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Re: Nets vs Cavs 12-9-05

A classic home win for the Nets. I thought the game was in Cleveland. I was wrong.

5 second back down call when we're up 90-89. Right.

All the early fouls for them in the 4th assuring them of the penalty. Yup.

We played a lousy first half. But I suspect league money was on the Nets. I hate this .

Moo

PS-There should be a Damon Jones/Jeff McInnis PPV...matador vs matador. Ole.
 
Re: Nets vs Cavs 12-9-05

It seems like the last few games we just get behind early, but stay with them the whole game. We just have to come out strong tomorrow against the bucks.
 
Re: Nets vs Cavs 12-9-05

Pioneer10 said:
Z killed us today: good numbers but Kristic outplayed him and he killed our offense when he didn't score

I think we were watching different games. Z had 22 pts, 8 rebs and 3 blocks in a little over half the game. Kristic had 16, 3 and 2.

They shot the lights out - 57% from the field, and 615% from 3 pt range.....can't blame all that on Z. Z was the only when taking some of the scoring pressure off of Lebron. It sure didn't work going to Lebron all the time - he missed 15 shots, 5 free throws and had 7 turnovers. Gooden had a horrible game, he even scored for the other team(the announcers blamed Marshall).
Z was the least of our problems.
 
Well, the Cavs have looked horrible for the last 7 games...clearly not as good as we all hoped they were, yet...I hate it. And this lose was embarrassing. We were home, with rest and I think we are better team.

*sigh*

I hate it being a sports fan when this crap happens.

I think we are definitely going to lose tomorrow to the Bucks, which will infuriate me. We are tired, on the road, with back to back games, coming off a loss. I believe this is only a slump and we will eventually snap out of it, but still, hard to deal with.
 
That was the Nets 4th straight road win.
 
Well a perfect way to cap off my evening, everything went wrong and then this. Ugh..
 
Re: Nets vs Cavs 12-9-05

Maximus said:
I think we were watching different games. Z had 22 pts, 8 rebs and 3 blocks in a little over half the game. Kristic had 16, 3 and 2.

They shot the lights out - 57% from the field, and 615% from 3 pt range.....can't blame all that on Z. Z was the only when taking some of the scoring pressure off of Lebron. It sure didn't work going to Lebron all the time - he missed 15 shots, 5 free throws and had 7 turnovers. Gooden had a horrible game, he even scored for the other team(the announcers blamed Marshall).
Z was the least of our problems.
The problem is you are not paying attention to what happens when Z doesn't score. There is absolutely NO offensive movement, he refuses to pass to open shooters like Marshall. He's so slow in the lane, that Gooden can't get in the lane becuase he's worried about a 3 second call.

I'm sick of trying to defend Z: he played a Kobe like game out there. Decent stats but killed any chance of team play. When did we make our big run it happened when Z thankfully got his fifth foul. We actually started getting movement and had good rotation. No it's not all his fault but he absolutely hurt us today
 
This team needs a lot of improvement if they want to win more than maybe 1 playoff game.
It's only 18 games and too soon to make a complete judgement, but so far I have not been impressed at all with the coaching of Mike Brown. This is still a terrible defensive team. Stats shown on ESPN showed how the Cavs rank near the bottom of many key defensive categories and this is after Brown supposedly has concentrated on D throughout training camp, preseason, and the early season.
The Cavs also don't seem to have any consistent offensive system. Most of the time they focus on 1 on 1 play, or LeBron or Hughes just driving, or drive and kick outs for 3's.

Don't see how Z can get blamed for this loss, other than getting in foul trouble. Z isn't responsible for Carter and Jefferson shooting a combined 23-30 from the field.
Cavs perimeter D is terrible. LeBron doesn't seem to want to be bothered with giving much effort most of the time on D. Hughes was destroyed tonight by Carter. Hughes' D has also only been average many times too.

LeBron's scoring numbers look nice but overall this wasn't one of his best games. LeBron is best when he'snot only scoring himself but looking to create offense for others. His play was a little too selfish tonight.

Snow did the best job defending Carter but a team's starting PG cannot go scoreless and not even attempt a shot.

Cavs seem to lack a killer instinct and don't play aggressive many times. They do have talent and are a playoff team but it's obvious there still needs to be more building with this roster.
 
Re: Nets vs Cavs 12-9-05

Pioneer10 said:
The problem is you are not paying attention to what happens when Z doesn't score. There is absolutely NO offensive movement, he refuses to pass to open shooters like Marshall. He's so slow in the lane, that Gooden can't get in the lane becuase he's worried about a 3 second call.

I'm sick of trying to defend Z: he played a Kobe like game out there. Decent stats but killed any chance of team play. When did we make our big run it happened when Z thankfully got his fifth foul. We actually started getting movement and had good rotation. No it's not all his fault but he absolutely hurt us today

Our shooters couldn't shoot.....theirs could. We went on a run when we finally hit a few 3 pointers in a row. Then we quickly went back down by 8 when we missed 5 straight. Hughes was 4 of 12 and gave up most of Carter's 26 FIRST HALF points.....yet you make no mention of him? When Z was on the bench it was all Lebron, all the time. He'd drive until he got triple teamed and then kick it out for one of our 20+ 3-point tries. No one took any pressure off him....what was Gooden doing when Z was on OR OFF the court? Nothing! Again Lebron, missed 15 shots, missed 5 free throws and had 7 turnovers.....I just don't see where Z is the first person you blame. He was 7-13 and he was 8 for 8. If it wasn't for Z we would have been down 25 at the half.

"The problem is you are not paying attention to what happens when Z doesn't score." I paid pretty close attention. I think you are putting Z under a microscope and not paying attention to the other players on the court. Our offense is fine. The Cavs are playing terrible defense.....it was no better during the 20 minutes Z was on the bench.
 
One more thing! Most of the time, Lebron shows a very high basketball IQ most of the time, but then he does this:

Cavs bring the ball up. Our PG passes over to Lebron on the wing. Lebron holds the ball for a few seconds. It seems he is measuring up the defensive scheme of the opponents, determining the best way for him to create for himself or others. The defender looks nervous, knowing that Lebron can easily drive around him and penetrate. The defender is also aware of Lebrons sick court vision. The shot clock reads 16 seconds, plenty of time to execute an infinite number of good plays. Lebron standing 2 feet behind the arc, squares his feet up, takes a look at the hoop and hoists an inexplicable 3. Brick.

What is that?! Seriously, why does he do this?!?! He claims he doesn't get tired, so it is not that he just can't drive. Is that was Coach Brown wants? I doubt it. Is this the "new weapon" in Lebron's arsenal? If it is, he needs to abandon it for now. It gives opponents fastbreak opportunities and doesn't make them work for shit.

...did I mention I hate that damn 3.
 
Re: Nets vs Cavs 12-9-05

Maximus said:
Our shooters couldn't shoot.....theirs could. We went on a run when we finally hit a few 3 pointers in a row. Then we quickly went back down by 8 when we missed 5 straight. Hughes was 4 of 12 and gave up most of Carter's 26 FIRST HALF points.....yet you make no mention of him? When Z was on the bench it was all Lebron, all the time. He'd drive until he got triple teamed and then kick it out for one of our 20+ 3-point tries. No one took any pressure off him....what was Gooden doing when Z was on OR OFF the court? Nothing! Again Lebron, missed 15 shots, missed 5 free throws and had 7 turnovers.....I just don't see where Z is the first person you blame. He was 7-13 and he was 8 for 8. If it wasn't for Z we would have been down 25 at the half.

"The problem is you are not paying attention to what happens when Z doesn't score." I paid pretty close attention. I think you are putting Z under a microscope and not paying attention to the other players on the court. Our offense is fine. The Cavs are playing terrible defense.....it was no better during the 20 minutes Z was on the bench.

Right, anytime you score 100 points and allow the opponents to shoot 57% from the field, your defense is the problem.
 
what?? personally what I saw was some surprisingly spirited defensive effort from the cavs for much of the game. Vince was simply unstoppable tonight, everything was going in, regardless of how many defenders were between him and the basket or how many hands were in his face. He made quite a few very tough shots (and got pretty lucky some other times) at very key moments that either got NJ's momentum back on track, or killed any chance of ours starting, for most of the game... and many of those tough shots were jump shots, made at the perimeter; our perimeter defense did not break down nearly as much from what I saw. I saw lebron really getting after RJ for most of the game, our rotations were slow as usual but we weren't just blatantly leaving guys wide open as much, although we started to once we began collapsing on carter (which didn't really help).

the nets played extremely well in general... except mcinnis :) The nets team fg % was ridiculously high during the period where carter was just tossing them up and they were going in, and all his teammates were sticking their jumpers. Then as carter cooled off, so did the nets team fg%. If someone watching didn't know anything else about this nba season, he probably would've thought the nets were one of the top nba teams, the way they played tonight

meanwhile, i thought our offense let us down tonight. Yes we put up points, but we were playing catch-up the entire game, and we just couldn't get anything started offensively. I'm really starting to worry about larry hughes' shooting. We weren't converting our offensive tips. Lebron was having trouble finishing tonight; couple occasions, he missed the layup which ordinarily would've been no problem for him. He also forced passes during a stretch which led to a few turnovers. On the positive side, donyell and damon hit some threes, and I really don't mind damon taking 1-2 bad shots a game (he took two bad threes tonight that i saw, made 1 missed 1). Gooden was solid as we've come to expect... maybe mike brown should look into running a few offensive plays a game for gooden.

i don't want to get into the whole debate about Z, but i will say that the cavs looked very active and dangerous with gooden marshall lebron jones snow.... until the nets started penetrating and getting layups. take that as you will

that first quarter really killed us, the refs calls/noncalls were frustrating for me, as a cavs fan, to see, but the players have not let that affect them and just keep playing. That's a tough thing to do but letting that get to them got us in a hole right off the bat, and we stayed in that hole pretty much the whole game.


also, it was nice to hear the Q so loud during that comeback stretch
 
Re: Nets vs Cavs 12-9-05

Maximus said:
Our shooters couldn't shoot.....theirs could. We went on a run when we finally hit a few 3 pointers in a row. Then we quickly went back down by 8 when we missed 5 straight. Hughes was 4 of 12 and gave up most of Carter's 26 FIRST HALF points.....yet you make no mention of him? When Z was on the bench it was all Lebron, all the time. He'd drive until he got triple teamed and then kick it out for one of our 20+ 3-point tries. No one took any pressure off him....what was Gooden doing when Z was on OR OFF the court? Nothing! Again Lebron, missed 15 shots, missed 5 free throws and had 7 turnovers.....I just don't see where Z is the first person you blame. He was 7-13 and he was 8 for 8. If it wasn't for Z we would have been down 25 at the half.

"The problem is you are not paying attention to what happens when Z doesn't score." I paid pretty close attention. I think you are putting Z under a microscope and not paying attention to the other players on the court. Our offense is fine. The Cavs are playing terrible defense.....it was no better during the 20 minutes Z was on the bench.
I rip on all the players when they screw up and I saw a player who completely bogged down the offense. My problem with Z this game is that the Cavs put a ton of effort into getting him the ball and it failed them over all. That is why I'm being critical of Z in this game because he was supposed to carry the load on the offensive end against a relatively weak frontline. This is a game where maybe Gooden should have got the ball more as he seemed to have a much easier time of it Lebron after the slow part played pretty well I thought and didn't settle too much out there.

To be faird Another player who you have to wonder about is Hughes. Don't think anybody would have stopped Carter tonight but Hughes was also atrocious on the offensive end. A lot of players did not play well and Z does not deserve all the blame. But again he was the main focus (which many posters have been asking for) for long stretches of this game and I though our offense was atrocious when this occurred
 
I couldn't make love to my wife after the game. Why? Z.

Big Z has made me impotent. He's also made me fall behind in my bills and I suspect he is to blame for our Iraq situation.

Inflation up? Big Z. Lose your job? Big Z.

It's really simple. Maybe if every thread comes down to Big Z, we can eliminate all the threads but one. In fact, the Moohead Radio forum will now be the Big Z Rantatorium, where all of you can pull his pigtails and curse his Lithuanian heritage, while others can deify him.

Come to my forum and see how I deal with this.

Moo
 
What a disappointing finish! That game was fun to watch until we choke at the end. Vince Carter has resurrected his career in NJ, he was awesome in this one.

I dont have a 'basketball eye' like a Hubie Brown, or many of you on here. As far as seeing the plays on offense and evaluating defense. But i can tell when a team is fired up and playing with energy. I think thats a big issue for this team. Weve been focusing on D this whole season, yet still we suck. You play D with hustle and effort, which the Cavs lack consistently. How can a team play with passion for 48 min both ends of the court? Tough question.........
 

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