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  1. #106
    Playin' for keeps... Spectre's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by MoFlo View Post
    Put Weeden in the shotgun, where he's most comfortable, and you'll see improvement. Nobody can succeed when not put in a position to.

    I'm not saying he'll definitely be great, but he can improve.

    Weeden's season has nothing to do with the fact that Alex Smith just simply doesn't fit an offense that wants to have a vertical passing attack.
    You want to talk about not being able to succeed when not put in a position to? Alex Smith played for 6 different coordinators in his first 6 years and was yanked in and out of the lineup like crazy. He finally got some stability in Harbaugh's system and bam, instant improvement in Year 2. The fact that he got benched for Kaepernick isn't a knock on him at all. Not only was Kaepernick their future from the moment they drafted him, he's pretty darn good too and has insane physical upside.

    Weeden can improve, sure, but think how much he'll have to improve just to get to the level that Smith is at now. Who is to say he gets there in 2-3 years? Even if he does, who's to say he'll be better? Gambling on an uncertainty is fine when the upside is high but when you're talking about a 30 year old who might only give you a handful of decent years (if he even gets there)? Not so much.

    Norv ran that passing attack for 5 years with Philip Rivers who definitely doesn't have ideal arm strength. He's coached Smith before so he knows what he brings to the table. Smith clearly loved playing for Norv so if Norv thinks he has the juice to run his offense, why wouldn't we go with the guy who is polished? I keep trying to think of advantages Weeden has over Smith but once I get past arm strength and the throws it allows, I find myself grasping at straws. Arm alone does not make a good QB.

  2. #107
    Cleveland Browns HOF LT Qasim Mitchell's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKTRAIN View Post
    Need to be a damn QB and stay with him.... I do not want Smith, lets keep Weeden and see what he does.... Bring in Greg Jennings at wideout then your defiantly going to be able to evaluate a QB when you finally have a good wide receiver
    This.

    I think at this point, I would take Greg Jennings over Mike Wallace. That of course is based on the assumption that Greg Jennings's health checks out. Would love to see Jennings teach BWeezie (or whomever else is our QB) those back shoulder throws in the red zone.

    The team we need to worry about the most who can grab Jennings is Miami. They have a ton of cap space, and of course there is the Philbin/GB connection.

    Where do you guys see Jennings going? And who prefers Wallace?

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  4. #108
    Legit Wallhacker Be Nimble's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    I don't understand why everyone is obsessed with Mike Wallace. If he's not catching 60 yard bombs, he is virtually worthless. He even has drop problems. I wouldn't want Wallace at any price. Use the money elsewhere.

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  6. #109
    Administrator MoFlo's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by Spectre View Post
    You want to talk about not being able to succeed when not put in a position to? Alex Smith played for 6 different coordinators in his first 6 years and was yanked in and out of the lineup like crazy. He finally got some stability in Harbaugh's system and bam, instant improvement in Year 2. The fact that he got benched for Kaepernick isn't a knock on him at all. Not only was Kaepernick their future from the moment they drafted him, he's pretty darn good too and has insane physical upside.

    Weeden can improve, sure, but think how much he'll have to improve just to get to the level that Smith is at now. Who is to say he gets there in 2-3 years? Even if he does, who's to say he'll be better? Gambling on an uncertainty is fine when the upside is high but when you're talking about a 30 year old who might only give you a handful of decent years (if he even gets there)? Not so much.

    Norv ran that passing attack for 5 years with Philip Rivers who definitely doesn't have ideal arm strength. He's coached Smith before so he knows what he brings to the table. Smith clearly loved playing for Norv so if Norv thinks he has the juice to run his offense, why wouldn't we go with the guy who is polished? I keep trying to think of advantages Weeden has over Smith but once I get past arm strength and the throws it allows, I find myself grasping at straws. Arm alone does not make a good QB.
    I never said Smith was put in a position to succeed, and I even said I like Smith, which I do.. a lot, actually. But none of that has anything to do with him not having the arm for a vertical passing attack.

    If we try to fit Smith in this passing attack, we'd be doing exactly what the Niners did, not putting him in a position to succeed. Rivers might not have the best throwing motion, but he definitely has an advantage over Smith in arm strength.

    Turner coached him for all of 1 year, and in that year, he threw the 2nd most passes in his career, and it resulted in throwing a career high 16 picks.

    I never once said arm strength is all that matters in a QB. But if you're going to have a vertical passing attack, it'd make sense to have a QB who, I don't know... can make the downfield throw. Say what you want about Weeden, but he proved he can make it. Put him where's he's most comfortable (an up-tempo, shotgun based, downfield offense), and he'll improve & show some success. You can't say the same for Smith.

  7. #110
    Team Player beefstew's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKTRAIN View Post
    Need to be a damn QB and stay with him.... I do not want Smith, lets keep Weeden and see what he does.... Bring in Greg Jennings at wideout then your defiantly going to be able to evaluate a QB when you finally have a good wide receiver
    Not sure if you can call a wide out at 28 with chronic injury problems a "good" wide receiver. Packers have made every one and their mother look like a stud at wide out, Jennings is going to want a pay day of more than he is worth.

  8. #111
    Roll Tribe! TheRealKTRAIN's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Well with the Browns having no receivers at all got to pay up and get someone..... I don't know what you are trying to say

  9. #112
    Team Player beefstew's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKTRAIN View Post
    Well with the Browns having no receivers at all got to pay up and get someone..... I don't know what you are trying to say
    Pretty sure I made it clear what I was trying to say.... Jennings is a no.

  10. #113
    Roll Tribe! TheRealKTRAIN's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Hahaha how is he a noo when the Browns have the second highest free agency money... They have the money to get a receiver who needs a change in scenery. No one else out there that can be better for the Browns to grab and no rookies either stand out. PAY THE MAN!!!

  11. #114
    Hall of Famer AZ_'s Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKTRAIN View Post
    Hahaha how is he a noo when the Browns have the second highest free agency money... They have the money to get a receiver who needs a change in scenery. No one else out there that can be better for the Browns to grab and no rookies either stand out. PAY THE MAN!!!
    No.

    Downside of his career, and has no reason to sign here.

    Paying him a large amount of money is stupid.
    Manziel's reps also insist it's a hoax -- and he's never made a penis video on "It's a Small World" or any other Disney ride.
    Quote Originally Posted by CavsFanLA View Post
    a skill that probably fits well in the world of PR where you want to listen tothe opinion of someone who thinks they know more than you

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  13. #115
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by b00bie View Post
    No.

    Downside of his career, and has no reason to sign here.

    Paying him a large amount of money is stupid.
    Agree with everything you just said. Plus the guy seems to be getting hurt all the time.

  14. #116
    Banņed caf's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKTRAIN View Post
    Hahaha how is he a noo when the Browns have the second highest free agency money... They have the money to get a receiver who needs a change in scenery. No one else out there that can be better for the Browns to grab and no rookies either stand out. PAY THE MAN!!!
    Amendola and Hartline are much better receiving options in free agency.

    You can always pick out a fan who doesn't follow a sport closely when he says "Pay [Insert well known player on the decline] any salary he asks for!" It's just ignorance and a lack of following that sport and a lack of understanding the teams financial situation.. both short and long term.

    I should know. I spout that nonsense off in the Indians thread all the time.

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  16. #117
    All Star MDLT's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Quote Originally Posted by mofire View Post
    Agree with everything you just said. Plus the guy seems to be getting hurt all the time.
    Yep. Entering the latter half of his career and struggles to stay on the field of late. No thanks.

  17. #118
    Team Player beefstew's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Rather give Chad Johnson some lunch money and ritalin than over pay for Jennings

  18. #119
    All Star howler1313's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    Trying to bid big for Jennings would be a classic case of paying a guy based on his history of production instead of based on what you think he'll earn with future performance. Definite pass, his days of playing at a pro-bowl level seem to be over.

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  20. #120
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    Default Re: 2013 NFL Free Agency: Browns

    What does everyone thing it would take to get DRC? He had a pretty shit year in Philly, so I can't think he'll be at the top of their list to bring back or at the top of anyone else's big board. He was very highly regarded in Arizona under Horton though.

    Also, I've heard that Dallas won't bring back Anthony Spencer now that they're moving to the 4-3. He had a pretty good year across from Ware. I'd be good with bringing him in if it's not too expensive.

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