View Poll Results: If the Cavs get the second pick, who should they choose?

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  • Ben McLemore

    19 8.92%
  • Otto Porter

    129 60.56%
  • Anthony Bennett

    9 4.23%
  • Victor Oladipo

    24 11.27%
  • Alex Len

    30 14.08%
  • Other---

    2 0.94%
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Thread: 2013 NBA Draft

  1. #1501
    Draft Guru ajz20's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Great post Smooth: A couple things.

    I am not really sure Austin is going to be a center. Yes, 7 foot, but he is going to have to play away from the basket a lot for a few years until he adds more upper and lower body weight.Plus I feel like his is game is more geared to be a stretch 4 anyways. I agree that Zeller is a poor fit as well.
    What if we have the 4th, 5th or 6th pick and Len and Noel are long gone. It would be very foolish for Grant to pass on Muhammad (i think mclmeore would be gone as well) but you get my point. Yes, we need a center, but if the top 2 center prospects are off the board and you think Muhammad and Mclemore have a chance to be all star caliber wings, it would be foolish to just "take a center in Zeller, or just take Austin because he is 7 feet and skilled.

    This type of thinking leads to Marvin Williams being drafted ahead of Chris Paul and a guy like Paul Pierce slipping to 10th.
    If we are picking as low as 7th or 8th, I could very much see us taking a guy like Porter with our 1st pick, so I would not discount that scenario either. I think the FO wants Len the most and is very hopeful they wont have to use high end assets to move up to select him. Just my opinion based on the information out there.

    Also anyone suggesting Stien with a top 7 pick is way off base. He is a major project who would need a minimum of one season in Canton, and is light years away from being able to play in the NBA. That is a classic example of reaching for need.

    Homestar hit it on the head 100 percent. If a top 15- 20 nba talent is available via trade Dion and TT are by no means untouchable.
    Waiters could be gone by 2014 so there is no harm in selecting Muhammad or Mclemore!

    I also wanted to throw this out, Chad Ford's big board is not based on his evaluations, but Gm's front office executives and scouts. Take a look at his recent ratings.. some of them might surprise you.

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft...00/_/year/2013
    Last edited by ajz20; 01-30-2013 at 09:12 AM.

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  3. #1502
    Legit Wallhacker Be Nimble's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    If the Cavs can turn Tristan Thompson into a 15 ppg scorer as he has averaged for the last month, then I wouldn't be concerned about Noel becoming decent offensively either. He actually looks like a natural basketball player and his athleticism tops Tristan's too.

    At one point in the UK game last night, Bilas pointed out Noel's release point on his free throws. It was just about right in front of his face near the top of his flattop. Maybe I'm being extremely optimistic, but for some reason I feel like his shot could be correctable. I highly doubt Noel has ever had a shooting coach so it may not be a lost cause. Most of the horrible FT shooters are guys that are huge anyways (Drummond, Dwight, Blake, Reggie Evans, Deandre Jordan...) It at least gives me hope that he could become somewhat of an offensive threat.

    And for Isaiah Austin - no way do I see him playing center. And if he is playing center, I don't want him hanging around the perimeter, which is probably his biggest strength. I'm not too sure anyone wants Andrea Bargnani at center. You want to go for an enforcer there.

  4. #1503
    Team Player Homestar's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Smooth View Post
    I agree with you about BPA but the thing is that a big man who can play at a high level, will do more for this team and its development than McLemore or Muhammad will do... With the way this roster is currently constructed, this team really needs someone else down-low who can impact the game on both ends..

    While it's good to collect assets and build for future possibilities, if you build on what could be, you'll likely miss out of what's best for the building of your team..
    And I agree with that. I think McLemore and Muhammad are the two safest bets to become impact players this year, with Len and Austin in the next tier. That's why I want those guys the most based on BPA.

    I honestly wouldn't want Noel at any spot in the lotto. I think he is going to be an enormous bust.

    0-1 with 2 points in 36 minutes against Mississippi. Yeesh.

  5. #1504
    Faith In Breesus melecoaze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Homestar View Post
    And I agree with that. I think McLemore and Muhammad are the two safest bets to become impact players this year, with Len and Austin in the next tier. That's why I want those guys the most based on BPA.

    I honestly wouldn't want Noel at any spot in the lotto. I think he is going to be an enormous bust.

    0-1 with 2 points in 36 minutes against Mississippi. Yeesh.
    You forgot the ~~12 blocks~~

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  7. #1505
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Be Nimble View Post
    If the Cavs can turn Tristan Thompson into a 15 ppg scorer as he has averaged for the last month, then I wouldn't be concerned about Noel becoming decent offensively either.
    Yes, but that's if TT starts draining 15 & 18 footers regularly. If they are both garbage men, you'll see more of the same Thompson we saw playing along side Varejao.

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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by melecoaze View Post
    You forgot the ~~12 blocks~~
    Oh I remembered. And if instead of Ole Miss, that game was against the Bobcats, we'd be looking at 4-5 blocks. College shot-blockers drastically see their numbers get slashed at the next level.

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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Smooth View Post
    Let's also remember it's taken Tristan about 2 1/2 NBA season, a full off-season and a injury to Varejao to really start to come into his own...
    Are you from the future?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Homestar View Post
    Oh I remembered. And if instead of Ole Miss, that game was against the Bobcats, we'd be looking at 4-5 blocks. College shot-blockers drastically see their numbers get slashed at the next level.
    So 4-5 blocks is bad at the NBA level? The kid is a game changer without being an offensive threat. Besides that, he only took 1 shot. The real negative was his 2-8 from the FT line, but thats not the end of the world.

    OXFORD, Miss. — Nerlens Noel took just one shot from the field and missed six of eight free throws.

    Yet there was no doubt that the big man with the big hair was the most important player on the court as Kentucky beat No. 16 Mississippi 87-74 on Tuesday night.

    The 6-foot-10 freshman set a school record with 12 blocked shots and altered countless others, leading the Wildcats to their fifth victory in seven games.

    Kentucky coach John Calipari — who is always a tough critic — said Noel played well but was still struggling with consistency. Ole Miss coach Andy Kennedy was in a more complimentary mood.

    “He was the difference in the game,” Kennedy said. “I think we can all agree with that. An incredible defensive presence.”

  13. #1509
    Drafting workout allstars RchfldCavRaised's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Smooth View Post
    * I really don't see Chris Grant drafting a SG with the 4th pick; I just don't... He doesn't take someone that high, stick his neck out for the kid and say all throughout the process he's a starter to draft a SG to replace him... Whether or not it's the right move is another question, but I just don't see the Cavs taking a SG... Similar to how I don't think PF was ever in play for the Cavs with Thompson; CG drafted Thompson that high with the expectancy he was going to be a starter and a core piece...

    So unless the Cavs see McLemore or Shabazz as a 3 or would bring either of those guys off the bench, I just don't see how the Cavs draft them... With that said, I think there's a lot better chance the Cavs would draft Shabazz than McLemore with Shabazz being more of a bench scorer and able to play the 3... Whereas McLemore is very much a 3&D player with a little extra to his game that will be a solid, but nothing spectacular, bench player in my eyes...
    I think this thought process is the error of this rebuild which can potentially doom us to mediocrity and as of now has us in a position where "some" are banking on 2014 delivering us our second franchise player. I know it is not your though process, and instead you are just acknowledging the way we seem to approach, but it is faulty and stubborn to draft to try to support a pick of yours that hasnt already put out.

    The irony here, is that, going into a draft where there truly is only ONE player on the roster who has shown he is/should be considered a lock for his position/not upgradeable, the last two #4 picks to me still dont look like guys who should determine whether or not we take BPA on draft day.

    As much as Tristan has improved, I dont think he should be considered a guy we should pencil in, and then Dion just as well.

    We are building this backwards. We went and drafted a Shelden Williams type player and then a easily replaceable wing with character concerns like Marvin Williams the next year, when just like Atlanta who should have taken their PG first, we are now going into this draft needing to fill the spot and will have to settle for a worse talent like when they took Acie Law (Noel, Austin, Zeller are all just not as exciting to me, though Noel has the most star potential I think). *Before I get misinterpreted by Cavfanatic posters, I am not calling TT = Shelden and Im not calling Waiters = Marv Williams, just pointing out how in theory we drafted their positions before we got the pivotal two locked up like Atlanta*

    I'm trying to talk myself out of Ben McLemore being the best star potential player in this draft, and I cant. Despite some feeling like he is a 3 and D kind of guy.

    I watch the way he glides around the court and I watch him off the ball and watch the way he makes the game easier for his upperclassmen, watch the way he covers for Releford on D with weakside blocks like Bron, watch the way he CREATES lanes for Elijah Johnson by knowing perfectly when to cut and when to space for him to work, watch the he fearlessly makes mistakes like that turnover last game where he threw a crosscourt pass that got picked for a breakaway, and then you saw McLemore come down next time and go right to the rim to amend for giving up his dribble on the last possession.

    The kid is the best player in this class. All around. Like many, I see that his handle still needs tightened up. But it is not Paul George bad, however his athleticsm, prototypical size and shooting is already better than Paul George good.

    And then Shabazz, who I dont feel like should play strong stretches at 3, and will be underserved to do so. I love his all around offensive game but am not as impressed by his athleticism and his disengagement on D. I see too much Kyrie off the ball D in him to be Kyrie's backcourt mate. I dont like all of his body language, though I would take him if McLemore is off the board. I dont like his game off the ball as much as McLemore, but I think if he is dedicated at the 2 and gets a smaller guy matchup more, then I would like him off ball even more with alot of teams playing two undersized guys in the backcourt nowadays. He would instantly be a threat for our best post player anytime he got a smaller guy on him. Like Portland does with Wes Matthews and Batum depending on who gets the smaller wing defender.

    I agree with your assesment on all of the centers so I wont post mine. I will say I agree 100% with yours, though the big difference is that again, I dont want us to go into the draft with the thought process that had us passing on BPA last year again. I think Noel is best, Len is next best and Austin and Zeller both are crap shoots, though for different reasons and Zeller scares the shit out of me after earlier in the year he looked to have much more fight in him than he really does and Austin looks like a 5 who prefers to play like a 3 and I worry about if he comes out now with his build, would he ever get down there and fill out like he would need to at this level to be a 5.

    In short, I wonder how you came to the conclusion that McLemore was a 3 & D guy and a career backup like player?
    Last edited by RchfldCavRaised; 01-30-2013 at 10:00 AM.
    The Richfield Trade Deadline Survival Kit post... here

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  15. #1510
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    The only sure-fire studs I see are Noel and McLemore. I'm not really sold on Shabazz entirely, and I definitely don't feel as you guys do on Len. I just can't see him being much better than a 20mpg player off the bench.

    I also think Marcus Smart out of OKState has a real good shot at being the best PG in the draft and surprising a lot of people come next year. He's got the size to abuse a lot of the PGs in this league.

  16. #1511
    Rising Star *L-Train*'s Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Homestar View Post
    Yes, but that's if TT starts draining 15 & 18 footers regularly. If they are both garbage men, you'll see more of the same Thompson we saw playing along side Varejao.
    this can't be said enough, i really like Noel and i think he's exactly what we need on defense but the first thing i would do if we somehow land the first pick and draft him (imo there's a good chance he'll go first overall) is put TT on the trade market. not that that is necessarily a bad thing, if TT continues to put up 14&11 and you package him with some expiring contracts and picks you should be able to land a pretty good player... (here's hoping that Minny decides to put Kevin Love on the market this offseason...). anyway my point is i just can't see TT & Noel coexisting on offense...

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  18. #1512
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Smooth View Post
    Let's also remember it's taken Tristan about 2 1/2 NBA season, a full off-season and a injury to Varejao to really start to come into his own... This time last year people were saying the same things about Thompson that they're currently saying about Waiters...
    This is his 2nd year so its 1 1/2 NBA seasons, and really less than that because of the shortened season last year

  19. #1513
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by melecoaze View Post
    So 4-5 blocks is bad at the NBA level? The kid is a game changer without being an offensive threat.
    No, but if Noel comes into the NBA and averages 4 blocks a game in his rookie season, I'll walk to your house and hand you $1,000 cash.

    My point is that the only way you can afford to have a Ben Wallace on your team is if the other 4 guys are very capable offensive threats. God love Thompson, but I don't think he's going to be draining jumpers or playing face-up from 18 any time soon.

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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    If we have the #1 pick, the only 3 guys i'd want is Muhammad, Noel or McLemore in that order

  21. #1515
    Mmhmm. AMC's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by JMcCurry08 View Post
    If we have the #1 pick, the only 3 guys i'd want is Muhammad, Noel or McLemore in that order
    I honestly don't see the excitement in Muhammad. He does not provide the unique top level talent that teams look for as a #1 pick. I also do not see him being a game changer; he looks lazy with UCLA.

    The only player with the "unique top level talent" is Noel, without a doubt. An athletic big man with the defense he has, and the handling he has....you take him #1.

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