Oden

[Douglar]

1 - We won't use all of our cap space until the 2014 offseason, but have to at least hit the league minimum salary this offseason

That's not how it works. There's no reason to sign someone just to sign someone.

1) There isn't any requirement for reaching min team salary. All that happens if the team has a low payroll is that all the players on the team get a bonus to bring the team salary up to min team salary.

2) The Cavs don't have to hit minimum salary during the off season. The min salary payouts don't happen until the end of the season. Keeping extra cap space during the season opens up lots of trade possibilities.

[KI4MVP]

High risk if he's still drinking and partying...that's a bad influence for some young, easily influenced, young players...at any price. Especially if we are trading for a major piece and need the extra money to make a huge trade or signing happen.

assumption 4 - he's serious about his NBA career and everything required to make it successful. Certainly stay away from him if he's not.

[Frank Reynolds]

That's not how it works. There's no reason to sign someone just to sign someone.

1) There isn't any requirement for reaching min team salary. All that happens if the team has a low payroll is that all the players on the team get a bonus to bring the team salary up to min team salary.

2) The Cavs don't have to hit minimum salary during the off season. The min salary payouts don't happen until the end of the season. Keeping extra cap space during the season opens up lots of trade possibilities.

You'd have to think that the Cavaliers are going to want all of the extra space possible to make a potential deal happen in 2013-14.

I think the Cavaliers are going to make a big trade at some point next season. Maybe it's before the draft, maybe it's trade deadline, maybe even next draft.

We can argue for days that our 2014 target is going to be LeBron, and it very well might, but he's not the only player out there, he's certainly the best and we'll probably try to get him. If that doesn't work, it would still behoove the Cavaliers to get Kyrie his second star player next season, going into 2014. LeBron is not the only player that would like to join an up and coming "big 3". If the Cavaliers have a "big 2" next season, that's to say another star player running with Irving, I think other players will consider Cleveland more strongly than usual.

We need to do that for our own reasons first, and that is keeping Kyrie here long-term (which I think we'll be able to do anyways). It would just be in our best interest to make this next season really count towards something greater.


If Oden is looking for guaranteed money, I'd be suspicious of his drinking and drug habits.

If Oden is really trying to prove that he can play again, the Cavaliers should try to get him to sign a very flexible contract with plenty of potential outs for the Cavaliers to cut him prematurely.

Wonder if Oden would be interested in rejuvenating his career with the Canton Charge?

[KI4MVP]

Cartilage damage is totally different from a ligament tear. A ligament tear can heal completely. Ligaments don't get worn down gradually by wear and tear. There are widely available procedures to replace torn ligaments with stronger ones. On the other hand, once cartilage is gone, it ain't coming back. Cartilage wears down every day you live. You can sit out two months, two years, or twenty years, but your body will never heal damaged cartilage. There is no procedure to restore damaged cartilage to a normal, healthy state (not even at the Cleveland Clinc). Basically, it would be a miracle for his knees to be in the same condition they were in when Portland drafted him.

Sure, you can reduce the inflammation (Orthokine), and you can replace damaged cartilage with inferior (weaker) cartilage (microfracture surgery). Those work fine for people dealing with gradually diminishing cartilage due to age, or for people with small, isolated defects in their cartilage. Oden falls into a different category. His cartilage has proven time and time again that it is simply not up to the task of supporting an NBA basketball player. It would be absolutely bizarre for his knees to go longer without injury in Cleveland than they did in Portland. His longest stretch of games without a knee injury was 45 games, and he would have to literally quadruple that number to have any chance of helping the Cavs when they're contending in the playoffs. I'm not sure what's more crazy...thinking he can go that long without a knee injury, or thinking he'll be able to come back from yet another knee injury, when his most recent one has kept him out for 2+ years.

time and time again? He has proven to successfully recover from his injuries before he came into the league (he later had a minor microscopic followup surgery). He's chipped his left knee cap on February 13, 2009 and then broke it on November 23, 2009. That is his NBA injury history. The second injury is suspicious of doctors not properly treating the first injury.

And people can regrow cartilage. Kobe had a procedure to do just that a couple of years ago.

Sampson has led a pilot study looking at the use of PRP therapy for knee osteoarthritis, which is what Kobe and many other young athletes suffer from. "These athletes are so tough on their bodies that we see people in their mid-twenties coming in with bone-on-bone joints," he says. "If they were older you might suggest joint replacements. But that's not feasible in someone so young."

Sampson's initial results suggest that PRP therapy can alleviate many arthritic symptoms, with the average patient reporting a significant decrease in knee pain after 16 weeks of treatment. (He also observed a thickening of cartilage in the joint, suggesting that real healing was taking place.) Follow-up studies confirm these optimistic results, at least in younger patients.

[Frank Reynolds]

time and time again? He has proven to successfully recover from his injuries before he came into the league (he later had a minor microscopic followup surgery). He's chipped his left knee cap on February 13, 2009 and then broke it on November 23, 2009. That is his NBA injury history. The second injury is suspicious of doctors not properly treating the first injury.

And people can regrow cartilage. Kobe had a procedure to do just that a couple of years ago.

Yeah, I believe Kobe had an orthokine procedure in Germany. What's crazy is how well Kobe is playing this season, he's very aggressive taking it to the hole like he's 21 again this season.

He's a normal sized 6-6 man. It seems the procedure is working for him. You never know if it's his competitive drive that's pushing him for this long, or if it's the Orthokine, Cryo, Platelet Rich Plasma Therapy or what.

With a guy of Bynum's height and stature, no amount of Ortho-Cryo-Plasmagenic surgery is going to correct the fact that his body is out of balance. Kobe Bryant's body is not out of balance, he's in very good condition, all of these guys do Yoga and stretch every muscle that us Normal Americans neglect to work in our 9/5's.

Bryant has been bouncing around like this since he was a 15 year old kid. Bynum is not very athletic, he's just massive.

Greg Oden however, was pretty damn explosive at OSU. His length was incredible too, he looked like a throwback C with a ton of athleticism and natural defensive abilities.

Had he stayed healthy, he very well could have been the best center in the league. With Dwight's mental softness, his coddling in LA, I think Greg Oden could very well be best center in the league right now. He said it kills him inside to see Durant being among the best in the game, he feels he'd be right there in the conversation.


If I were Greg, I'd take the Derrick Rose route, do not come back until you are 110% ready. Once he's 110% healthy, he needs to look for a good situation for himself.

[NarlCavs]

I don't think anyone was in favor of signing Oden if the background checks, testing and examinations didn't all look fairly good or promising and the money it would take to sign him got too high.
If he checked out and you could get him for a reasonable contract than it would be a risk worth taking. If questions remain about his attitude and behavior or the knees look like there's little chance they can hold out than you move on. You also do not get into any bidding war for Oden.

Cavs will have more access to info than me so I trust their decision. I was in favor of bringing him in if things checked out and looked fairly promising. If not than it's no great loss to not sign him.

[Douglar]

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story...n-andrew-bynum

A tale of two centers

Player	FG%	REB	AST	STL	BLK	TOV	PTS
Center A	.566	10.9	1.6	0.4	2.2	2.2	16.3
Center B	.577	11.9	1.0	0.7	2.3	2.5	15.3

The chart shows career numbers (per 36 minutes) for two centers who are currently both 25 years old. It's pretty close, isn't it? Bynum is "Center A," while Greg Oden is "Center B." The obvious difference isn't shown, namely that Bynum has played more than 8,000 more NBA minutes than Oden. The endless injury woes of Oden have robbed him of essential development time, and probably a lot more. However, given a clean health record for both players, it's likely that Oden would be the better player.

Oden will get to make a nice little recruiting tour himself this summer, though the stakes will be completely different. Chances are that Oden will be looking at two or three years in contract length, with the last year almost certainly being a team option, and a total average annual value that, at best, might clear $5 million if a non-tax-paying team is willing to risk a midlevel exception. He may have to accept less than that, though doing so opens up the possibility of landing with a title contender such as Miami. No team would consider offering Oden a max-type salary for even one season because of his history of injuries, and the deal he eventually signs will be more than anything an opportunity to prove himself.

[kovanovich]

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story...n-andrew-bynum

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Somewhat annoying that Doolittle's analysis fails even to mention the possibility that a team UNDER the cap might sign Oden, especially so because the Cavs have been rumored to be a leader in the Oden sweepstakes. I'm guessing that Doolittle is just speculating on Oden's market value based on the tax paying MLE. I have seen nothing to lead me to believe the Cavs would offer two years fully guaranteed.