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  1. #76
    Team Player Prime 1978's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by Amherstcavsfan View Post
    Alex Smith absolutely can win a Super Bowl and be an Elite QB.

    There is no heinous flaw in his game that would prohibit this.
    As a 49ers fan I can easily tell you that his flaw is arm strength. He struggle with the deep ball and throwing outside of the hashmarks. One of the biggest reasons Harbaugh made the QB switch was because Kap makes the opposing defense have to account for the whole field. Smith has such a high completion percentage because he throws mostly short passes. IIRC in the game on Monday night where he went 19/20 he never threw the ball beyond 15 yrs. Yes that will work on the lesser teams that can't challenge the 49ers defense but the elite teams will and have exploited that. Most notably the Giants. Yes Kyle Williams was the goat for last years NFC championship game but Smith only completing one pass for 3yrds to a WR certainly didn't help. At one point from the 3rd qtr to overtime the Giants punted 7/8 possession (iirc I'm going straight from memory so forgive me if I'm off a little) and the 49ers only scored 3 points during that stretch. Yes Kyle Williams muffed 2 punts but if your offense can muster a TD drive, you win that game.

    Another weakness I can point out is that he doesn't put up enough TDs in the redzone. There was a reason that David Akers set a record for most fieldgoals made in a season last year. I think they had oe of the worst redzone offenses last year. That also came back to bite them in the ass in that Giants loss.

    I disagree with the no having a flaw statement but I agree whole-heartedly that he'd be an upgrade over the older Weeden. I'm just not sure Alex Smith is a QB capable of winning the big game meaning Super Bowl.

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  3. #77
    Team Player Prime 1978's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by Prime 1978 View Post
    As a 49ers fan I can easily tell you that his flaw is arm strength. He struggle with the deep ball and throwing outside of the hashmarks. One of the biggest reasons Harbaugh made the QB switch was because Kap makes the opposing defense have to account for the whole field. Smith has such a high completion percentage because he throws mostly short passes. IIRC in the game on Monday night where he went 19/20 he never threw the ball beyond 15 yrs. Yes that will work on the lesser teams that can't challenge the 49ers defense but the elite teams will and have exploited that. Most notably the Giants. Yes Kyle Williams was the goat for last years NFC championship game but Smith only completing one pass for 3yrds to a WR certainly didn't help. At one point from the 3rd qtr to overtime the Giants punted 7/8 possession (iirc I'm going straight from memory so forgive me if I'm off a little) and the 49ers only scored 3 points during that stretch. Yes Kyle Williams muffed 2 punts but if your offense can muster a TD drive, you win that game.

    Another weakness I can point out is that he doesn't put up enough TDs in the redzone. There was a reason that David Akers set a record for most fieldgoals made in a season last year. I think they had one of the worst redzone offenses last year. That also came back to bite them in the ass in that Giants loss.

    I disagree with the no having a flaw statement but I agree whole-heartedly that he'd be an upgrade over the older Weeden. I'm just not sure Alex Smith is a QB capable of winning the big game meaning Super Bowl.

    I correct myself, they actually had THE worst redzone offense in 2011.
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...e-in-football/

  4. #78
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns


    Browns QB wish list
    1) Blake Bortles
    2) Teddy Bridgewater
    3) Johnny Manziel
    4) Jimmy Garoppolo
    5) Derek Carr

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  6. #79
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by JMcCurry08 View Post

    Don't trust this dude.

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  8. #80
    Bania'd RappSoda's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Cleveland needs a "franchise QB", Smith thinks he's one. Cleveland has a lot of cap space and a great offensive line. To think that both sides aren't kicking the tires on this scenario is close-minded. Whether it happens or not is one thing, but you bet there is going to be interest.

    Cavaliers | Browns | Indians | Buckeyes | Red Hawks

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  10. #81
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Major question here.


    How much money does this guy get?

  11. #82
    Cleveland Sports Homer DDJ7777's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Enough that it would be stupid to sign him.

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  13. #83
    Rising Back Up chrisrich91's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    His arm rivals Colt McCoy's for noodliest in the league.

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  15. #84
    Playin' for keeps... Spectre's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by Prime 1978 View Post
    As a 49ers fan I can easily tell you that his flaw is arm strength. He struggle with the deep ball and throwing outside of the hashmarks.
    Consider though:

    On Throws of 20+ Yards:
    Brandon Weeden: 11/52 (21%), 429 yards, 8 TD, 6 INT - 61.5 QB rating
    Alex Smith: 8/17 (47%), 273 yards, 3 TD, 1 INT - 108.4 QB rating

    On Throws to Left/Right Sideline:
    Brandon Weeden: 139/266 (52%), 1542 yards, 7 TD, 9 INT - 64.5 QB rating
    Alex Smith: 79/114 (69%), 956 yards, 9 TD, 1 INT - 117.4 QB rating

    Like you said, he's an upgrade over Weeden and that's all that matters to me. I don't think Weeden is going to be taking a team to a Super Bowl. I have my doubts about Smith but he was on his way this year and I think he's a LOT closer to being at that point than Weeden even though he's a year younger. Weeden's arm strength advantage is irrelevant because of how inaccurate he is.

    It's not like we're choosing a 29 year old who is close to maxed over a 22 year old with a bright future, we're talking about a 29 year old who is close to maxed over a 30 year old who needs a lot more development just to get up to the 29 year old's level. Add in the fact that Smith took his benching like a total champ this year and per Harbaugh is a great QB mentor/teacher and it's a no-brainer IMO.

    Copy what the 49ers did with Kaepernick: bring in Smith, draft a strong armed QB outside of the 1st for Smith/Norv to mentor and move Weeden on to a team needing a backup while he still has some trade value. After doing that, the QB position has a solid guy in the present and hopefully in a year or two a stud waiting in the wings. That's a much better solution to me than the alternative people are throwing out there: let Weeden give it another go and if he sucks, draft a guy next year. We found out last year that strategy is flawed if you're not picking #1. We have the talent to win some games now if we can upgrade QB. It's something we should strongly consider.

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  17. #85
    Situational Stopper Nw220's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    The only reason i dont hate the idea is because i feel Smith>Weeden and thats not a hard thing to say,for those of you saying let Weeden develop i just dont see it....He is a turnover machine and in the long run id rather have a game manager than a guy who will throw a pick six and cost us the game...

    Will Alex Smith win us a superbowl??Id defentily say no but i think he could be are answer until this regime drafts there future at QB which is not Brandon Weeden...

  18. #86
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    Consider though:

    On Throws of 20+ Yards:
    Brandon Weeden: 11/52 (21%), 429 yards, 8 TD, 6 INT - 61.5 QB rating
    Alex Smith: 8/17 (47%), 273 yards, 3 TD, 1 INT - 108.4 QB rating

    On Throws to Left/Right Sideline:
    Brandon Weeden: 139/266 (52%), 1542 yards, 7 TD, 9 INT - 64.5 QB rating
    Alex Smith: 79/114 (69%), 956 yards, 9 TD, 1 INT - 117.4 QB rating

    Like you said, he's an upgrade over Weeden and that's all that matters to me. I don't think Weeden is going to be taking a team to a Super Bowl. I have my doubts about Smith but he was on his way this year and I think he's a LOT closer to being at that point than Weeden even though he's a year younger. Weeden's arm strength advantage is irrelevant because of how inaccurate he is.

    It's not like we're choosing a 29 year old who is close to maxed over a 22 year old with a bright future, we're talking about a 29 year old who is close to maxed over a 30 year old who needs a lot more development just to get up to the 29 year old's level. Add in the fact that Smith took his benching like a total champ this year and per Harbaugh is a great QB mentor/teacher and it's a no-brainer IMO.

    Copy what the 49ers did with Kaepernick: bring in Smith, draft a strong armed QB outside of the 1st for Smith/Norv to mentor and move Weeden on to a team needing a backup while he still has some trade value. After doing that, the QB position has a solid guy in the present and hopefully in a year or two a stud waiting in the wings. That's a much better solution to me than the alternative people are throwing out there: let Weeden give it another go and if he sucks, draft a guy next year. We found out last year that strategy is flawed if you're not picking #1. We have the talent to win some games now if we can upgrade QB. It's something we should strongly consider.
    The fact that he only threw the ball deep (20yrd or more) only 17 times in 9 starts says a lot. Outside of the hashmarks were a lot of intermediate passes that have a lot of RAC and that increases the yrds per completion number. It's a staple in the offense to throw quick passes to the WRs based on coverage.
    I agree with your post though.

  19. #87
    Banņed cafemerald's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by Nw220 View Post
    The only reason i dont hate the idea is because i feel Smith>Weeden and thats not a hard thing to say,for those of you saying let Weeden develop i just dont see it....He is a turnover machine and in the long run id rather have a game manager than a guy who will throw a pick six and cost us the game...

    Will Alex Smith win us a superbowl??Id defentily say no but i think he could be are answer until this regime drafts there future at QB which is not Brandon Weeden...
    Alex Smith had 10+ turn overs in every year he started without Harbaugh. So, Smith drastically reduced his turn over ratio due to what? Developing? No. It was mostly due to the game plan. If your coach tells you "We are throwing deep this play. No audibling" and the deep ball is triple covered... is that really the quarterbacks fault?

    I just don't see how people can look at a quarterback that can only be considered average at best and think... 'let's give up cap space for this guy'. I really don't understand why people think Alex Smith is good, instead of what he is... a product of a good offensive system. This guy barely threw the ball... ever. Of course he is going to have a good completion percentage. The defense is trying to stop the run. It isn't that hard of a concept.

    Weeden could be a game manager if that is what his offense asked of him... However, Shurmur asked him to throw the ball. A lot. Weeden's poor performance and Smith's decent performance are both direct results of the play calling. They are both pretty much equal with Weeden gettinig the slight nod in my book due to his arm strength.

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  21. #88
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    This thread should be titled: Alex smith, why or why not
    Browns QB wish list
    1) Blake Bortles
    2) Teddy Bridgewater
    3) Johnny Manziel
    4) Jimmy Garoppolo
    5) Derek Carr

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  23. #89
    Playin' for keeps... Spectre's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by cafemerald View Post
    Weeden could be a game manager if that is what his offense asked of him...
    A game manager to me is someone who (while not taking over a game himself) allows the running game/defense to take the game over by being consistent, accurate and reducing turnovers. To me that's a description of the exact opposite of Weeden.

    He's a gunslinger. You might think that Shurmur's offense limited Weeden but just wait and see what happens if he's allowed to open it up. For some reason, people think a vertical passing game will raise Weeden's completion percentage and reduce turnovers despite the fact that the throws he'll be asked to make are much, much tougher. Again, he had a 20% completion percentage at 20+ yards. If he turned the ball over, missed throws and forced passes when he was asked to throw simple WCO timing routes, I'm almost afraid to see him air it out.

  24. #90
    Hall of Famer MoFlo's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    Consider though:

    On Throws of 20+ Yards:
    Brandon Weeden: 11/52 (21%), 429 yards, 8 TD, 6 INT - 61.5 QB rating
    Alex Smith: 8/17 (47%), 273 yards, 3 TD, 1 INT - 108.4 QB rating

    On Throws to Left/Right Sideline:
    Brandon Weeden: 139/266 (52%), 1542 yards, 7 TD, 9 INT - 64.5 QB rating
    Alex Smith: 79/114 (69%), 956 yards, 9 TD, 1 INT - 117.4 QB rating

    Like you said, he's an upgrade over Weeden and that's all that matters to me. I don't think Weeden is going to be taking a team to a Super Bowl. I have my doubts about Smith but he was on his way this year and I think he's a LOT closer to being at that point than Weeden even though he's a year younger. Weeden's arm strength advantage is irrelevant because of how inaccurate he is.

    It's not like we're choosing a 29 year old who is close to maxed over a 22 year old with a bright future, we're talking about a 29 year old who is close to maxed over a 30 year old who needs a lot more development just to get up to the 29 year old's level. Add in the fact that Smith took his benching like a total champ this year and per Harbaugh is a great QB mentor/teacher and it's a no-brainer IMO.

    Copy what the 49ers did with Kaepernick: bring in Smith, draft a strong armed QB outside of the 1st for Smith/Norv to mentor and move Weeden on to a team needing a backup while he still has some trade value. After doing that, the QB position has a solid guy in the present and hopefully in a year or two a stud waiting in the wings. That's a much better solution to me than the alternative people are throwing out there: let Weeden give it another go and if he sucks, draft a guy next year. We found out last year that strategy is flawed if you're not picking #1. We have the talent to win some games now if we can upgrade QB. It's something we should strongly consider.
    I'm not saying Alex Smith isn't the better QB at this point in time, but let Alex Smith throw the ball 20+ yards 52 times like Weeden did, with an inept coach & playcaller, and you'll see a dramatic drop off that 108.4 rating.

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