2012-2013 Indians Red Hot Offseason Thread (Bourn signed post 1940)

[b00bie]

Let's trade our only good players that are on decent contracts! Welcome to Cleveland Indians baseball.

Pathetic that we even have to trade guys like Choo and Asdrubal now even though they aren't going to make huge $.

They aren't? Don't tell that to Scott Boras.

What is the market for them, if you'd care to enlighten us.

[Gimme Some Mo]

They aren't? Don't tell that to Scott Boras.

What is the market for them, if you'd care to enlighten us.

Why the hell would they get huge money if they are as mediocre/ok as you say they are?

[sgm405]

Let's trade our only good players that are on decent contracts! Welcome to Cleveland Indians baseball.

Pathetic that we even have to trade guys like Choo and Asdrubal now even though they aren't going to make huge $.

We don't have to...they'd only deal him for the right package. If you get Lance Lynn and Matt Adams or Matt Carpenter you do it in a heartbeat.

[Tecumseh]

We don't have to...they'd only deal him for the right package. If you get Lance Lynn and Matt Adams or Matt Carpenter you do it in a heartbeat.

Better yet, lets make them give us Brien Taylor and Todd Van Poppel.

[b00bie]

Why the hell would they get huge money if they are as mediocre/ok as you say they are?

Because they'll be the first above average but not elite players to get overpaid in free agency.

[Amherstcavsfan]

The reason they are trading their better players is because they have shown time and again that they may be talented but they are not winners.

I'm sorry that some people cannot see it, but trading them is the right idea. In fact, they should have pushed harder to do it at the deadline.

[Pyro]

Speaking of Scott Boras, he just fired off some shots at the Dolans.

[bushwick_bill]

Speaking of Scott Boras, he just fired off some shots at the Dolans.

Please go on.

[JMcCurry08]

http://www.cleveland.com/tribe/index...l#incart_river

It's only a matter of when Shin-Soo Choo becomes a former Cleveland Indian
Published: Thursday, November 08, 2012, 10:51 PM Updated: Thursday, November 08, 2012, 10:58 PM
By Paul Hoynes, The Plain Dealer

INDIAN WELLS, Calif. — One way or the other, Shin-Soo Choo is gone.
The Indians can trade him this off-season. They can trade him at the non-waiver or waiver deadlines in July or August.
Or they can keep him the entire 2013 season and make him a qualifying offer after he becomes a free agent so they can be compensated through the draft. The qualifying offer this off-season for players who spent their final year before free agency with one team was $13 million for a one-year deal.
Choo's agent is Scott Boras. The Indians have tried to extend Choo's contract at least twice.
Boras does not believe in negotiating extensions with players in their final season before free agency.
Boston is facing the same situation with center fielder Jacoby Ellsbury. The Braves are seeing it unfold right now with center fielder Michael Bourn, who received their qualifying offer, but is expected to reject it.
Ellsbury and Bourn are Boras clients.
So what is the market for Choo, 30, and how can General Manager Chris Antonetti make it work to his advantage?
Boras, not surprisingly, sees a bright horizon for Choo.
"We all know he's one of the best young outfielders in the game," Boras said. "There is really a demand for a guy who gives you offense and defense. He's shown the ability to lead off and hit in the middle of the lineup.
"He's really a valued player."
Choo made $4.9 million this year. He's eligible for arbitration in January and mlbtraderumors.com estimates his salary could climb to $7.9 million for 2013.
Antonetti said the door is still open for an extension. He added there has to be interest on both sides to get a deal done.
Boras, talking to reporters Thursday at the general managers meetings, said he will continue to negotiate for Choo on an "annual basis" in regard to 2013. He also fired a shot across the bow of owners Larry and Paul Dolan.
"Choo's let it be known that he has a desire to win," Boras said. "I think the ownership in Cleveland, foundationally, they're going to have to illustrate some dynamics with new revenues and where they stand about what they do to show their fan base and their players who they are in competing.
"That's a new calling that they are going to have to bring forth to give players, and everybody involved, [an idea] about what their intentions are in their ownership."
If Choo is traded, his new team will have him for only the 2013 season. Then he's a free agent. That won't help Antonetti max out Choo's value when dealing with teams that have small to mid-range payrolls. For those teams, the more control they have over a player in terms of years, the better they like it and the more they are willing to part with in a trade.
There are exceptions.
GM Brian Sabean, whose Giants won their second World Series in the past three years last month, took a chance on Carlos Beltran in 2011. He acquired him midway through the season from the Mets even though Beltran was eligible for free agency at the end of the year.
"We were coming off the World Series [2010]," Sabean said. "We'd just lost Buster Posey and really had no offense to speak of. If we wanted to survive, which we almost did, and get back to the postseason, you have to cross that bridge.
"The fans demand it. The organization and the players expect it. To get a good player, you have to give somebody up, even though you know it could be a rental. If Beltran doesn't get hurt, it might have been different. But he did and the rest is history."
The Indians are coming off a 94-loss season. In terms of trading his top players such as Choo, Asdrubal Cabrera, Chris Perez and Justin Masterson, Antonetti has an "open mind."
"If there is the right deal, and it makes sense, we'll move on it," he said. "But we like a lot of the players we're bringing back. We still have a lot of good major-league players. We need to find a way to build a championship team around them."
It's believed Boston and the Yankees have an interest in Choo. Other teams in need of outfield help include Texas, Atlanta, Baltimore, Tampa Bay, Detroit and Seattle.
Choo hit .283 (169-for-598) with 43 doubles, two triples, 16 homers and 67 RBI. He scored 88 runs and stole 21 bases.
He hit just .199 (41-for-206) with two homers and 13 RBI against lefties. Against righties, he hit .327 (128-for-392) with 14 homers and 54 RBI.
Defensively, he was a finalist for a Gold Glove award.
One scout said there has been a slight drop in Choo's overall ability simply because of age. He added that Choo is still a good major-league player with a strong left-handed bat.
Now it's up to Antonetti to turn that into something that can help the Indians in 2013 and beyond.

[Nom]

A sports agent giving someone crap about trying to turn a profit is hilarious.

[Juicy]

I don't think he's young for a 30 year old. What kind of market is there for a guy who has hit over 20 home runs in his career. Twice. Never had over 100 RBI's. And he had 150 strikes out last year, he played in 155 games, so basically once a game he is striking out. Boras is over valuing Choo big time.

[macbdog]

Choo needs to be traded. It is evident he won't be signing a longterm deal before hand and wants to test the market, and that is his right. You don't sign Scott Boras to negotiate without letting him use his best leverage, the open market. Alot depends on how some of these teams view Choo vs the available FAs, but some teams, like Atlanta, will probably want to trade for someone vs. commit longterm, so that has to be factored in too. This team desperately needs young starting pitching so let's see what they can get done.

As for Asdrubal, Pluto and more than a few others across the web have made a clear case for why he needs to be traded. His range has continued to diminish, the conditioning issues that have been a question since his minor league days are still there, and his contract boosts is value since he is cost-controlled. With 3-4 young SS prospects who could be here within 1-2 years, there is little chance he lasts as the team's SS for more than that same timeframe. If the club can fill a huge need- such as a couple of young starting pitchers- they need to make a move. Aviles is better defensively and is league average offensively. He could hold the fort for a year or so until one of the young guys is ready. It just makes too much sense if the right deal comes along. I personally like the Lynn/Carpenter rumors, immediately fill a hole in the rotation while getting another starter to groom.

[RealKingofCleve]

The fact that Choo and Cabrera are this team's best players just illustrates the completely incompetent front office the Indians have had. Haven't brought it any talent whatsoever.

[schimmk]

Choo is completely overvalued because of the lack of competent hitters around him. Sure he's a nice player but not of the caliber it appears Boras and himself believe he is. It's pretty clear he's going to bolt at the first opportunity he gets. Hopefully Antonetti will find a trade for Choo so we don't wind up empty handed when he leaves.

[Juicy]

I pray we stay away from Jason Bay. Hasn't been good since he played in Boston. His time with the Mets was awful.