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  1. #3316
    Rising Star jlegg21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Some of you are living on hopes and dreams. Pretending everything is ok. I'm truly terrified that this kid is just "a guy", that his ceiling is 11pts, 8reb a game.

    You know what that statline is? Barely adequate for an NBA PF.

    You know what that statline ISNT? Good enough for a kid drafted #4 overall.

    That light bulb had better come on real quick, and even if it does, he's still a poor man's Varejao at best. His one offensive move is turn and dunk, and it gets blocked half the time. But sure, go ahead and keep spinning this, and while you're doing it, go watch Kenneth Faried play basketball for the Nuggets and try not to vomit.

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  3. #3317
    Snitches get stitches Hydroponic3385's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by jlegg21 View Post
    Some of you are living on hopes and dreams. Pretending everything is ok. I'm truly terrified that this kid is just "a guy", that his ceiling is 11pts, 8reb a game.

    You know what that statline is? Barely adequate for an NBA PF.

    You know what that statline ISNT? Good enough for a kid drafted #4 overall.

    That light bulb had better come on real quick, and even if it does, he's still a poor man's Varejao at best. His one offensive move is turn and dunk, and it gets blocked half the time. But sure, go ahead and keep spinning this, and while you're doing it, go watch Kenneth Faried play basketball for the Nuggets and try not to vomit.
    I'm not really a TT supporter (or fanboy at all), but people really need to get off this whole "not good enough for #4 overall" spiel. Let's face it, there's relative busts all over every draft, even throughout the top 10. And the 2011 draft was particularly weak with any type of upper talent. The only realistic guys we should regret passing on are Leonard (would have been just as much a reach, but obviously is better), Klay (same as Leonard), or Jonas (but we had reason to be concerned because he & his agent seemed like huge douches about not giving the Cavs any details about when Jonas would come to the US if we picked him). Faried was unrealistic at #4, as much as we may wish we could use hindsight now. If TT can end up a nice role player (and there's still plenty of time/promise for him to reach the level of a good 3rd big), we should be happy. I mean we got a potential superstar in Irving, potential all-star or at least very good SG in Waiters, and seemingly a steal of a big at #17 with Zeller. We won't hit the jackpot with all of our draft picks, even if we have 3 top 4 picks in 2 years. Sucks to say that (and sucks that it's true with TT), but we need to be realistic here.
    Last edited by Hydroponic3385; 11-10-2012 at 12:18 AM.

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  5. #3318
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by SmknJoe7 View Post
    Out of all the team sports, basketball is the most individually driven. Many times, good players will put themselves and their defender on an island, and look to score. TT has struggled in these situations on defense, and is pretty incapable of it on offense.

    The Andy comparison has to stop. Andy is not the player he used to be. He gets fed the ball, wether it's called for him or not, in good spots because guys trust he will do something positive, and the last few years he has responded well.

    I don't know. Maybe he's getting it, but it's not showing on the floor. I'm done with it for a while. I would love to eat crow 20 games from now, but my skepticism grows by the day.
    How can you say basketball is less team oriented than baseball?

  6. #3319
    Rising Star jlegg21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Hydroponic3385 View Post
    I'm not really a TT supporter (or fanboy at all), but people really need to get off this whole "not good enough for #4 overall" spiel. Let's face it, there's relative busts all over every draft, even throughout the top 10. And the 2011 draft was particularly weak with any type of upper talent. The only realistic guys we should regret passing on are Leonard (would have been just as much a reach, but obviously is better), Klay (same as Leonard), or Jonas (but we had reason to be concerned because he & his agent seemed like huge douches about not giving the Cavs any details about when Jonas would come to the US if we picked him). Faried was unrealistic at #4, as much as we may wish we could use hindsight now. If TT can end up a nice role player (and there's still plenty of time/promise for him to reach the level of a good 3rd big), we should be happy. I mean we got a potential superstar in Irving, potential all-star or at least very good SG in Waiters, and seemingly a steal of a big at #17 with Zeller. We won't hit the jackpot with all of our draft picks, even if we have 3 top 4 picks in 2 years. Sucks to say that (and sucks that it's true with TT), but we need to be realistic here.
    I'm not saying we should have taken Faried at 4, I'm saying Faried is already looking like a far better version of TT and he went 22nd. There's a difference.

    The Cavs didnt have to burn that pick if they werent 100% sold on him, but they went ahead and did it. They definitely could have traded down, from what I recall, but they stuck to their guns and took the PF with no offensive game to speak of.

    The biggest problem is this is the Cavs and their market is Cleveland. We cant miss on #4 overall picks and expect to get where we all want to go. Doesnt work that way. If TT doesnt turn out to be anything more than a 3rd big, we're in a world of trouble. If the Lakers or Knicks blow a high pick, they go out and sign someone else in FA or pull a shady trade out of their asses.

    Pretty sure I'm the one being realistic here...

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  8. #3320
    Snitches get stitches Hydroponic3385's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by jlegg21 View Post
    I'm not saying we should have taken Faried at 4, I'm saying Faried is already looking like a far better version of TT and he went 22nd. There's a difference.

    The Cavs didnt have to burn that pick if they werent 100% sold on him, but they went ahead and did it. They definitely could have traded down, from what I recall, but they stuck to their guns and took the PF with no offensive game to speak of.

    The biggest problem is this is the Cavs and their market is Cleveland. We cant miss on #4 overall picks and expect to get where we all want to go. Doesnt work that way. If TT doesnt turn out to be anything more than a 3rd big, we're in a world of trouble. If the Lakers or Knicks blow a high pick, they go out and sign someone else in FA or pull a shady trade out of their asses.

    Pretty sure I'm the one being realistic here...
    We have NO idea if trading down was/was not a realistic possibility. Let's not pretend.

    We hit on our 2011 #1 and it's looking like we very much hit on our 2012 #4 and #17. I'm sorry, but the odds are just that we won't hit on all of our picks. Even OKC - another small market team that you'd assume "just can't miss" on these types of picks - whiffed on Jeff Green (taken #5 and traded to OKC on draft day) and Cole Aldrich (taken #11 and traded to OKC on draft day).

    Am I head over heels crazy about the idea of TT's likely future as a former #4 pick? No. But frankly, given the potential we have in 3 of our 4 picks these last 2 years, I'd say TT as a good 3rd big would be acceptable if you look at our 2-year span of a rookie haul. And that to me is being realistic. This Cavs team also has some combination of their own draft picks these next 1-2 seasons, additional draft picks, tons of cap space (whether used via trade and/or free agency), and the potential of an Andy trade to maximize their core going forward.
    Last edited by Hydroponic3385; 11-10-2012 at 12:48 AM.

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  10. #3321
    Rising Star KB's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    People saying Kenneth Faried is better have to take into account that Faried is 2 years older, played his entire career in the US and stayed in college for 4 years

    Tristan played against kids in Canada until he was a sophomore in HS and then went to a NJ prep school, transferring one time after that...then had 1year of college ball before being drafted

    The simple fact of the matter in this comparison is that it's no surprise Faried is better right now because he has played against better competition and received competent coaching for a longer period of time than Tristan has

    Side note:

    I know Wilson Chandler has been hurt but it doesn't seem like he is going to get over 20 minutes a game with the Nuggets roster (Iggy being added and Gallo, Brewer..)

    It will interesting to see if the Nuggets keep Chandler
    Last edited by KB; 11-10-2012 at 01:23 AM.

  11. #3322
    Situational Stopper B3team's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Hydroponic3385 View Post
    Faried was unrealistic at #4, as much as we may wish we could use hindsight now
    I disagree. If you are going to reach for a player that no one else has projected top 4 like CG did with TT, then all players were on the table at #4. He obviously wasn't following "realistic" player rankings. You can't say that Faried was unrealistic when we know TT was unrealistic and Grant picked him anyway. If TT was on the table, Faried should have been as well. The bottom line is that if you reach for a player at the top of the draft, you better pick a winner. We are singing his praises with the Waiters pick, but I see no reason to give him a pass for picking Thompson over Faried simply because Faried was supposedly unrealistic.

  12. #3323
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by B3team View Post
    I disagree. If you are going to reach for a player that no one else has projected top 4 like CG did with TT, then all players were on the table at #4. He obviously wasn't following "realistic" player rankings. You can't say that Faried was unrealistic when we know TT was unrealistic and Grant picked him anyway. If TT was on the table, Faried should have been as well. The bottom line is that if you reach for a player at the top of the draft, you better pick a winner. We are singing his praises with the Waiters pick, but I see no reason to give him a pass for picking Thompson over Faried simply because Faried was supposedly unrealistic.
    TT wasn't that big of a reach though. He was going 7 to Charlotte had he been there. Faried simply wasn't realistic that high, Biyombo was the alternative if the Cavs felt they couldn't take the chance on Valanciunas (And I still think something happened with him that made them shy away)

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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Seiklis View Post
    TT wasn't that big of a reach though. He was going 7 to Charlotte had he been there. Faried simply wasn't realistic that high, Biyombo was the alternative if the Cavs felt they couldn't take the chance on Valanciunas (And I still think something happened with him that made them shy away)
    Good point, I forgot that TT was projected to go as high as Charlotte. That would have been a perfect team for TT

  14. #3325
    Birthing All-Stars Löttery Göd's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by KB View Post
    People saying Kenneth Faried is better have to take into account that Faried is 2 years older, played his entire career in the US and stayed in college for 4 years

    Tristan played against kids in Canada until he was a sophomore in HS and then went to a NJ prep school, transferring one time after that...then had 1year of college ball before being drafted

    The simple fact of the matter in this comparison is that it's no surprise Faried is better right now because he has played against better competition and received competent coaching for a longer period of time than Tristan has

    Side note:

    I know Wilson Chandler has been hurt but it doesn't seem like he is going to get over 20 minutes a game with the Nuggets roster (Iggy being added and Gallo, Brewer..)

    It will interesting to see if the Nuggets keep Chandler
    1 year, 4 months older.
    "For the Tank God so loved the world, that he gave his one and only Tank Son, Antawn Jamison, and whosoever believes in Him, will not perish, but have everlasting high draft picks." - Tank 3:16

  15. #3326
    12 Reasons to Post MYoung23's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Isaiah Austin had a strong debut against Lehigh before turning his ankle.

  16. #3327
    All Star Giambiwannabe7's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimme Some Mo View Post
    How can you say basketball is less team oriented than baseball?
    I actually said it's more individually driven. One star player can make a much larger overall impact in a 5 man team than it can on a 9 man team.

    LeBron James taking an otherwise terrible roster to the NBA Finals is the ultimate example. No one guy, not Babe Ruth, not Albert Pujols can do that for an otherwise mediocre baseball team. Even more to the point, sometimes the best player on a team is it's starting pitcher. He only plays once every 5 games. His impact is reduced because he only plays on 20% of the games, and then doesn't even contribute offensively(even in the NL the contribution is usually insignifcant).
    Last edited by Giambiwannabe7; 11-10-2012 at 09:39 AM.

  17. #3328
    Kouki, Not Cookie. IWantAKouki's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by SmknJoe7 View Post
    I actually said it's more individually driven. One star player can make a much larger overall impact in a 5 man team than it can on a 9 man team.

    LeBron James taking an otherwise terrible roster to the NBA Finals is the ultimate example. No one guy, not Babe Ruth, not Albert Pujols can do that for an otherwise mediocre baseball team. Even more to the point, sometimes the best player on a team is it's starting pitcher. He only plays once every 5 games. His impact is reduced because he only plays on 20% of the games, and then doesn't even contribute offensively(even in the NL the contribution is usually insignifcant).
    Well you guys are arguing two different definitions of "team oriented"....basketball obviously requires more teamwork and coordination amongst others, but you are right in that one player can make a bball team whereas that couldn't happen in the MLB.
    i like jorts

  18. #3329
    Situational Stopper apolo29's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    This is so annoying. Can we please stop?

    We drafted him. It's done. What's done is done. Get over it.
    And, his ceiling is 11 pts 8 reboudns? Really? So when he actually learns to do something his statline wil be PRETTY MUCH THE SAME AS IT IS NOW? Okay.

    I dont think the majority of you understand the concept of a project pick.

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  20. #3330
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    Default Re: Tristan Thompson

    Quote Originally Posted by SmknJoe7 View Post
    Out of all the team sports, basketball is the most individually driven. Many times, good players will put themselves and their defender on an island, and look to score. TT has struggled in these situations on defense, and is pretty incapable of it on offense.
    That explains a lot about your viewpoint. There are always 10 men on the floor. Always. There's only an "island" if your defense permits it.

    Quote Originally Posted by SmknJoe7 View Post
    I actually said it's more individually driven. One star player can make a much larger overall impact in a 5 man team than it can on a 9 man team.
    Basketball has the fewest players of the team sports, they can play every game and nobody has to wait their "turn", so of course the impact of an individual is greater.

    Quote Originally Posted by SmknJoe7 View Post
    LeBron James taking an otherwise terrible roster to the NBA Finals is the ultimate example.
    Actually, that roster doesn't get to the finals if not for their team defense, and they would have won it all if not for the Spurs team defense. If they tried to defend James 1:1 like you suggest, they wouldn't have stopped him.
    Last edited by Jon; 11-10-2012 at 12:40 PM.

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