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Baker Mayfield: Fire The Cannons

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I'm not a Pats fan, lord knows, there's not a more annoying fan base than Boston. My dislike grows there most.

But I love they won last night for this reason alone. Waking up and reading the headline "Sorry, Steelers, you're not longer the greatest franchise in football" was worth it.

Fuck you Steelers! :chuckle:

They hate the Pats more than us. They really do, and this really bothers them.

But I hope the Pats reign is done. I'm just sick of seeing them. It's the Browns time.
 
Like, I'll entertain the argument that Tom Brady is a loathesome milque toast piece of shit asshole who should be spat upon were he ever to descend from his ivory tower in Boston to breathe in the toxic fumes of the unwashed rubes of Massachusetts.

He's still the GOAT. They're not mutually exclusive.
 
joma said:
I am absolutely impressed with Bradys career. Great player. Incredible longevity.

You cant tell me if Brees, Rodgers or Peyton had Bill Bellichik and a top 10 defense every year they wouldnt have won 6 titles or more.

If Brady wasnt drafted anywhere else, does he still win a title? I'm not sure he does. I'm more convinced that Bill would have won multiple superbowls without Brady. He won 11 games with Matt Cassel lmfao.



Its not a perfect comparison by any means but I feel like this argument will be comparable to Steph Curry in the GOAT conversation in a couple years when he has 10 titles.

In no way is Steph Curry close to being the GOAT. Its all about circumstance and "rings Erneh" culture. Not like I need to tell anyone here... but because he faced the Cavs JV team in 2015, and has since had 4 other top 20 players including the 2nd best player in the NBA, the media is about to put him in the top 10 all time discussion in a couple years simply because hes a media darling and plays on a stacked team. How many other situations does Curry win a championship in? Hes not dominant enough to lead a team on his own. Again, not a perfect comparison at all because football and basketball are so different, but the narrative that Brady is the GOAT is just so silly.
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I don't believe the rings make him the greatest.

The numbers do along with the rings.

His career passer rating is better than Manning's.

So, we're going to throw out all his numbers? You'd make a case if he was putting up Joe Flacco stats, and winning 6 championships.

And not putting up all-time great numbers, and winning 6 championships.
 
As far as the Super Bowl.

Most Yards Passed in a Game? Tom Brady - 505

Most Consecutive completions in a game? Tom Brady - 16

Most Attempts without an interception - Tom Brady, 48

Most Completions in a Game - Tom Brady, 43.


So, this absurd notion he's been Trent Dilfer, just along for the ride. And not just winning, but putting record breaking individual performance as well, is pretty silly.

Last night, he stunk. No argument there. But as you can see, he's not just been in the SB. He's basically owned it.
 
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OK, while we continue the off topic discussion of Brady, let me ask this question.

Better player for his position. Tom Brady or Jerry Rice?
 
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joma said:
I am absolutely impressed with Bradys career. Great player. Incredible longevity.

You cant tell me if Brees, Rodgers or Peyton had Bill Bellichik and a top 10 defense every year they wouldnt have won 6 titles or more.
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You can't even spell the coaches name correctly, and he's had a Top 10 defense in 6 years since 2001.

joma said:
If Brady wasnt drafted anywhere else, does he still win a title? I'm not sure he does. I'm more convinced that Bill would have won multiple superbowls without Brady. He won 11 games with Matt Cassel lmfao.
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They didn't even make the playoffs with Cassel, who wasn't even remotely close to Brady's numbers in terms of offensive efficiency.


joma said:
Its not a perfect comparison by any means but I feel like this argument will be comparable to Steph Curry in the GOAT conversation in a couple years when he has 10 titles.

In no way is Steph Curry close to being the GOAT. Its all about circumstance and "rings Erneh" culture. Not like I need to tell anyone here... but because he faced the Cavs JV team in 2015, and has since had 4 other top 20 players including the 2nd best player in the NBA, the media is about to put him in the top 10 all time discussion in a couple years simply because hes a media darling and plays on a stacked team. How many other situations does Curry win a championship in? Hes not dominant enough to lead a team on his own. Again, not a perfect comparison at all because football and basketball are so different, but the narrative that Brady is the GOAT is just so silly.
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The narrative that Brady isn't the GOAT because his coach is also great is silly.

The butthurt narratives of people who don't like him or whatever, its all meaningless to be honest.

There is nobody better.
 
I never understood the Cassel argument.

One guy throws for 50 TDs and posts a passer rating 117, went 18-1.

The other guy threw for 21 TDs and posted a passer rating of 89 and missed the playoffs.

Wasn't option A a thousand times better?

So they won 11 games when he filled in. So what?

And Tyrod Taylor led the Bills to the playoffs the previous year.

And guess what, he sucks too.
 
Jordan wasn't the greatest because Phil Jackson was also great, not the best argument to make.

But God bless em...they're trying. I'll never understand the level of vitriol towards a person they don't know to cause such irrational behavior and acting out, or denying the greatness of his career or place in history as the best ever.
 
AZ_ said:
They didn't even make the playoffs with Cassel
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While true, they also went 11-5 that year. Not only is that the same record NE had this year, but only 1 other team has gone 11-5 and missed the playoffs, and that was the 85 Broncos, but this was when only 5 team made the playoffs. They also had a better pt differential than 7 of the 12 playoff teams. They had the profile of a solid playoff team, but got extremely unlucky.
 
AZ_ said:
Jordan wasn't the greatest because Phil Jackson was also great, not the best argument to make.

But God bless em...they're trying. I'll never understand the level of vitriol towards a person they don't know to cause such irrational behavior and acting out, or denying the greatness of his career or place in history as the best ever.
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I have made the argument before on Jordan and Phil Jackson. It has some validity to it. The issue is with Brady there isn't a player in the history of the game that comes close to what he has done with 6. Bradshaw has 4 on the backs of his defense, and Montana was great, but a bit over rated at times to me with historic positional players and defensive talent at almost every position.

With Jordan you have Magic with 5, Kareem with 5 and more dominate in his early ring with the Bucks, and then Lebron with insane numbers and 9 appearances.

I just don't see any argument for Brady to not be the GOAT
 
col63onel said:
While true, they also went 11-5 that year. Not only is that the same record NE had this year, but only 1 other team has gone 11-5 and missed the playoffs, and that was the 85 Broncos, but this was when only 5 team made the playoffs. They also had a better pt differential than 7 of the 12 playoff teams. They had the profile of a solid playoff team, but got extremely unlucky.
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And they went 16-0 the year before, with basically the same team. And was a play away from being undefeated.

They lose Brady, and they miss the playoffs.

That should be a testament to how valuable he is. Not the other way around.

Hell, Blake Bortles led the Jags to 10 wins last year.

Tyrod Taylor, led the Bills to 9 wins and a playoff birth this year.

These guys aren't very good either.

Last time I checked, I don't think they played on arguably the greatest team ever, with the greatest coach ever.
 
AZ_ said:
You can't even spell the coaches name correctly, and he's had a Top 10 defense in 6 years since 2001.
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Just blatantly false, but I would love to know where you get your information.

Bradee and Bellichik have had a top 10 defense 14 times in 17 seasons.

Payton, Rogers and Breese have combined had a top 10 defense in 44 seasons.

Think about that.

AZ_ said:
They didn't even make the playoffs with Cassel, who wasn't even remotely close to Brady's numbers in terms of offensive efficiency.
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Congrats, you missed the point.

AZ_ said:
The narrative that Brady isn't the GOAT because his coach is also great is silly.

The butthurt narratives of people who don't like him or whatever, its all meaningless to be honest.

There is nobody better.
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We still using "butt hurt" in 2019?

I like Bradee. It has nothing to do with not liking him. Hes great. Hes not the GOAT. There are several better.

Fact is there are at least 3 other quarterbacks that have been more impressive and put up better statistics during Bradee's era. Those quarterbacks would have absolutely won if they played with Belllichik and those defenses. Its ridiculous to think otherwise.

Again, its hilarious we are even having this conversation a day after his defense held an unbelievable offense to 3 points. Bradee had nothing to do with that game last night yet all the conversation today is about how he is the GOAT. Its so fucking hilarious.

Getting through to to Brady GOAT people is about as easy as getting through to Kobe GOAT people. You guys can kick and scream all you want but at the end of the day those championships are a product of circumstance and those players never truly dominated the game as much as several as their peers did.
 
joma said:
Just blatantly false, but I would love to know where you get your information.

Bradee and Bellichik have had a top 10 defense 14 times in 17 seasons.

Payton, Rogers and Breese have combined had a top 10 defense in 44 seasons.

Think about that.



You missed the point.




We still using "butt hurt" in 2019?

I like Bradee. It has nothing to do with not liking him. Hes great. Hes not the GOAT. There are several better.

Fact is there are at least 3 other quarterbacks that have been more impressive and put up better statistics during Bradee's era. Those quarterbacks would have absolutely won if they played with Belllichik and those defenses. Its ridiculous to think otherwise.

Again, its hilarious we are even having this conversation a day after his defense held an unbelievable offense to 3 points. Bradee had nothing to do with that game last night yet all the conversation today is about how he is the GOAT. Its so fucking hilarious.

Getting through to to Brady GOAT people is about as easy as getting through to Kobe GOAT people. You guys can kick and scream all you want but at the end of the day those championships are a product of circumstance and those players never truly dominated the game as much as several as their peers did.
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From a Total Yards perspective, the Patriots have finished in the Top 10 just six times during the Brady years.

Nobody is arguing that there aren't more talented QBs in the league. I'd argue Peyton Manning and Aaron Rodgers were more physically gifted.

But neither are the greatest of all-time.


Nobody seems to be making a case for anyone else.
 
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