amount of walks.

Yes I am higher on the OF crew than most, but we will have all the guys but one (Naquin) making league minimum and all going into their primes to prove they belong in the big leagues. I feel next season with those factors of being more experienced as a group and fighting for the big league spots, they will push each other, and become a really good group in the end.

Doesn't this just prove my point?

Luplow is not as fast as Mercado and Zimmer.

Even your cherry-picked stat doesn't back you up on this take. Which, by the way, is a really poor way to judge someone's speed in the outfield.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

That was kind of my point, he is a much faster runner/athlete than some of his other numbers will say and you have to remember certain numbers he will always be slower with since he is a RH bat when it comes to out of the box numbers, etc. Zimmers sprint speed is 29.4, Mercado is 29.0 and his is 28.6. He actually defensively ranged just as well metrics wise as Zimmer did in the OF going into this season and also he is one of the better LFs in baseball defensively if you look at his history overall on that side of the field.

Though is is getting into the nitty and gritty, my point is the fact on paper the potential for the unit is all there, just no one has proven anything yet. I think though after the ABs and experience of this season, we will end up with a solid/good unit in the OF in the end. The pitchers will always love this unit overall, just have to wait to see if the bats come around or not.

You don't understand the stat you're putting out there.

Since he is a Right-Handed bat, that gives him a longer distance from HP to 1B. This means a longer time to accelerate, which means his top sprint speed (measured over his fastest 1-second window according to your stat) should be HIGHER than a left-handed bat.

1) Stop using this stat to evaluate a player's speed in the outfield. It's best used to loosely define a player's speed on the basepath.
2) If you're going to bring it up, at least understand it. Don't say things that are blatantly false.

 

[Urban]

All in all, the sprint speed stat is mostly useless. By definition, it is speed measured as "runs of two bases or more on non-homers, excluding being a runner on second base when an extra base hit happens".

Not sure the benefit of comparing Luplow's corner OF defensive metrics to Zimmer's CF defensive metrics, or why Luplow should be penciled in for 20+ HR with regular playing time when he has a .390 OPS vs. RHP

 

[sportscoach]

Sometimes you guys nitpick way too much, I feel as a group these guys will be good for next season without a doubt. I shall leave it at that!

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Sometimes you guys nitpick way too much, I feel as a group these guys will be good for next season without a doubt. I shall leave it at that!

You make claims that are factually incorrect.

Someone corrects you.

You blame them emotionally.

Cool.

Also, "without a doubt"? Really?

 

[sportscoach]

You make claims that are factually incorrect.

Someone corrects you.

You blame them emotionally.

Cool.

Also, "without a doubt"? Really?

No matter what I say, if I say my gut/without evidence I get told I am always wrong since there is nothing to back it up, but all young players are without evidence until they actually play, so no matter what I say from here on out since I personally feel they will be, I will be wrong and incorrect.

I feel more ABs Luplow gets against RH pitchers the better he will get. In the minors he hit about .300 against RH pitchers and some seasons better against RHP than LHP so he will right the ship more ABs he gets that way.

Mercado looks like he has figured out himself as a hitter and since he has modified his swings a couple seasons back, looks like a solid everyday hitter. His fielding will get better as well the more he plays out there so the mistakes he made so far will be gone next season, since you have to remember he hasn't logged a ton of innings out there.

I say without a doubt since that is how I feel about this crew we have in the OF going forward. Baseball is a lot of analyzing the numbers nowadays, but sometimes guys are also just baseball players and will get it right. Cleveland wasn't the only team trying to get guys like Luplow and we tried to trade for Luplow last season like we did with Mercado, if I am reading all of the rumors and comments made by people correctly. We have a plus OF defensively, all can run well, so all we need is production at the plate from them, which I think will happen with more ABs and experience.