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  1. #1081
    IT'S TRIBE TIME NOW!!! Pyro's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    The epilogue is probably my favorite single chapter in any of the books. Jaqen is a fucking beast.
    What epilogue? I don't have an epilogue in my book...

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    So we come to it at last Chris's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    I think he was referring to the prologue actually, and I was thinking of just the last chapter of the book.

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    Good Guys Club founder kosis's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    New behind the scenes footage vid premiered before last night's Boardwalk finale:



    Looks dope so far. Loving Beric's sword. Production value looks top notch yet again.

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  5. #1084
    So we come to it at last Chris's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Dondarrion looks off the chain.... really hope they don't fuck that fight up.

  6. #1085
    Hall of Famer Rich's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    I think he was referring to the prologue actually, and I was thinking of just the last chapter of the book.
    Nah I meant the last chapter as well. Don't know why I called it an epilogue when I knew it was following Sam's POV. Anyway, the chapter where "Pate" reappears. Such a cool scene.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. MacPhisto View Post
    I still hold that Kevin Love is a cancer. This team will win 50 without him, it will win 45 with him.

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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    Bored and was just reading up on some shit in Westeros and figured I'd ask another general question to see if anyone has any outside the box ideas. So, who do we think Septa Lemore is?
    For the record, this post has a lot of spoilers. I've blacked out the ones concerning future events in the series that have not yet been depicted on the show. I have, however, left any concerning events in the past that haven't been shown on the show because, much like the Tower of Joy scene, they may never be seen on the show and non-readers should know about them.

    Anyway, common theory is that Septa Lemore is Ashara Dayne, who was thought to have (if I recall correctly) hurled herself off a cliff after a miscarriage. The father of her out-of-wedlock baby was said by Barristan Selmy in ADWD as a Stark (presumably Brandon).

    This has, in turn, led to some natural speculation (and the phrase "Mummer's Dragon" in Dance) that perhaps Aegon is not really Aegon Targaryen but Ashara's bastard child. I could see this being the case, just as I could see Ashara harboring some resentment at the Starks/Lannisters/Baratheons after Robert's Rebellion.

    There are tons of crazy ideas out there, although how many of them are outside the box is questionable. I'll list a few.

    1. Sandor Clegane (named my German Shepherd after him, btw) is still alive and the gravedigger in Feast. This one isn't too out there, but what really remains to be seen is whether or not this will ever be brought up again or if it was just Martin giving a wink to his more observant readers.

    2. Tyrion is a Targaryen. There's a small amount of evidence to support this. For one, Aerys was noted to have had a thing for Tywin's wife. Second, Tyrion is noted to have more silvery blonde hair, whereas every other Lannister's hair is described as golden. Third, there's his different eye colors, or the fact that he's long had an obsession with dragons and, despite spending much time around the flux in Dance, never gets sick. There were more examples but the ones above are the ones I can remember off-hand.

    3. Jon Snow is not only the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar, but a legitimate Targaryen and, thus, the real heir to the Iron Throne. It's pretty commonly accepted that Lyanna and Rhaegar had an affair, had Jon Snow, and then both died and Ned covered it up to spare the baby's life (probably at Lyanna's dying request). What's less certain is whether or not Jon was truly a bastard or if Lyanna and Rhaegar married at some point before his birth. This would seem to account for why there were several members of the Kingsguard present at the Tower of Joy when Ned presumably went to reclaim Lyanna. Remember, Rhaegar was Aerys' eldest son, thus making him the heir to the throne and, in turn, any of his offspring the next in line to rule. Why would the Kingsguard be at the Tower to protect Lyanna after the war was lost? She would require no protection, as obviously Ned had no intentions of harming her. However, if she had with her an heir to the Iron Throne then, well, the Kingsguard presence would be warranted. As an aside, not having the Tower of Joy dream in the show during the first season was one of my least favorite omissions.

    4. Jon isn't really dead. Again, this one is pretty commonly accepted. The scene at the beginning of Dance obviously supports the idea that, when a warg dies, they are fully capable of warging into another creature in order to stay alive. Why else is this chapter in the book at all if not to make it plausible that Jon will be able to remain alive inside of Ghost? Still, it makes for a fun discussion.

    5. The Jeyne Westerling that Jaime meets in Feast is not the same one that Robb marries, and the real one is pregnant with Robb's heir. Personally, I don't believe this one. I think Martin just made a mistake when describing a relatively unimportant side character in two separate books. The main reason I don't believe this is because I think it would overly complicate things when Jon finally finds out that Robb legitimized him, thus making him the King in the North (and also the Targaryen heir...the Song of Ice and Fire blah blah blah).

    6. Coldhands is Benjen Stark. This is another one I don't believe, and at the same time I don't think it's terribly important who Coldhands is. Maybe I'm wrong about both. Who knows?

    7. Loras Tyrell wasn't actually gravely wounded at Dragonstone. This one could go either way. All of the accounts of Loras' wounds are word of mouth, and word of mouth is ever a fickle thing in Martin's series. We've had so many different examples of this that it's hard to argue with the theory.

    8. To go along with the above, Stannis isn't dead and his army wasn't defeated outside of Winterfell. Really, all the information that was in Ramsay's letter could have been obtained from Mance, so this one seems pretty probable, especially given that Ramsay specifically demands to have Reek returned to him when Reek was with Stannis' army, at least the last time we saw him (which was technically the chapter from Winds that Martin released on his blog).

    9. In Dance, Lord Manderly has the three Freys with him on the journey to Winterfell killed and feeds them to the wedding guests in pies (Frey pies). This is a commonly accepted theory, especially after Manderly drunkenly demands to hear the Rat Cook (if you don't remember, look it up) song later. This is probably my favorite theory ever, and Manderly also drops the sickest bomb in the Seven Kingdoms later in Dance, thus strengthening my love for the man.

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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Brickman View Post
    For the record, this post has a lot of spoilers. I've blacked out the ones concerning future events in the series that have not yet been depicted on the show. I have, however, left any concerning events in the past that haven't been shown on the show because, much like the Tower of Joy scene, they may never be seen on the show and non-readers should know about them.

    Anyway, common theory is that Septa Lemore is Ashara Dayne, who was thought to have (if I recall correctly) hurled herself off a cliff after a miscarriage. The father of her out-of-wedlock baby was said by Barristan Selmy in ADWD as a Stark (presumably Brandon).

    This has, in turn, led to some natural speculation (and the phrase "Mummer's Dragon" in Dance) that perhaps Aegon is not really Aegon Targaryen but Ashara's bastard child. I could see this being the case, just as I could see Ashara harboring some resentment at the Starks/Lannisters/Baratheons after Robert's Rebellion.

    There are tons of crazy ideas out there, although how many of them are outside the box is questionable. I'll list a few.

    1. Sandor Clegane (named my German Shepherd after him, btw) is still alive and the gravedigger in Feast. This one isn't too out there, but what really remains to be seen is whether or not this will ever be brought up again or if it was just Martin giving a wink to his more observant readers.

    2. Tyrion is a Targaryen. There's a small amount of evidence to support this. For one, Aerys was noted to have had a thing for Tywin's wife. Second, Tyrion is noted to have more silvery blonde hair, whereas every other Lannister's hair is described as golden. Third, there's his different eye colors, or the fact that he's long had an obsession with dragons and, despite spending much time around the flux in Dance, never gets sick. There were more examples but the ones above are the ones I can remember off-hand.

    3. Jon Snow is not only the son of Lyanna and Rhaegar, but a legitimate Targaryen and, thus, the real heir to the Iron Throne. It's pretty commonly accepted that Lyanna and Rhaegar had an affair, had Jon Snow, and then both died and Ned covered it up to spare the baby's life (probably at Lyanna's dying request). What's less certain is whether or not Jon was truly a bastard or if Lyanna and Rhaegar married at some point before his birth. This would seem to account for why there were several members of the Kingsguard present at the Tower of Joy when Ned presumably went to reclaim Lyanna. Remember, Rhaegar was Aerys' eldest son, thus making him the heir to the throne and, in turn, any of his offspring the next in line to rule. Why would the Kingsguard be at the Tower to protect Lyanna after the war was lost? She would require no protection, as obviously Ned had no intentions of harming her. However, if she had with her an heir to the Iron Throne then, well, the Kingsguard presence would be warranted. As an aside, not having the Tower of Joy dream in the show during the first season was one of my least favorite omissions.

    4. Jon isn't really dead. Again, this one is pretty commonly accepted. The scene at the beginning of Dance obviously supports the idea that, when a warg dies, they are fully capable of warging into another creature in order to stay alive. Why else is this chapter in the book at all if not to make it plausible that Jon will be able to remain alive inside of Ghost? Still, it makes for a fun discussion.

    5. The Jeyne Westerling that Jaime meets in Feast is not the same one that Robb marries, and the real one is pregnant with Robb's heir. Personally, I don't believe this one. I think Martin just made a mistake when describing a relatively unimportant side character in two separate books. The main reason I don't believe this is because I think it would overly complicate things when Jon finally finds out that Robb legitimized him, thus making him the King in the North (and also the Targaryen heir...the Song of Ice and Fire blah blah blah).

    6. Coldhands is Benjen Stark. This is another one I don't believe, and at the same time I don't think it's terribly important who Coldhands is. Maybe I'm wrong about both. Who knows?

    7. Loras Tyrell wasn't actually gravely wounded at Dragonstone. This one could go either way. All of the accounts of Loras' wounds are word of mouth, and word of mouth is ever a fickle thing in Martin's series. We've had so many different examples of this that it's hard to argue with the theory.

    8. To go along with the above, Stannis isn't dead and his army wasn't defeated outside of Winterfell. Really, all the information that was in Ramsay's letter could have been obtained from Mance, so this one seems pretty probable, especially given that Ramsay specifically demands to have Reek returned to him when Reek was with Stannis' army, at least the last time we saw him (which was technically the chapter from Winds that Martin released on his blog).

    9. In Dance, Lord Manderly has the three Freys with him on the journey to Winterfell killed and feeds them to the wedding guests in pies (Frey pies). This is a commonly accepted theory, especially after Manderly drunkenly demands to hear the Rat Cook (if you don't remember, look it up) song later. This is probably my favorite theory ever, and Manderly also drops the sickest bomb in the Seven Kingdoms later in Dance, thus strengthening my love for the man.
    Isn't Aegon a Blackfyre (bastard Targaryen)? That's what I remember being the popular theory at least.

    7. I could definitely see this happening, but what would anyone have to gain by lying about his health?

  10. #1088
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by howler1313 View Post
    Isn't Aegon a Blackfyre (bastard Targaryen)? That's what I remember being the popular theory at least.
    That's another popular theory. Honestly, though, I personally think he'll either be legitimate, Septa Lemore's son (I mean, Martin does make a big deal about her stretch marks), or just some random kid from Lys (I believe it was the Lysene who often share similar features to Targs). It's entirely possible he could be a Blackfyre, though. But if he is, who is his father? That particular theory seems to add more questions than it removes, and I think the above three I detailed are simpler.

    Quote Originally Posted by howler1313 View Post
    7. I could definitely see this happening, but what would anyone have to gain by lying about his health?
    Honestly, it could be for any number of reasons. Cercei was obviously trying to get Loras killed, so faking his impending death would be a good way to make her think she's in the power position. The Tyrells are obviously angling for power in the Seven Kingdoms, and Loras is by far their best warrior, so keeping him alive while letting the Lannisters think he's dying could all be part of a power play to overthrow the Iron Throne.

    And just generally speaking, Martin has conditioned me to almost never trust word of mouth as relates to a character living or dying. If a previously important character dies off screen, I'll have a hard time believing it until one of the POV characters sees the corpse.

  11. #1089
    Formerly known as Talm MalTalm's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Brickman View Post
    That's another popular theory. Honestly, though, I personally think he'll either be legitimate, Septa Lemore's son (I mean, Martin does make a big deal about her stretch marks), or just some random kid from Lys (I believe it was the Lysene who often share similar features to Targs). It's entirely possible he could be a Blackfyre, though. But if he is, who is his father? That particular theory seems to add more questions than it removes, and I think the above three I detailed are simpler.



    Honestly, it could be for any number of reasons. Cercei was obviously trying to get Loras killed, so faking his impending death would be a good way to make her think she's in the power position. The Tyrells are obviously angling for power in the Seven Kingdoms, and Loras is by far their best warrior, so keeping him alive while letting the Lannisters think he's dying could all be part of a power play to overthrow the Iron Throne.

    And just generally speaking, Martin has conditioned me to almost never trust word of mouth as relates to a character living or dying. If a previously important character dies off screen, I'll have a hard time believing it until one of the POV characters sees the corpse.
    First off, I love the posts Jack. Great job.

    I'm pretty convinced that Aegon is not the real Aegon, and his origin is certainly debatable. I'm a believer in the Blackfyre background for a whole slew of reasons, the biggest being that it would resolve the Blackfyre rebellion plotline, as they defected from the Targaryens and attempted to conquer the throne themselves. In that scenario, Illyrio would actually be his father, as Illyrio's now-deceased wife Serra was the last Blackfyre. He would be fulfilling his wife's wish to restore the Blackfyre's to the throne. There are a few things in Dance to support this:

    Illyrio dressed Tyrion in rich clothes for a boy which hadn't been used in years, potentially his son.

    Illyrio had a particularly difficult time letting Aegon go without saying good bye when Tyrion and the Septa headed down the river. He kept asking to see "Young Griff" before they departed, and he was worried about how he was doing. He seemed particularly angry he didn't get to say good bye to the young boy.

    The Golden Company was founded by the Blackfyres and has always hated the Targaryens. On four previous occasions, the Golden Company sought to overthrow the Targaryens in the name of the Blackfyres, but each time they failed. When Viserys offered them a fortune to fight the Baratheon and Stark uprising, they showed up for the feast, refused to take the offer, and made fun of him. Now they are championing a "Targaryen". Also, until leaving with Aegon to conquer Westeros, the Golden company had never broken a contract before, regardless of danger or money. An interesting quote about that:

    While traveling on the Valyrian road with Illyrio, on the way to meet Griff and company, Tyrion questions Illyrio as to how he managed to get the Golden Company to break their contract with Myr. Illyrio wriggles his fat fingers and says:
    “Some contracts are writ in ink, and some in blood. I say no more.[2]”

    Finally, stollen from Reddit:
    A Dance with Dragons sees the appearance of Aegon Targaryen, supposedly the surviving son of Rhaegar and Elia Martell. The young prince is about the right age and has Targaryen features, so his claim is generally accepted by those who hear it.
    There's a reader-theory, though, that Aegon is actually a Blackfyre heir (and probably Illyrio's son) and not a Targaryen. Some evidence for this theory:
    The Golden Company, a mercenary group founded by Blackfyre survivors with the express purpose of eventually seating a Blackfyre on the Iron Throne, is supporting Aegon's claim.
    Although we're told that the Blackfyre's "male line" has died out, the odd specificity of this statement combined with the physical description of Illyrio's late wife seems to imply that the female line survived.
    The backstory of Robert's Rebellion suggests that Varys was feeding King Aerys's paranoia by claiming that Prince Rhaegar was attempting to organize lords to help depose him. This probably played a role in ensuring a violent transition of power, eventually eliminating (almost) the Targaryen line. If Varys is a Targ loyalist, this seems like a pretty bad move; as a Blackfyre supporter, though, his actions make perfect sense.
    None of that is new, but yesterday I was rereading A Feast for Crows and found a passage that seems to foreshadow Aegon's appearance in ADwD, specifically supporting the Blackfyre angle. In Brienne 7, Septon Meribald explains the history of "The Old Inn:"
    "...He forged a new sign for the yard, a three-headed dragon of black iron that he hung from a wooden post. The beast was so big it had to be made in a dozen pieces, joined with rope and wire. When the wind blew it would clank and clatter, so the inn became known far and wide as the Clanking Dragon."
    "Is the dragon sign still there?" asked Podrick.
    "No," said Septon Meribald. "When the smith's son was an old man, a bastard son of the fourth Aegon rose up in rebellion against his trueborn brother and took for his sigil a black dragon. These lands belonged to Lord Darry then, and his lordship was fiercely loyal to the king. The sign of the black iron dragon made him wroth, so he cut down the post, hacked the sign to pieces, and cast them into the river. One of the dragon's heads washed up on the Quiet Isle many years later, though by that time it was red with rust."
    Targaryens use a red dragon as their sigil; a black dragon is the sigil of house Blackfyre. After their defeat, the Blackfyres were diminished in number and forced across the narrow sea ("[he] hacked the [black dragon] to pieces, and cast them into the river"). Could this passage foreshadow the reappearance of a Blackfyre heir ("one of the dragon's heads") on Westeros's Western shore, whom - given the amount of time since Blackfyres were defeated - everyone takes for a Targaryen instead ("by that time it was red with rust")?
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  13. #1090
    So we come to it at last Chris's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    WOW @ "Some contracts are writ in ink, some in blood" line.

    I never even thought about that.

    The evidence for that theory is really mounting, I hope it is true because I think it's an awesome plot line. My only question is wouldn't Griff/Connington know about it? And we see his POV yet he never thinks about it...

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    Formerly known as Talm MalTalm's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    WOW @ "Some contracts are writ in ink, some in blood" line.

    I never even thought about that.

    The evidence for that theory is really mounting, I hope it is true because I think it's an awesome plot line. My only question is wouldn't Griff/Connington know about it? And we see his POV yet he never thinks about it...
    Connington met up with Aegon a few years down the road, after serving a few years with the Golden Company as arranged by Varys. Aegon looks like a Targaryen, and Jon Connington's real motivation is to restore his own name and Rhaegar's honor. If Aegon was not the real heir to the throne, Connington's life would be meaningless, so it's important he believe Varys story; it's all he has left.
    I've been nothing but complementary of Weeden.
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Not going to quote you, Malt, since it would just be a giant black wall, but nice post.

    One thing...if Aegon is indeed a Blackfyre, wouldn't the line about the male line dying out be inaccurate? I agree that the wording there is tricky, tough. Then again, the same could be said for dozens of Martin's lines, and not all of them mean something.

    Like Chris, I don't think I ever even gave a second thought to that "some in blood" line. That's probably the most compelling case for the Blackfyre theory that I've read yet (and I'm actually surprised this is the first time I've read it). As far as the question about Griff knowing, well, why would they tell him? Connington was totally gaygar for Rhaegar, and it stands to reckon that he might not have shit all over his honor and faked his death for some random Blackfyre kid.

    Perhaps the real question is why, if Aegon is indeed a Blackfyre, the people behind him would be pushing him to ally himself with Daenerys. As Malt mentioned, the Blackfyres were never on the best of terms with the Targs, so why make the alliance now? Obviously they never ended up making it to Mereen to actually go through with it, but I don't think anyone here can question that that was their plan. None of the viewpoints we see throughout Dance point to anything other than an Aegon/Dany marriage/alliance being the plan of Connington and his merry band.

    This is further complicated by the whole Illyrio/Serra theory. If Illyrio is fulfilling his dead wife's dream of putting a Blackfyre on the throne, why would he want to disguise the boy as a Targaryen?

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    So we come to it at last Chris's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    @ Jack, the last line of your post was another question I had too. Maybe they figured a Blackfyre on the throne, even disguised as a Targaryen, is still a victory for them?

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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris View Post
    @ Jack, the last line of your post was another question I had too. Maybe they figured a Blackfyre on the throne, even disguised as a Targaryen, is still a victory for them?
    Yeah that could definitely be the case. I think that, no matter the theory on who Aegon really is (assuming he's an impostor at all), there are still a ton of questions that could be asked to poke holes in it.

    Perhaps the most important question now is: Who does Varys really serve and why? He's obviously played a big role in events thus far, and killing Kevan Lannister and Grand Maester Pycelle will certainly make things messy in King's Landing going forward.

    ---

    Some more fun theories:

    1. Theon was gelded by Ramsay in the dungeons of the Dreadfort. To me, this one seems less a theory and more a "was it twig, berries, or all of the above?" There's a passage that basically confirms this:

    “Ramsay rose, the firelight shining on his face. “Reek, get over here. Get her ready for me.” For a moment he did not understand. “I … do you mean … m’lord, I have no … I …” “With your mouth,” Lord Ramsay said. “And be quick about it. If she’s not wet by the time I’m done disrobing, I will cut off that tongue of yours and nail it to the wall.”
    There's also the part where Theon is counting the fingers and toes that Ramsay has removed from his person, and he is sure to mention "that other thing." There's also a moment where he is thankful that he's not made to strip in front of everyone (implying that something humiliating has been done to him). This seems pretty cut and dry (pun!), although things are almost never cut and dry in Martin's world, so who knows? Theon does also make tons of references being emasculated, although whether this is literal or metaphorical is uncertain.

    Perhaps the most chilling part of this whole theory is that Theon makes sure to note that Ramsay never simply removes a body part. He flays it first and waits until the victim begs him to remove it.


    2. Jojen Reed was sacrificed and fed to Bran in the weirwood paste that Bloodraven gave to him. This is one I don't really agree with, but it's a fun theory nonetheless! There is a bit of evidence to support this, but all of it could simply be either misdirection or misinterpretation.

    Throughout the first two books that he's in, Jojen says things to the effect of, "This is not the day I die." While that in and of itself is meaningless, it implies that he knows there is a day coming where he will die, and it also implies that he will know which day that is when it comes. If you couple this with his deepening depression as the group moves further north of the Wall, once could come to the conclusion that he knows the day that he dies is coming soon.

    Then we come to Bran's content. There's the vision of a man being sacrificed to the weirwood and the resulting taste of blood. There's the past that Bran is sure to note looks like blood, and his revulsion to the taste. Finally, there's Bran's search for Jojen and Meera in his final chapter and his inability to find them. And don't forget that the cavern is littered with the bones of both men and animals.

    Oh, and there's this line:
    "He wants to go home," Meera told Bran. "He will not even try and fight his fate. He says the greendreams do not lie."
    While, as I mentioned above, I don't really believe this theory, it's not out of the realm of possibility. Martin has gone to great lengths to show the reader that magic does not come without a price, and often that price is a sacrifice.


    3. The Selasori Qhoran is the perfumed seneschal that Dany was warned about. I like this theory, although I'm not yet convinced that it's correct (I'll bring up my interpretation of this prophecy at the end). Obviously, in the books, Dany believes this to be a reference to Reznak mo Reznak, and he certainly fits the wording. However, in and of himself, Reznak does not seem terribly intimidating. He knows his place and, while he offers counsel, he pretty much does what he's told and, thus far, we haven't really seen anything that makes him come off as threatening to Dany or, really, anyone else.

    In Tyrion's Dance chapters, Martin makes a point of talking about the name of the ship that Tyrion ends up on, the Selasori Qhoran. The common tongue translation of that phrase is something to the effect of "fragrant steward," or, as Tyrion jokes, "stinky steward." There are several characters on this ship that may play a part in Dany's story in the future: Tyrion himself, Jorah Mormont, and the red priest Moquorro. While we have some insight into Tyrion's mind (and thus can come to the conclusion that he's probably not a danger to Dany, although she may be a danger to him), we have little and less insight into what Jorah or Moquorro are really thinking.

    Jorah may well be seeking vengeance, particularly now that Dany has married someone else. Moquorro, on the other hand, is a total wild card, and he now happens to be with someone (Victarion) who means to bind one of Dany's dragons to him and drag Dany back to Westeros as his bride. Whether Moquorro is just using Victarion as a means to get to Dany or whether he's actually supporting the man, we just don't know enough about him to truly trust him.

    As far as my opinion goes, I think the perfumed seneschal is Varys. He fits the description the best of anyone in the series, and he's also one of the more cunning, dangerous characters. If you couple that with Malt's theory about Aegon being a Blackfyre, perhaps the plan was never to wed Aegon and Dany, but rather to gain Dany's trust, use her for her dragons, and then eventually betray her.

    ---

    That's all I've got for now.

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    So we come to it at last Chris's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread

    It's not in Jorah's nature to do anything to threaten Daenerys. If anything, he is going to try to win her back IMO.

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