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  1. #406
    All for one RonG's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdy89 View Post
    Grant knew we needed offensive help. Drummond didn't provide that, particularly not paired in a front court with TT given where their respective games are at.

    He basically traded long term for short term as Dion helps more this year than Drummond likely would offensively.

    Long term though we would have had a defensive stopper at center had we gutted through another year of misery offensively before we could draft a Shabazz type.

    I would feel like the Thunder long term if we had a Kyrie/Shabazz/Drummond big 3 vs. a Kyrie/Waiters/Shabazz big 3.

    Waiters offered more immediate help this year than Drummond, but the long term trade off is painful because we won't get another bite at a Drummond type apple while there is a Waiters type in every draft.
    birdy we should be drafting on highest upside best player available in every position but PG at this point. If Grant based his choice based off your reasoning then he should be fired.

  2. #407
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    Not completely defined, but if you look closely you'll see a lot of what a player will eventually be. The thing is usually struggling rooks don't have starter minutes lavished on them like Dion - and now Dion no longer does. So where will his numbers go?

    But if you want to have some fun, pull up the per36 numbers for some players and compare them from rookie year through their career. You may see some improvements in efficiency in various areas, even some dropoff, but you should also see many of the stats end up around career average.
    There's something to be said for there still being about 50 games to go too. Dion has already gotten his finishing up at the rim to about 50% and trending upward, so that's a good sign. If he can improve gradually over the remaining games this year his statistics can still look significantly better by season's end.

    Plus, it's not as if the kid doesn't have plenty of areas that he can improve. He obviously needs to work on his shooting stroke, which I can only assume is something that will be more likely to happen during the off-season than during an actual season. His main assets are that he has an NBA body, that first step, and the passing ability, and those are the types of things you can't teach. His problems, on the other hand, all seem fairly correctable, albeit given time and effort.

  3. #408
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Brickman View Post
    There's something to be said for there still being about 50 games to go too.
    Absolutely. His rookie season isn't in the books yet, and as GCCSteel points out his per36 production isn't a complete disaster. His efficiency has been nose-diving, however, and he needs to start reversing that ASAP.

    Dion can and will improve, but what we're all wondering what his ceiling is going to be ... and nothing he's done in College or in the Pros so far has him leaning towards the "Wade track" .vs. the Ben Gordon or Jamaal Crawford track. Plenty of basketball players have skills and can get you buckets, but there's only one ball and when the ball is in a player's hands ... you want him executing a skill he's proficient at.

    So, just to be clear, I'm not one of the ones who's written Dion off - I just don't think he's shown all-star type talent - not in the NCAA, and not so far in the NBA.

  4. #409
    Rising Star MRMsix6's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jon View Post
    Dion can and will improve, but what we're all wondering what his ceiling is going to be ... and nothing he's done in College or in the Pros so far has him leaning towards the "Wade track" .vs. the Ben Gordon or Jamaal Crawford track.
    Any time someone compared Waiters to Wade it was because of his play style and body type, not because he was going to be as good as Wade.

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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by MRMsix6 View Post
    Any time someone compared Waiters to Wade it was because of his play style and body type, not because he was going to be as good as Wade.
    Sure. It's pure hyperbole to say any unproven player is going to be as good as an established superstar, but for instance when someone is labelled the "next Jordan" you're expecting someone like a Kobe, Grant Hill, LeBron, TMac, etc, ... not the next Harold Miner.

    If all Jim Boeheim meant is that there were stylistic and and body shape similarities, not potential upside ... then he probably should have reached for another example because mentioning "Wade" is just too loaded.

  6. #411
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Birdy89 View Post
    Back at it again tonight with 8 points, 11 boards, 4 blocks and a steal in his 17 minutes.
    He has star written all over him.

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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    with decisions like this you can see why many wanted lebron to leave the cavs.

    i mean how can you draft waiters over drummond? waiters wasnt even a starter in college.

  8. #413
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by sammyvine View Post
    with decisions like this you can see why many wanted lebron to leave the cavs.

    i mean how can you draft waiters over drummond? waiters wasnt even a starter in college.
    Because sometimes a statement is so stupid, words are pointless:


  9. #414
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    I don't know if a lot of people actually view this thread. But since it is more based on a comparison of the player and a future player I thought it appropriate to place it here.

    Since most of us were Drummond Supporters. Are we just as excited to add Noel to this team?

    I am torn atm. Drummond to me, was the big, tough, large, athletic, and fast Center that I wanted.

    Now on to Noel: He is putting up GREAT Defensive numbers, but god dam he is so skinny. He actually has bulked up which is great, but his frame just looks so small and his shoulders too. Also, like Drummond, he has the Size/Speed.

    Ultimately: Can we discredit him, and not draft him, because he doesn't have a Jumpshot and doesn't fit next to TT? Are we going to miss out on another draft pick because of TT?

  10. #415
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Len View Post
    I don't know if a lot of people actually view this thread. But since it is more based on a comparison of the player and a future player I thought it appropriate to place it here.

    Since most of us were Drummond Supporters. Are we just as excited to add Noel to this team?

    I am torn atm. Drummond to me, was the big, tough, large, athletic, and fast Center that I wanted.

    Now on to Noel: He is putting up GREAT Defensive numbers, but god dam he is so skinny. He actually has bulked up which is great, but his frame just looks so small and his shoulders too. Also, like Drummond, he has the Size/Speed.

    Ultimately: Can we discredit him, and not draft him, because he doesn't have a Jumpshot and doesn't fit next to TT? Are we going to miss out on another draft pick because of TT?
    I think there were reasons beyond his fit next to Thompson that went in to the team's decision not to draft Drummond. From everything I've read, Noel doesn't appear to have any of the big man red flags that Drummond had coming out of school.

  11. #416
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Brickman View Post
    I think there were reasons beyond his fit next to Thompson that went in to the team's decision not to draft Drummond. From everything I've read, Noel doesn't appear to have any of the big man red flags that Drummond had coming out of school.
    Ya, I remember the RedFlags, ie: Competing against his peers and such. But his Raw Size and Athleticism was so hard to look past.

    Now with Noel: Size (weight), is what concerns me. Adavis isn't setting the world on fire atm, but he still is producing. But unlike Noel as I have read, ADavis can shoot a jumpshot and out to the 3 point line.

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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Len View Post
    Ya, I remember the RedFlags, ie: Competing against his peers and such. But his Raw Size and Athleticism was so hard to look past.

    Now with Noel: Size (weight), is what concerns me. Adavis isn't setting the world on fire atm, but he still is producing. But unlike Noel as I have read, ADavis can shoot a jumpshot and out to the 3 point line.
    Yeah but Noel is also younger than Davis was last year. He'll have time to put on the weight, especially once he gets on a team and has dedicated trainers to work with.

    Also, having access to the NBA's HGH circle will do wonders for him.

  13. #418
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Should have taken Drummond last year then we could just pick between Ben or Shabazz this year.

  14. #419
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Len View Post
    Should have taken Drummond last year then we could just pick between Ben or Shabazz this year.
    I think the idea of taking picks with next year's draft in mind is a huge mistake. You don't know where you're going to be picking, and for all we know McLemore and Muhammad could be off the board when our number is called.

  15. #420
    Catch the wave Yanni Football's Avatar
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    Default Re: The Andre Drummond Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Brickman View Post
    I think the idea of taking picks with next year's draft in mind is a huge mistake. You don't know where you're going to be picking, and for all we know McLemore and Muhammad could be off the board when our number is called.
    This is true but I don't think that was the point. A lot of us wanted this team to go after Drummond, not because of the next draft, but because of his freak combination of size and athleticism. It's more of a hindsight thing, what if we had gotten Drummond like I wanted in the first place? That would leave us in position to go BPA rather than forcing the pick to be a big (I think McLemore or Bazz will be BPA).

    It's nothing against Waiters as he's had some nice flashes. It's just hard to swallow passing on Drummond for an undersized scoring 2 guard. Waiters may make some all-star games in the future, but he'll never be a superstar. Drummond has the ability to be a Dwight like center.
    Ass pennies

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