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  1. #3166
    All Star JSS2306's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    Is it the lack of blocks? If defense isn't in your face, sometimes it's not so easy to spot.

    For instance, Tristan isn't just shutting people down all over the court like a DPOY candidate, but like against the Clips there were multiple possessions where Griffin posted up on him and just had to pass it out, he's doing pretty well with his P&R defense. You don't always notice that unless you look for it, because a well defended P&R typically results in the play being reset and something else being tried.

    Yes, he's out of position or a step late at times, but that's not so odd. He and Andy have just been a terror on the offensive boards (we're second in the NBA primarily because of them and TZ).

    He hasn't wowed like we'd like to see, but he hasn't been all bad either. Comparing him to JaVale McGee must have been some sort of joke ...
    I implore you to watch Tristan without the ball in his hands. Just take a couple plays off of everyone else and watch him closely. It's amazing where he picks and chooses to be on the floor. He has no idea and Byron has consistently pulled him from the game because of it.

    Also, Blake Griffin doesn't pass the ball because he's bodied by Tristan last night, it's because the ball goes through Griffins hands to set up plays. Tristan bit on almost all of Blakes pump fakes. The Clippers were trying to draw in defenders and make a play. Meanwhile, when Blake did want to attack, he was getting to the hole and making a play at will.

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  3. #3167
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by SmknJoe7 View Post
    People have often times pointed to TT's combine numbers and other measureables as as a sort of guide or description as to how athletic he is. Yet, for much of his floor time over this year+, it just doesn't seem to transfer.
    I think that gets at the wow-factor too. Yes, we want to see him sky in the air and block shots, or throw down dunks in traffic; but athleticism benefits all the mundane things a player does as well - whether it's getting back on D, or recovering on the P&R, or switching on D.

    Enes Kanter is a skilled player and a solid rebounder, but he lacks Tristan's athleticism - after a promising summer league/pre-season ... he's done squat. Tristan is not a freak of nature, but he does have very good athleticism. If we could combine the two players, we might have something, but we can't and there's little choice but to sit back and see how TT comes along.

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by JSS2306 View Post
    He has no idea and Byron has consistently pulled him from the game because of it.
    I could swear he was being pulled because a) he had a couple fouls, and b) so he could be inserted later and paired with TZ while Andy rested.

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  6. #3169
    All Star JSS2306's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    I could swear he was being pulled because a) he had a couple fouls, and b) so he could be inserted later and paired with TZ while Andy rested.
    I like your political style Jon, it's cool that you can pull one sentence from a paragraph of evidence and make it yours. However, point b) is a complete conspiracy and point a) is insinuating that Tristan was pulled for foul trouble and not his complete lack of awareness on the floor which to that point in the game was pretty well established.

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    I think that gets at the wow-factor too. Yes, we want to see him sky in the air and block shots, or throw down dunks in traffic; but athleticism benefits all the mundane things a player does as well - whether it's getting back on D, or recovering on the P&R, or switching on D.

    Enes Kanter is a skilled player and a solid rebounder, but he lacks Tristan's athleticism - after a promising summer league/pre-season ... he's done squat. Tristan is not a freak of nature, but he does have very good athleticism. If we could combine the two players, we might have something, but we can't and there's little choice but to sit back and see how TT comes along.
    I agree in principal with what you are saying, but will just refer to JSS's post before yours that I thanked. It sounds corny, but I DVR games just to go back and look for some things that aren't quite so easy to see live. TT, after my voiced criticism of him after SL, has been on my DVR radar this year...and it ain't been all that. While it is definitely better than some of the crap we've run out there these last few years(AJ, Hickson, etc), it is definitely not anything I expect to see from someone with TT's potential.

    I don't need the kid to grow wings and hop over the moon. I just want some above average defense that shows signs of his athleticism, and overall competence that shows me he is learning. I've seen flashes(like the beautiful passing game 1), but nothing consistant so far. I've not lost all hope, but he certainly isn't doing anything much to dissuade me from my opinions. Waiting....

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  9. #3171
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    There is an eye test that this guy just doesnt pass. I dont know what he showed in those workouts that helped project him to be more, but Ive never seen anything other than workhorse/energy big man in all the games I have seen him before being drafted and in the last year and change either.

    He has no feel for basketball.

    His ceiling is Dale Davis or PJ Brown. And I think he has a long way to go before he gets there. Easily replaceable skillset and very handicapping if we are going to build to complement his skillset.
    The Richfield Trade Deadline Survival Kit post... here

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  11. #3172
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by RchfldCavRaised View Post
    There is an eye test that this guy just doesnt pass. I dont know what he showed in those workouts that helped project him to be more, but Ive never seen anything other than workhorse/energy big man in all the games I have seen him before being drafted and in the last year and change either.

    He has no feel for basketball.

    His ceiling is Dale Davis or PJ Brown. And I think he has a long way to go before he gets there. Easily replaceable skillset and very handicapping if we are going to build to complement his skillset.
    I would do multiple back flips if TT turned into either one of those guys.

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    I would also tend to be mildly pessimistic about Tristan's prospects after a lackluster first few games, but Dion Waiters just taught us all a little lesson about writing a guy off too soon. I know it's his sophomore season, so the learning curve should be starting to level off, but there are reasons to be optimistic:


    -He worked hard in the offseason, adding 15-odd pounds of muscle to better handle the post game

    -He came into training camp tagged by Coach Scott as the most improved player on the Cavs, and was among players ESPN writers picked as preseason MIP candidates
    http://espn.go.com/nba/preview2012/s...mproved-player

    -In four games of summer league, he averaged 23 points, 8.7 rebounds, and 1.1 blocks/36 on 61% shooting
    -In seven games of preseason, he averaged 14 points, 10.5 rebounds, and 2.5 blocks/36 on 50% shooting


    Given how promising he looked just a week ago, I have to say that his recent stretch of general incompetence, while certainly discouraging, is likely not representative of how his season will go. I'm still pretty confident that his sophomore season will be decidedly better than his rookie campaign, and I fully expect him to have a "breakout" game of 20 & 10 soon that pushes his averages back up to more ordinary levels and brings optimism back to this thread.

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by RchfldCavRaised View Post
    There is an eye test that this guy just doesnt pass. I dont know what he showed in those workouts that helped project him to be more, but Ive never seen anything other than workhorse/energy big man in all the games I have seen him before being drafted and in the last year and change either.

    He has no feel for basketball.

    His ceiling is Dale Davis or PJ Brown. And I think he has a long way to go before he gets there. Easily replaceable skillset and very handicapping if we are going to build to complement his skillset.
    Hey I have to agree. When you're looking to the long haul, he hasn't produced the sort of "basketball talent" that you would expect even for a raw talent. He just isn't very talented IMO. He doesn't do fundamentals very well and this includes offensive AND defensive timing. I have liked his mentality this season because I think it's real, but it just doesn't translate to something tangible.

    I think he's a nice quiet kid with no real feel for this game. There are basic things he consistently doesn't do properly that any sophmore could figure out with a year under his belt...

    I don't know man, I just don't think this game is in his blood but by no means do I give up on him. I come from a basketball background and he simply doesn't "get" timing. Timing is something you learn after a season whether you're a great ball player or an average one... He literally has to skate by on his athleticism which is something I cannot stand to see in this league personally. No hate on him, but he has to show me more than a couple good plays a game. He's very timid.

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  15. #3175
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by SmknJoe7 View Post
    I would do multiple back flips if TT turned into either one of those guys.

    Do you mean multiple flips in one jump or multiple single back flips consecutively?

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan S View Post
    I would also tend to be mildly pessimistic about Tristan's prospects after a lackluster first few games, but Dion Waiters just taught us all a little lesson about writing a guy off too soon. I know it's his sophomore season, so the learning curve should be starting to level off, but there are reasons to be optimistic:


    -He worked hard in the offseason, adding 15-odd pounds of muscle to better handle the post game

    -He came into training camp tagged by Coach Scott as the most improved player on the Cavs, and was among players ESPN writers picked as preseason MIP candidates
    http://espn.go.com/nba/preview2012/s...mproved-player

    -In four games of summer league, he averaged 23 points, 8.7 rebounds, and 1.1 blocks/36 on 61% shooting
    -In seven games of preseason, he averaged 14 points, 10.5 rebounds, and 2.5 blocks/36 on 50% shooting


    Given how promising he looked just a week ago, I have to say that his recent stretch of general incompetence, while certainly discouraging, is likely not representative of how his season will go. I'm still pretty confident that his sophomore season will be decidedly better than his rookie campaign, and I fully expect him to have a "breakout" game of 20 & 10 soon that pushes his averages back up to more ordinary levels and brings optimism back to this thread.
    Sorry, but that is some of the most hollow sets of numbers I have ever seen.

    I watched him achieve those SL numbers and hence there was no promise whatsoever for me a week or a month ago.

    The MIP thing and Coach's words are also just about as hollow. There were a lot of things said about TT from the Cavs coaches, FO, and a few players that don't seem to be carrying much weight. I said this in the past. The Cavs have a ton riding on their 2011 #4. They have labeled him a core player since before he played a single game. His teammates know the importance of him succeeeding, as well. All of this may just carry a bit of bias. ESPN? Well, I think most on here know to take ESPN with a grain of salt.

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by RTrees View Post
    Do you mean multiple flips in one jump or multiple single back flips consecutively?
    One or the other for PJ Brown. Both at the same time for Dale Davis

  18. #3178
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by RchfldCavRaised View Post
    There is an eye test that this guy just doesnt pass. I dont know what he showed in those workouts that helped project him to be more, but Ive never seen anything other than workhorse/energy big man in all the games I have seen him before being drafted and in the last year and change either.

    He has no feel for basketball.

    His ceiling is Dale Davis or PJ Brown. And I think he has a long way to go before he gets there. Easily replaceable skillset and very handicapping if we are going to build to complement his skillset.
    PJ Brown developed a decent jumper....no chance in hell Tristan can do that.

    It's tough critisizing him because he seems like such a good kid too. I'm ready to see what Zeller has at this point, which is pretty disappointing.

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by JSS2306 View Post
    I like your political style Jon, it's cool that you can pull one sentence from a paragraph of evidence and make it yours. However, point b) is a complete conspiracy and point a) is insinuating that Tristan was pulled for foul trouble and not his complete lack of awareness on the floor which to that point in the game was pretty well established.
    We're you expecting me to run right off and watch all the available footage of Tristan to see what he does when he's not involved in a play?

    I'm sorry if I disappointed ...

    I'm not seeing the things you're seeing. I'll look for it in the future. *shrugs*

  20. #3180
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by JSS2306 View Post
    I like your political style Jon, it's cool that you can pull one sentence from a paragraph of evidence and make it yours. However, point b) is a complete conspiracy and point a) is insinuating that Tristan was pulled for foul trouble and not his complete lack of awareness on the floor which to that point in the game was pretty well established.
    He played 32 minutes (the same amount as Waiters and only four less than Varejao), so I'm more inclined to believe that Jon was right. If in fact he was pulled because of the issues you brought up, it would more than likely have been reflected on his minutes, which it clearly wasn't.

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