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People drive to BFE Green Bay to watch football. They will drive to Brook Park.
There was an article in one of the business blogs about the amount of downtown parking garages that were built between the 60s-80s that are reaching the end of their life cycle for safety due to age or maintenance neglect. A few are condemned/closed and in process of being torn down like the one recently on Huron Road. With a greater number of WFH employees, they most likely won't be replaced. None of Cleveland, Cincy or Columbus have regular inspection intervals for parking garages except for yearly elevator inspections.Say what you want about the millions of parking garages and whatever, it's an obnoxious walk to the stadium, especially in shitty weather.
A dome/village-like development is 100% better downtown than in any suburb. Regardless of how people feel about getting to the stadium. The best spot to have the stadium is downtown. The easiest spot to have the stadium for access and transportation is downtown.
That spot where the post office sits is downtown and development around that area puts the new stadium walking distance from Progressive Field and Rocket Mortgage.
A dome-village in Brook Park isn't going to attract people as consistently as a downtown dome-village.
We absolutely agree on the bolded. Call this: sins of our great great grandfathers. While Indianapolis and Pittsburgh annexed small suburbs into the city from the Civil War industrialization boom through The Great Depression, Cleveland chose not to do it.
I think the post office site with a dome is the best solution if possible. Eastsiders hate driving to the west side and vise versa. Downtown is like neutral ground that isn't a bad drive for most.
The rapid from the east side to the airport is like an hour+ ride because you have to switch trains downtown. The blue and green lines are packed on game day especially after the game. To have to transfer to another train and be on it for an hour would be brutal.
I think brookpark wouldn't be this prime development opportunity even if they invest a ton into it. Again eastsiders don't want to make that drive so you cut out half of the metro areas population as potential customers to whatever is there. Eastsiders will go for football games and maybe certain concerts but they won't go shopping or hit it up on the weekends for entertainment.
Great post. I keep cringing when people mention the RTA lines to Brook Park and how convenient they would be. Has anyone who lists that as a perk ever actually ridden the RTA? Even more importantly, have they rode on it on game day to watch the Browns?
I only once in my life took the RTA in from the east side to a game because one of my east side buddies was very convincing on the ease of beating traffic and saving from parking fees. It was brutal. Every stop took much longer than normal as the car kept getting more and more packed. It took damn near an hour to finally get to the stadium.
Now imagine someone from the east side not only having to make that trip downtown, but then having to transfer to get out to the airport. It would add hours on to your trip, especially due to the wait time to get home.
The RTA is poorly setup for massive crowds like that and significantly less convenient than driving around a couple blocks to find a decent parking spot to chug a couple beers in before walking to the game.
With that said, I’ve rode the RTA into the city from south of the city many times to Guardians and Cavs games. That has always been a pretty easy and “quick” trip. It’s still faster to just drive it, but it’s still a significantly better experience than trying to go from East to West or vice versa.
I rode the RTA from the airport into the city for the 2016 parade. It was the only way to get into the city. It worked to get me in and out, that's about all I'll say.Great post. I keep cringing when people mention the RTA lines to Brook Park and how convenient they would be. Has anyone who lists that as a perk ever actually ridden the RTA? Even more importantly, have they rode on it on game day to watch the Browns?
I only once in my life took the RTA in from the east side to a game because one of my east side buddies was very convincing on the ease of beating traffic and saving from parking fees. It was brutal. Every stop took much longer than normal as the car kept getting more and more packed. It took damn near an hour to finally get to the stadium.
Now imagine someone from the east side not only having to make that trip downtown, but then having to transfer to get out to the airport. It would add hours on to your trip, especially due to the wait time to get home.
The RTA is poorly setup for massive crowds like that and significantly less convenient than driving around a couple blocks to find a decent parking spot to chug a couple beers in before walking to the game.
With that said, I’ve rode the RTA into the city from south of the city many times to Guardians and Cavs games. That has always been a pretty easy and “quick” trip. It’s still faster to just drive it, but it’s still a significantly better experience than trying to go from East to West or vice versa.
I rode the RTA from the airport into the city for the 2016 parade. It was the only way to get into the city. It worked to get me in and out, that's about all I'll say.
Clearly, whatever they do, the rail system needs a significant upgrade.
The problem is that when you're downtown, the traffic is brutal. Whoever designed the road system in Cleveland is one of the biggest idiots who ever lived. It's like they wanted all the complexity of New York City yet without the charm. It's a nightmare. Go to any big city in the American Midwest and tell me Cleveland doesn't have the worst infrastructure of all of these cities.Investment in rail is an even more dubious use of money than stadiums. Very rare to get significant passengers for new service. Most cities do well just to maintain what service they have.
Expansion at the margins sometimes works. Even that is very costly.
Investment in rail is an even more dubious use of money than stadiums. Very rare to get significant passengers for new service. Most cities do well just to maintain what service they have.
Expansion at the margins sometimes works. Even that is very costly.
The problem is that when you're downtown, the traffic is brutal. Whoever designed the road system in Cleveland is one of the biggest idiots who ever lived. It's like they wanted all the complexity of New York City yet without the charm. It's a nightmare. Go to any big city in the American Midwest and tell me Cleveland doesn't have the worst infrastructure of all of these cities.
Even Detroit, which I find a hell hole to drive in, is better than Cleveland when you get downtown. It's pathetic we allowed this city to be built like it has been built.
We need to look at places in like Japan in a sense and have a setup that's actually way better getting around without a car... But that would take time and money and I doubt anyone is wiling to actually do that...