View Poll Results: If the Cavs get the second pick, who should they choose?

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  • Ben McLemore

    19 8.92%
  • Otto Porter

    129 60.56%
  • Anthony Bennett

    9 4.23%
  • Victor Oladipo

    24 11.27%
  • Alex Len

    30 14.08%
  • Other---

    2 0.94%
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Thread: 2013 NBA Draft

  1. #1801
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by jwalker1399 View Post
    How's he a glue guy if he can't share the ball? He's a role player. Big difference.

    His offense is nothing but flash.... get the ball, run fast, dunk. I've seen a dozen Indiana games this year and I haven't seen him exhibit any sort of feel for basketball....
    If you think the only thing he can do is dunk, you haven't been watching.

    What makes Oladipo so good? Quite simply, he can do it all.

    Oladipo is one of the best pure shooters in Division I.

    He ranks third in effective field goal percentage (69.7 percent), which takes into account the added value of three-pointers, and is also third in true shooting percentage
    (70.7 percent), which takes into account three-pointers and free throws. Oladipo is ridiculously accurate from both inside and outside the arc, making 68 percent of his two-pointers and 51 percent of his three-pointers.

    The last Big Ten player to finish a season with a two-point percentage of at least 60 percent and make more than half his three-point shots was Glen Rice in the 1989-90 season (min. 30 attempts).

    Oladipo's versatility sets him apart. He can spot up for an outside jumper and be aggressive around the basket converting second-chance points as well. He leads the Big Ten in points per play on both spot-up shots and putbacks of missed shots.

    Against the Wolverines, Oladipo also flashed his one-on-one skills. He created a season-best seven points off isolation plays, including a pass to Jordan Hulls for a three-pointer that put the Hoosiers up 64-58 with less than four minutes remaining.

    Oladipo would be arguably the best jump shooter to win the Wooden Award if he can maintain this pace the entire season. His effective field goal percentage and true shooting percentage would both be the highest of any winner, and he would be the only winner to finish the season making more than 60 percent of his twos and 50 percent of his threes (min. 10 attempts)

    Statsheet stuffer

    Oladipo is also one of the best defenders in the conference, leading the Big Ten in steals per game (2.5). He had a season-high six steals against Michigan State, leading to several easy baskets for the Hoosiers in the 75-70 win.

    Oladipo rebounds well for his position as well, grabbing 5.8 rebounds per game, one of the top five rates among Power 6 conference guards 6-foot-5 or shorter.

    Putting it all together, he could become just the second Big Ten player in the past 35 seasons to average at least 14 points per game, 2.5 steals per game and 5.5 rebounds per game. The only other player to do that was Iowa’s Ryan Bowen in the 1997-98 season.


    http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebaske...den-award-race
    So yeah, he's not perfect, but then nobody else in this draft is either. That's not even mentioning his freakish athleticism, which is usually one of the first things people look at when talking about potential. And to that freakish athleticism and demonstrated improvement his intelligence and work ethic, and you've got something more than a role player.
    Last edited by The Human Q-Tip; 02-07-2013 at 10:25 PM.

  2. #1802
    All Star howler1313's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Bill Walton makes every single game he commentates must-watch TV. Whatever ESPN is paying him, they need to triple it and hopefully get him back to NBA duties as well.

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  4. #1803
    Rising Star AvonCavsFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by jwalker1399 View Post
    Watch the Indiana-Illinois game. His holes were fully exposed tonight. He can't create for himself, he can't create for others. He's great in transition and will only score in half-court sets on cuts and the occasional open three (even though his shooting % are misleading this year). The Cavs need more than that out of a starting SG, especially since the current starting SG is the Cavs 2nd scoring option. Oladipo simply doesn't have the skill to be anything more than Tony Allen.

    And no, I would never start Oladipo over Waiters, ever. I don't care what other teams have done, Dion is the starter; he's a far more complete player.
    What does Dion do that makes him more complete at this point?

    He can get a shot for himself? What good is getting the shot if you don't make it? 38% this year. He is on a "hot" streak at 42% over his last 5 games. He is averaging 3.2 assists. It is selective memory on this board. Does Dion show flashes from time to time, sure. But he is still a far cry from being a sure thing all-star level player.

    Not sure how many ball dominant players you think a team can have. There is just ONE basketball on the court at a time. Both Kyrie and Waiters would benefit from playing with a guy like Oladipo. A guy who doesn't need the ball. Doesn't ball stop. Plays better D than either. Also the college game is more congested. Great athletes tend to do even better in the more open NBA game. We need some elite defenders on this team bad. And this guy has that potential.

    More Complete? There are quite a few wholes in Dion's game at the moment.
    Better D- Oladipo
    Better Shooter- Oladipo
    Better fit with a ball dominant PG- Oladipo
    Better rebounder- Oladipo
    Better Creator/Passer- Waiters
    Better Getting to Rim- Waiters

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  6. #1804
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    I don't think the attribute of creating shots for oneself or others should ever be disregarded.

    Don't fall too hard for a player you don't really know yet. For all we know, Oladipo might end up catfishing a team once we get some tangible measures and analysis from NBA scouts during the summer - which are usually much more thorough than college based data.

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  8. #1805
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Oladipo has no offensive game. He basically Ira newble. There is a role for him, but I don't see him being drafted top 15. The dribble game is going to hold him back.

  9. #1806
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    I changed my mind. Oladipo may be our pick with the laker selection. Unless we go with a project center.

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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by AvonCavsFan View Post
    What does Dion do that makes him more complete at this point?

    He can get a shot for himself? What good is getting the shot if you don't make it? 38% this year. He is on a "hot" streak at 42% over his last 5 games. He is averaging 3.2 assists. It is selective memory on this board. Does Dion show flashes from time to time, sure. But he is still a far cry from being a sure thing all-star level player.

    Not sure how many ball dominant players you think a team can have. There is just ONE basketball on the court at a time. Both Kyrie and Waiters would benefit from playing with a guy like Oladipo. A guy who doesn't need the ball. Doesn't ball stop. Plays better D than either. Also the college game is more congested. Great athletes tend to do even better in the more open NBA game. We need some elite defenders on this team bad. And this guy has that potential.

    More Complete? There are quite a few wholes in Dion's game at the moment.
    Better D- Oladipo
    Better Shooter- Oladipo
    Better fit with a ball dominant PG- Oladipo
    Better rebounder- Oladipo
    Better Creator/Passer- Waiters
    Better Getting to Rim- Waiters
    Selective memory? Dion is getting to the rack at ease in the NBA....no small feat. He's missed a few contested shots at the rim, probably been fouled 100 times but he's going to start making those shots or start getting calls. The fact he's putting himself in those positions at this stage in his career is pretty rare.... Does he take ill-advised shots at times? Yes. Is that because he's a rookie? Yes. Is he improving on shot selection over this so called "hot streak"? Yes.

    Two ball dominant players is too much? Seriously? Just wait until teams start to pay REAL attention to Kyrie; then get back to me on that one. You need multiple players who can CREATE FOR THEMSELVES and OTHERS so you can SHARE the ball on offense. Dion and Kyrie are just now starting to learn this but at least they have the skill and basketball sense to do so, whereas Oladipo can't at a proficient level; it's just not in his tool box.

    How can you possibly say Oladipo is a better fit next to a ball dominant PG? His basketball IQ is very low. Just because he's lightening fast, can hit the occasional open three, has a poor handle, and can't create for himself or others doesn't automatically making him a better fit with a ball dominant PG. Also, Dion is a way better shooter. Oladipo's might be shooting 50% from deep but he's only 70% from the line.... small sample size considering his poor shooting his first two years.

    It think we've found our forum draft darling this year......

  11. #1808
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Considering the Cavs' bias for drafting ''high-character'' players, this wont go unnoticed...


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  13. #1809
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel89 View Post
    Considering the Cavs' bias for drafting ''high-character'' players, this wont go unnoticed...

    Don't know what to make of Shabazz's reaction. I liked that he wanted the ball at the end but he seemed a little bit 'unhappy' even if they won - was he just being cool about it?
    Any man who must say, "I am the king" is no true king. - Tywin Lannister

  14. #1810
    Drafting workout allstars RchfldCavRaised's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Lionheart View Post
    Don't know what to make of Shabazz's reaction. I liked that he wanted the ball at the end but he seemed a little bit 'unhappy' even if they won - was he just being cool about it?
    I dont really care for Shabazz as much as others.

    He definitely felt that was his moment, and Larry Drew still thinks he has a chance as a pro prospect outside of a few summer league starts in Atlanta.

    Still...

    I dont like Muhammads overall approach to the game. I see him waaaaaaaay to dependent on getting and having the ball, and scoring, to be a great compliment to Kyrie.
    The Richfield Trade Deadline Survival Kit post... here

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  16. #1811
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by AvonCavsFan View Post
    What does Dion do that makes him more complete at this point?

    He can get a shot for himself? What good is getting the shot if you don't make it? 38% this year. He is on a "hot" streak at 42% over his last 5 games. He is averaging 3.2 assists. It is selective memory on this board. Does Dion show flashes from time to time, sure. But he is still a far cry from being a sure thing all-star level player.
    He's shot 42.9% over the last 30 days, not just the past five games. That's the same percentage as Damian Lillard, the probable rookie of the year, over the same period. It's only slightly lower than All-Star Russell Westbrook (43.2%) over the same period.

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  18. #1812
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by jwalker1399 View Post
    How can you possibly say Oladipo is a better fit next to a ball dominant PG? His basketball IQ is very low. Just because he's lightening fast, can hit the occasional open three, has a poor handle, and can't create for himself or others doesn't automatically making him a better fit with a ball dominant PG.
    You forgot to mention off-ball movement, playing in transition, offensive rebounding, and defense. I'd agree that based on offense alone, Oladipo is not a better fit. But the game isn't just offense. Rebounding and defense in particular, especially when you're talking about him playing next to a guy who is never going to be a threat to make the all-defensive team, is extremely important. Our backcourt defense really worries me long-term. The most reasonable best case scenario is that Kyrie and Waiters hopefully become an average defensive tandem at some point, and they're always going to be vulnerable to bigger 2 guards. Oladipo fills Kyrie's biggest hole as a player.

    In any case, I'm not saying that this is a guy we have to have at all costs. I'm supporting him in the context of comparing him to someone like Goodwin, another shooting guard people are discussing. It seems wasteful to me to draft another SG who doesn't give you all that much of a different look than Waiters. If we're going to go in the direction of drafting a 2 guard with the thought of replacing Waiters as a starter, then I think a guy like Oladipo who would add the ability to be a plus defender for the 1-3 position makes more sense than drafting another guy whose primary skill is breaking people down off the dribble.

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  20. #1813
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Can't wait to come back to this next year once Dion is absolutely destroying

  21. #1814
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by Be Nimble View Post
    Can't wait to come back to this next year once Dion is absolutely destroying
    I assume that KI will be destroying as well, which means both members of our starting backcourt will be destroying. Is it possible to win a championship when your two top scorers are both guards?

    The only team that I can think of in recent history that fits that mold are the 89-90 Pistons. So that's going back a ways, but it is possible. But I'd point out that they are both Hall of Fame players, and that Dumars made the All-NBA Defensive first team so they were a very good defensive backcourt as well.

    Having a backcourt that is all offense and little defense does not have a great track record of success.
    Last edited by The Human Q-Tip; 02-08-2013 at 11:21 AM.

  22. #1815
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    Default Re: 2013 NBA Draft

    Quote Originally Posted by RchfldCavRaised View Post
    I dont really care for Shabazz as much as others.

    He definitely felt that was his moment, and Larry Drew still thinks he has a chance as a pro prospect outside of a few summer league starts in Atlanta.

    Still...

    I dont like Muhammads overall approach to the game. I see him waaaaaaaay to dependent on getting and having the ball, and scoring, to be a great compliment to Kyrie.
    I agree for the most part since he seems like he has to be a volume shooter and put up a lot of shots to be fully engaged, but the ways in which he gets his shots wouldn't be too bad on the Cavs. He doesn't run the pick and roll much at all, and his iso's don't seem to be too effective. Seems like he's best spotting up, coming off screens for jumpshots, finishing in transition, or posting up his man. Wouldn't be too bad since he wouldn't need the ball much to take those shots, but he just seems to need to take more shots than would be available on the Cavs.

    As a pro prospect I'm still not sold on him. He's not the most athletic guy by any means, and it seems so much of his game is based on bullying and being physically bigger/stronger than the man guarding him. As an NBA SF that's not going to happen too much, I really wish he was 2 inches taller.

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