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  1. #151
    All Star BigErieCavsFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Loyal T View Post
    Anyone ever thought that it might be smarter for us to trade TT rather than AV?
    YES!!!

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  3. #152
    Hall of Famer Mdog1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    I don't think anyone wants to trade Andy to the Heat for that Philly pick... We aren't talking about trading him to a contender that doesn't have assets. Minni could make sense for us I guess, if we think DWill can ever put it together. I'd like to give him the chance personally, and i'd love to see what this version of Andy could do with a top flight passer like Rubio. Not saying Kyrie isn't good at passing, but I think Rubio is better in that regard. If Andy is still on this team in March then that means he got injured again imo. After he's traded I don't care if he gets injured (I wouldn't wish it on him of course), but i'm going to be pissed if he is injured before the trade. Andy getting injured is one of the reasons I believe we don't have James Harden right now.

  4. #153
    Rising Star KB's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Mdog1 View Post
    I don't think anyone wants to trade Andy to the Heat for that Philly pick... We aren't talking about trading him to a contender that doesn't have assets. Minni could make sense for us I guess, if we think DWill can ever put it together. I'd like to give him the chance personally, and i'd love to see what this version of Andy could do with a top flight passer like Rubio. Not saying Kyrie isn't good at passing, but I think Rubio is better in that regard. If Andy is still on this team in March then that means he got injured again imo. After he's traded I don't care if he gets injured (I wouldn't wish it on him of course), but i'm going to be pissed if he is injured before the trade. Andy getting injured is one of the reasons I believe we don't have James Harden right now.
    I think Derrick Williams and an unprotected Minny 1st for 2014 would be close to the top offer and only if Min is in contention

    I think Williams would play better with Kyrie than he did with Rubio

    Kyrie opens more space up on the floor with his ability to shoot the lights out, something Rubio has not proven he's been able to do consistently, ever.

    If that continues the D will just sag off Rubio and try to force him to hit jumpers

    Williams would be perfect in the high post p & r as long as he stays inside 18 feet

    I kind of expect Williams to turn into a player similar to David West (not as good but similar style) when he gets consistent time.

  5. #154
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by KB View Post
    I think Derrick Williams and an unprotected Minny 1st for 2014 would be close to the top offer and only if Min is in contention

    I think Williams would play better with Kyrie than he did with Rubio

    Kyrie opens more space up on the floor with his ability to shoot the lights out, something Rubio has not proven he's been able to do consistently, ever.

    If that continues the D will just sag off Rubio and try to force him to hit jumpers

    Williams would be perfect in the high post p & r as long as he stays inside 18 feet

    I kind of expect Williams to turn into a player similar to David West (not as good but similar style) when he gets consistent time.
    Minnesota looks good even without love they will be in the playoff hunt. They also have memphis pick so they should be added in the deal cause they need a big like AV.

  6. #155
    Rising Star jlegg21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    After reading the last few pages, a few things...

    Why would a team trade an All-Star or potential future All-Star for 30 year old Anderson Varejao when he himself has never played in an All-Star game?

    Why do people think Anderson Varejao's presence on this roster is so vital when reality is, he's in his prime NOW and 35 wins would be an achievement?

    Why are some of you hell-bent on riding this horse into the ground instead of getting some value in return and building around our promising guard combo?

    This is a classic example of fans completely over-valuing one of their own. I love all that Andy has given to the Cavs, but reality is, if we dont get something for him very soon, we'll be stuck with a gritty hustle player whose greatest asset (using his length and athleticism to keep plays alive) will be rapidly declining. Some of you seem to think he's more than he is. I hope the Cavs Brass is smarter than that.

    This team needs a 4 or 5 (preferably both) who can score points, a Small Forward with a pulse, and an entire bench. Trading Andy could very well help the Cavs find some of those pieces, therefore making it a necessity.

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  8. #156
    The Bushido doctrine Homer Safari's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by jlegg21 View Post
    After reading the last few pages, a few things...

    Why would a team trade an All-Star or potential future All-Star for 30 year old Anderson Varejao when he himself has never played in an All-Star game?

    Why do people think Anderson Varejao's presence on this roster is so vital when reality is, he's in his prime NOW and 35 wins would be an achievement?

    Why are some of you hell-bent on riding this horse into the ground instead of getting some value in return and building around our promising guard combo?

    This is a classic example of fans completely over-valuing one of their own. I love all that Andy has given to the Cavs, but reality is, if we dont get something for him very soon, we'll be stuck with a gritty hustle player whose greatest asset (using his length and athleticism to keep plays alive) will be rapidly declining. Some of you seem to think he's more than he is. I hope the Cavs Brass is smarter than that.

    This team needs a 4 or 5 (preferably both) who can score points, a Small Forward with a pulse, and an entire bench. Trading Andy could very well help the Cavs find some of those pieces, therefore making it a necessity.
    Does Miami win their first championship without Mourning, Payton, and Shaq?

    does Kobe win his first championship without guys like Harper, Rice and Brian Shaw?

    does duncan win his first championship without Robinson, Avery johnsn and mario elie?

    even the bulls with michael jordan and Scottie pippen took a post thirties Bill Cartwright to the promise land.

    I see the piston as one of the few champions that did not have a guy over 30 in their champonship lineups and the piston had Clifford Robinson as a veteran presence the two years before.


    Theres a lot of reasons why a team in their low twenties regardless of talent develop into a farm team for other squads (nineties clippers, last years Wizards, instead of maximizing their talent, typically its because they didnt have guys who were experienced professionsals who can do what the coach ask in a consistent manner.

    Irving has alot of talent. Waiters looks to. Zeller looks like the protoypical grunt guy. what they dont have is consistency and experience.

    Talent doesnt win championships. sure its a requisite but everyone has talent in the NBA. you need guys like AV to make that talent effective.

    The Cavs number 1 priority is to develop the talent they have. AV's presence is key to that development so the cavs dont want to make any moves that stalls that build.

    the younger the core is when they start competing at a playoff level the better chance of producing a championship.

    The Cavs dont have to trade AV as part of ther build but if they do they definately need get tangible quality in return.

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  10. #157
    A Dream of Spring CardiacCavs's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Frank Reynolds View Post
    I really think Kyrie would be pissed off if we traded Varejao. Kyrie has developed a chemistry with him very quickly. Irving also always shows appreciation for Varejao's intangibles and finishing inside. I really think Varejao is Kyries favorite player to be playing with, even more so than Dion right now.
    This kind of thinking is what got us in trouble with Lebron. No player is more important than the organization and they should know that. Should we take into consideration his opinion? I suppose. Should it be a deciding factor? No. To do otherwise would be a mistake that I think Grant and Gilbert are smart enough to avoid doing a second time.

  11. #158
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    If possible I would try to bring on someone like Milsap, keep AV, and move TT to the bench. You rest AV and Milsap for Zeller and TT. That in my mind would be a perfect big man rotation. It would also provide Zeller and TT more time to grow and two guys to shape their game after.

  12. #159
    Hall of Famer Mdog1's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by BRInQ View Post
    If possible I would try to bring on someone like Milsap, keep AV, and move TT to the bench. You rest AV and Milsap for Zeller and TT. That in my mind would be a perfect big man rotation. It would also provide Zeller and TT more time to grow and two guys to shape their game after.
    Millsap is an UFA after this season I believe... If we threw the farm at him then he might be a possibility. I think Utah would give him the same contract, but with the bird rights though. Still wouldn't hurt to offer it.

  13. #160
    A Dream of Spring CardiacCavs's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Mdog1 View Post
    Millsap is an UFA after this season I believe... If we threw the farm at him then he might be a possibility. I think Utah would give him the same contract, but with the bird rights though. Still wouldn't hurt to offer it.
    throwing the farm...at...Millsap? Maybe we should aim a little higher with our crazy cap space or maybe not use it all. He's a good player, don't get me wrong, but I'm not sure if he is who I would want to invest that heavily in.

  14. #161
    Team Player Homestar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by jlegg21 View Post
    After reading the last few pages, a few things...

    Why would a team trade an All-Star or potential future All-Star for 30 year old Anderson Varejao when he himself has never played in an All-Star game?

    Why do people think Anderson Varejao's presence on this roster is so vital when reality is, he's in his prime NOW and 35 wins would be an achievement?

    Why are some of you hell-bent on riding this horse into the ground instead of getting some value in return and building around our promising guard combo?

    This is a classic example of fans completely over-valuing one of their own. I love all that Andy has given to the Cavs, but reality is, if we dont get something for him very soon, we'll be stuck with a gritty hustle player whose greatest asset (using his length and athleticism to keep plays alive) will be rapidly declining. Some of you seem to think he's more than he is. I hope the Cavs Brass is smarter than that.

    This team needs a 4 or 5 (preferably both) who can score points, a Small Forward with a pulse, and an entire bench. Trading Andy could very well help the Cavs find some of those pieces, therefore making it a necessity.
    He's gotten better with age. If he stays healthy, he will likely lead the NBA in rebounds this season, or come damn close.

    Throughout the LeBitch years, he was used as an energy guy off the bench... now he is given a starting role and is relishing in it. I know their situations are not the same, but you could almost kind of compare it to how Harden has performed so far.

    I outlined it in my previous post - most championship teams don't have two dynamic bigs. They have one scoring/creating big, and one clean-up guy. I'd take Varejao over the Perkins/Anthony's/Asik's of the NBA. Wouldn't you?

    I don't know why everyone thinks we are 5 years away. After another good draft this year and having one of the cleanest salary caps in the NBA, I see no reason why we can't be in the playoffs next season and a title contender in two years. We aren't under Dolan. We don't have an owner that accepts anual garbage.

    This is the last possible "tank" year. I'm already suspicious with Andy's "sore knees."

    Champion Blueprint:

    Creating #1 Option Type Wing -
    Creating #1-2 Option Type Big - (possibly Waiters)
    Dynamic Point Guard - IRVING
    Prolific defending wing that can shoot the 3 -
    Garbage man big - VAREJAO
    ------------------------------------
    Instant Offense Wing Player - (possibly Waiters)
    Energy Big off the bench - (possibly Zeller)

  15. #162
    I hate Florida rabman_gold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    It's true that Andy's impact on the game as one of the focal points would make his value really high (a top 10 pick), but the lack of floor time and amount of season-ending injuries drops his value that much (a later first round pick).

    In essence, we need to stop being so unrealistic about his value and wait for a better offer to come along, so good enough to turn it into more assets. It's too late now to make him a part of the future because we never know if he'll being around for the long run. We need an impact player who's 25 years of age (or around there) and it may be through the draft or through different trades.
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  17. #163
    Rising Star jlegg21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Quote Originally Posted by Homestar View Post
    He's gotten better with age. If he stays healthy, he will likely lead the NBA in rebounds this season, or come damn close.

    Throughout the LeBitch years, he was used as an energy guy off the bench... now he is given a starting role and is relishing in it. I know their situations are not the same, but you could almost kind of compare it to how Harden has performed so far.

    I outlined it in my previous post - most championship teams don't have two dynamic bigs. They have one scoring/creating big, and one clean-up guy. I'd take Varejao over the Perkins/Anthony's/Asik's of the NBA. Wouldn't you?

    I don't know why everyone thinks we are 5 years away. After another good draft this year and having one of the cleanest salary caps in the NBA, I see no reason why we can't be in the playoffs next season and a title contender in two years. We aren't under Dolan. We don't have an owner that accepts anual garbage.

    This is the last possible "tank" year. I'm already suspicious with Andy's "sore knees."

    Champion Blueprint:

    Creating #1 Option Type Wing -
    Creating #1-2 Option Type Big - (possibly Waiters)
    Dynamic Point Guard - IRVING
    Prolific defending wing that can shoot the 3 -
    Garbage man big - VAREJAO
    ------------------------------------
    Instant Offense Wing Player - (possibly Waiters)
    Energy Big off the bench - (possibly Zeller)
    Tornicade - Still ignoring you without actually hitting "ignore".

    Homestar and Andy supporters - If this were NBA2K and I could turn the Injury setting to "Off", sure, I'd keep him around and play him 40 mins a night. The starting role seems to suit him by the numbers, but that doesnt tell the whole story. The more minutes he plays and the more he bangs, dives, hustles, and does Andy things, the injury odds go WAY up. He's not the kind of guy who can pace himself and go 80% either. Just not in his nature.

    Honestly, I think that's another reason it's so important we trade him now, before the rest of the league figures out that he cant hold up in an expanded role. The last couple of years proved to me that he can be productive for half a season with starter's minutes, but there's no way he'll last 70-80 games with that workload. That makes him a specialized player and ultimately not as valuable.

    Rabman hit the nail on the head. We (or better yet, the FO) need to be realistic about the asset we have, and it's vital that we turn him into a younger piece to add to a very promising core.

  18. #164
    Team Player Homestar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    How many times does it need to be addressed that his two long inactive stints were due to oddball injuries?

    I'm also 100% convinced that he could have EASILY returned in plenty of time last year if we weren't in a full-blown tank.

    I understand Varejao plays recklessly, but I don't believe it to just be a coincidence that during our title runs years, he wasn't getting hurt. When we are tanking, he is suddenly missing games.

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  20. #165
    Situational Stopper RyanStackAttack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Anderson Varejao Trade Ideas

    Anderson Varejao and Tristan Thompson for Al Horford?

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