2018 Tribe bullpen discussion

[Derek]

If the Indians are able to keep one, it seems like it has to be Brantley.

There’s just no in-house option to replace him.

The Indians, in theory, can still put together a very serviceable bullpen next year even if they lose Allen and Miller now that they have Hand and Cimber locked in.

I have to believe that we should be able to retain one of Miller/Allen as well given the years they have had.

 

[CBBI]

I have to believe that we should be able to retain one of Miller/Allen as well given the years they have had.

I don't disagree at all. They hopefully can keep one of those relievers.

I'm just saying if it's a situation where they can *only* keep 1 of the 3, I'd keep Brantley given the makeup of the roster.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I have to believe that we should be able to retain one of Miller/Allen as well given the years they have had.

If Miller regains his form this year, I think he's priced way outside of our range. If he doesn't regain his form, I don't think we can gamble on the money he'll still command.

I hope we can keep Cody. With him faltering a bit this year, moving out of the closer's role at times, maybe his price tag goes down? It's wishful thinking at this point, but we can dream.

 

[PIP]

If Miller regains his form this year, I think he's priced way outside of our range. If he doesn't regain his form, I don't think we can gamble on the money he'll still command.

I hope we can keep Cody. With him faltering a bit this year, moving out of the closer's role at times, maybe his price tag goes down? It's wishful thinking at this point, but we can dream.

Pretty much how I see it... A dominant Andrew Miller is definitely a game-changing weapon, but he’s a walking disabled list as well...

I’d like to see the Indians use their resources elsewhere...

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Pretty much how I see it... A dominant Andrew Miller is definitely a game-changing weapon, but he’s a walking disabled list as well...

I’d like to see the Indians use their resources elsewhere...

A dominant Miller gets paid like one of the best relievers in baseball--because he is.

A non-dominant Miller isn't a gamble the Indians can afford to make.

In my opinion, he's gone after this year.

That might not be too bad. I'm interested to see if batters start to hit better against Miller and Hand if they get to see both of them in the same game (or same playoff series). Their sliders are so similar, I have a feeling that it's better to bring different looks out of the pen.

 

[Urban]

This year's free agent reliever class is so much stronger than last year:

Craig Kimbrel, Andrew Miller, and Zach Britton are the top tier guys assuming the latter 2 finish the season strong

The next level closers: Cody Allen, David Robertson, Kelvy Herrera, and Jeuyrs Familia

Solid bridge relief: Adam Ottavino, Adam Warren, Dan Jennings, Justin Wilson

There are some grey haired vets available on 1-2 year deals- Sergio Romo, Brad Ziegler, Ryan Madson, Tony Sipp, Oliver Perez, Santiago Casilla, Bud Norris

Reclamation projects in Greg Holland, Brad Brach, AJ Ramos

 

[sportscoach]

Neil Ramirez is losing his playoff spot with the fact he has given up runs in 8 of his last 11 appearances.

So its quite possible Tomlin is in our pen for the playoffs He will likely be back in September for the stretch run either way.

I am curious if we will call up Talbot/Wilk for the stretch run as an extra arm since Hoyt is injuried and Marshall is coming off of an injury (though he may be ready by September). Tomlin and Taylor will be September adds but outside of that I am not sure who else we may call up to help eat innings.

 

[Urban]

The Indians bullpen now ranks 4th in ERA since the All Star Break: 3.36

 

[Kevalier]

The Indians bullpen now ranks 4th in ERA since the All Star Break: 3.36

Shout out to @Urban for posting useful statistics, so that I don’t have to search for them myself. Keep them coming!

 

[sportscoach]

The Indians bullpen now ranks 4th in ERA since the All Star Break: 3.36

If you look at those numbers, it really says Otero has been very unlucky and Allen has been super lucky. I actually wouldn't be surprised if we still pick up a Joe Smith type of deal this season before the deadline to help the bullpen out. Ramirez hasn't cut it lately and Cimber is still having you could say some adjustments to his new team. This is a year to win it, so any move within reason still could happen.

Any veteran at the end of their contracts that could help this bullpen out still available you guys think within reason?

 

[Urban]

If you look at those numbers, it really says Otero has been very unlucky and Allen has been super lucky. I actually wouldn't be surprised if we still pick up a Joe Smith type of deal this season before the deadline to help the bullpen out. Ramirez hasn't cut it lately and Cimber is still having you could say some adjustments to his new team. This is a year to win it, so any move within reason still could happen.

Any veteran at the end of their contracts that could help this bullpen out still available you guys think within reason?

That's technically what they say, but I don't think it's necessarily true or worth looking that far into, in such a small sample the amount of HRs each has allowed (3 to Cody, 0 to Otero) skews FIP drastically. With that said, most of Otero's damage came in that White Sox blowup in the 9th, so maybe he has been unlucky.

And barring an injury I don't see them making any more moves in the bullpen.

 

[sportscoach]

That's technically what they say, but I don't think it's necessarily true or worth looking that far into, in such a small sample the amount of HRs each has allowed (3 to Cody, 0 to Otero) skews FIP drastically. With that said, most of Otero's damage came in that White Sox blowup in the 9th, so maybe he has been unlucky.

And barring an injury I don't see them making any more moves in the bullpen.

I feel we may look for another veteran out there. I mean Ramirez hasn't pitched well lately at all, Cimber has struggled since coming here, Otero and Olson haven't had good years in general, while Marshall, Hoyt have been hurt and Taylor hasn't been able to prove much at the big league level. Tomlin is coming off a bad year plus being injured. Our depth at AAA isn't very good at the moment. We have multiple guys we can move to the 60 day DL, Merryweather, Zimmer, Naquin, so we have the space to get guys without actually hurting the 40 man roster long term.

Now I am not saying whoever we acquire will be on the playoff roster, but I feel another veteran arm would be great right now to add to a depleted and under performing bullpen overall. The main reason why this bullpen has had good numbers in the second half is the fact the starting pitching has been so good, we haven't had to tax the guys back there very much. I wouldn't be opposed to another veteran arm to help out back there.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

I'm not really worried about Ramirez's spot. I'm not counting on him as a high leverage pitcher, so if it's him or anyone else (or even one fewer bullpen arm come playoff time) I'm fine with it.

I am worried about Cimber. We need him to turn into that ROOGY we thought he was when we traded for him.

 

[sportscoach]

I'm not really worried about Ramirez's spot. I'm not counting on him as a high leverage pitcher, so if it's him or anyone else (or even one fewer bullpen arm come playoff time) I'm fine with it.

I am worried about Cimber. We need him to turn into that ROOGY we thought he was when we traded for him.

I still feel like if a solid reliever is available for a good price we should make the move. Cannot ever get too much pitching, but if we don't find a good price on a guy, we don't have to make a move either. We can just bring up like a Talbot to be an inning eater on bad start days down the stretch.

 

[Derek]

Might not have noticed, but Cody Allen has a 1.38 ERA over the last 30 days in 13 IP over 11 appearances.

Outside of Neil Ramirez's HR ratio and Adam Cimber not missing any bats, the bullpen is looking good all the way down to Otero and Olson.

In regards to Cimber, he induced swinging strikes 11% of the time for San Diego compared to just 4.7% here in Cleveland.

He's struggled to get ahead in the count, and has been pitching outside the zone way more often than he was in San Diego. Lots of 2-1 and 3-1 hitters counts when that happens.