NBA's Top 20 Players Right Now

I think Harden has been better than Durant this season, I mean dude is averaging 28-8-12, crazy!

Yes the D'antoni system and pace is helping him a lot but Harden has his team 1 game away from the 2nd seed in the West while being the only star on his team, so its obviously working, Yea he flops like a mad man but he did perfect the art of drawing fouls by flailing his arms.

He has questionable defense at times but he has been better on that end, would like to hear arguments why is Durant better & more impactful than Harden this season and why hes rated higher as a player?

K1rieIrving>AllOtherPG's said:

I think Harden has been better than Durant this season, I mean dude is averaging 28-8-12, crazy!

Yes the D'antoni system and pace is helping him a lot but Harden has his team 1 game away from the 2nd seed in the West while being the only star on his team, so its obviously working, Yea he flops like a mad man but he did perfect the art of drawing fouls by flailing his arms.

He has questionable defense at times but he has been better on that end, would like to hear arguments why is Durant better & more impactful than Harden this season and why hes rated higher as a player?

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Have you seen Harden's Addidas commercial where he flat out says, "Do you really want me defending, I'm here to create" yet? That's one issue that keeps him out of the top 5 for me. He gets hidden on defense while Durant has become a very good help defender. Can Durant defend man to man? I think he is exploitable, but he isn't hidden.

I also tend to dislike players who struggle to mesh with other talents. Harden is going to play like Harden no matter who is on the floor with him. He didn't mesh well with Westbrook and Durant, then he couldn't get Howard and Lin involved in the offense. We are certainly getting picky here, but talking about the top 10 in the league, you have to get a little picky.

I just don't see how Durant is not top-2. It's not like I'm a fan, either. I was probably one of the more vocal, anti-Durant guys before he even left.

He just always has rubbed me wrong. He's so damn whiny and sensitive. He disappears so much when his team needs him. There's obviously a serious question mark if he's scared of big games/moments at times.

That said, I just can't deny the talent and skills he has. I think he's pretty comfortably the second best player in the NBA.

godfather said:

I just don't see how Durant is not top-2. It's not like I'm a fan, either. I was probably one of the more vocal, anti-Durant guys before he even left.

He just always has rubbed me wrong. He's so damn whiny and sensitive. He disappears so much when his team needs him. There's obviously a serious question mark if he's scared of big games/moments at times.

That said, I just can't deny the talent and skills he has. I think he's pretty comfortably the second best player in the NBA.

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My spirit animal for driving home from work is Tom Tolbert, who hosts KNBR afternoons and calls play by play for the Warriors. Also the power forward during the Run TMC era and Kerr's teammate at Arizona.

He spent most of last season stressing that Kawhi was the best FA over Durant, but Kawhi wouldn't leave Pop. Reason being, if there is a drop off from Durant to Leonard on offense, it's slight... and Leonard is the best man defender in the game.

And yet Durant just shredded Leonard in their series last year. Your criticism of Harden is noted, but I think there is a better chance thats more of a Dwight Howard issue than a Harden one. Obviously we are splitting hairs, like you said, but what you see as a strength of Durant I view as a weakness. He can fit in with other great players, yes, but hes never, ever been asked to do what Westbrook and Harden are doing right now: carry a team of mediocre players all by themselves. Speaking of, Westbrook just had another 40 point triple double. I dont believe Durant could do what Westbrook is doing right now.

Rich said:

And yet Durant just shredded Leonard in their series last year. Your criticism of Harden is noted, but I think there is a better chance thats more of a Dwight Howard issue than a Harden one. Obviously we are splitting hairs, like you said, but what you see as a strength of Durant I view as a weakness. He can fit in with other great players, yes, but hes never, ever been asked to do what Westbrook and Harden are doing right now: carry a team of mediocre players all by themselves. Speaking of, Westbrook just had another 40 point triple double. I dont believe Durant could do what Westbrook is doing right now.

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Split more hairs? Dont mind if I do...

Not only am I not impressed by Westbrook's quest to rewrite individual stat lines while limping along in 7th place in the West, I hope he realizes his usage rate ran Durant out of town. All three of those guys - Harden, Durant, and Westbrook - should carry that stigma. You had a superteam from the jump, and you couldn't figure out how to play the team game. How pitiful.

But, this is a discussion about the top 20 right now, regardless of the past... so I tip my hat to very good play now. But Kawhi plays the right way and always has. He has a championship the others lack. One series is a small sample size.

Randolphkeys said:

Split more hairs? Dont mind if I do...

Not only am I not impressed by Westbrook's quest to rewrite individual stat lines while limping along in 7th place in the West, I hope he realizes his usage rate ran Durant out of town. All three of those guys - Harden, Durant, and Westbrook - should carry that stigma. You had a superteam from the jump, and you couldn't figure out how to play the team game. How pitiful.

But, this is a discussion about the top 20 right now, regardless of the past... so I tip my hat to very good play now. But Kawhi plays the right way and always has. He has a championship the others lack. One series is a small sample size.

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h
Harden? Harden essentially begged for OKC to keep him and was genuine ok coming off the bench. No stigma for him: the Zombie Sonics richly deserve what they've gotten for being cheap thoug

Randolphkeys said:

Split more hairs? Dont mind if I do...

Not only am I not impressed by Westbrook's quest to rewrite individual stat lines while limping along in 7th place in the West, I hope he realizes his usage rate ran Durant out of town. All three of those guys - Harden, Durant, and Westbrook - should carry that stigma. You had a superteam from the jump, and you couldn't figure out how to play the team game. How pitiful.

But, this is a discussion about the top 20 right now, regardless of the past... so I tip my hat to very good play now. But Kawhi plays the right way and always has. He has a championship the others lack. One series is a small sample size.

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18-12. A .600 winning percentage, on pace for 50 wins. Far from limping, and well above expectations. This is a slightly unfair characterization of their season.

Kawhi's championship came as the 3rd or 4th best player on his team. Color me unimpressed by that achievement. Granted, he did win Finals MVP, but as you said, one series is a small sample size. Duncan and Parker were both better players that year, and Ginobli was still good. He lost a series last year that his team was favored to win, and it was largely because he got dominated by Kevin Durant...

EDIT: I'd also like to revise my top 20. I think Isaiah Thomas has earned a spot on the list, and Anthony Towns has not. Right now, I'd say Thomas, who is having a career year, is the better player. He's truly been excellent this season. I'd plop him into the 20 spot.

Randolphkeys said:

Split more hairs? Dont mind if I do...

Not only am I not impressed by Westbrook's quest to rewrite individual stat lines while limping along in 7th place in the West, I hope he realizes his usage rate ran Durant out of town. All three of those guys - Harden, Durant, and Westbrook - should carry that stigma. You had a superteam from the jump, and you couldn't figure out how to play the team game. How pitiful.

But, this is a discussion about the top 20 right now, regardless of the past... so I tip my hat to very good play now. But Kawhi plays the right way and always has. He has a championship the others lack. One series is a small sample size.

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I get what you mean by Kawhi for the record. And I love the selfless way he plays the game of basketball. I am a huge fan of his. He's humble and just plays the right way.

While I will be fan of Kawhi over Durant's, personally. I just wonder how a guy as talented say as Durant would benefit from that same structure that few players like Kawhi are blessed with. There was a lot of development and teetering from Pop and Co. to make him the player he is today.

That's not to say Kawhi didn't have the talent, he had to if he was going to become so good.

Durant's year's in OKC remind me a lot of LeBron's early stint in Cleveland. Just thrown to the fire to figure it out all for himself. It takes a really special player to blossom regardless of situation, even if they're not being utilize to maximize their talent.

Durant much like LeBron when he left, are experiencing some of the maturation of evolving their game that they missed early in their career.

Outside LB, I don't see a more gifted player in this league than Durant.

Pioneer10 said:

h
Harden? Harden essentially begged for OKC to keep him and was genuine ok coming off the bench. No stigma for him: the Zombie Sonics richly deserve what they've gotten for being cheap thoug

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Let's not lose focus of the years they had together that should have netted at least one championship if they learned to play off each other. That is why I can't help but question why all three are regular season stats monsters who shrink in big games. Still, three of the top 10 in the league without question. It's all splitting hairs.

@Rich. Isaiah isn't a top 20 player unless you enjoy focusing on stats, IMO. He is still a huge defensive liability for the top 20.

Randolphkeys said:

Let's not lose focus of the years they had together that should have netted at least one championship if they learned to play off each other. That is why I can't help but question why all three are regular season stats monsters who shrink in big games. Still, three of the top 10 in the league without question. It's all splitting hairs.

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Maybe splitting hairs but I just don't get this: they got to the Finals and lost to a prime Lebron James team with their big 3 at the ages of 23, 23, and 22. They didn't even get a chance after that with the Harden trade

Basically no team that young wins like ever in the NBA. Even Magic who was the exception earned the name Tragic Johnson against the Celts till he was able to best them

Pioneer10 said:

Maybe splitting hairs but I just don't get this: they got to the Finals and lost to a prime Lebron James team with their big 3 at the ages of 23, 23, and 22. They didn't even get a chance after that with the Harden trade

Basically no team that young wins like ever in the NBA. Even Magic who was the exception earned the name Tragic Johnson against the Celts till he was able to best them

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We might remember the negotiations differently. Of course, I remember it correctly. Joking...

Still, when a team has a big three (Ibaka made them a Big Four in many ways) you get together and find a way to succeed on and off the court. If you followed that team, it never meshed. Not before or after the Harden Trade. For me personally, it's hard to overlook.

Some fans like blaming ownership, front office, coaches... But this is a player's league. I'm not letting those guys off the hook for blowing it.

Randolphkeys said:

We might remember the negotiations differently. Of course, I remember it correctly. Joking...

Still, when a team has a big three (Ibaka made them a Big Four in many ways) you get together and find a way to succeed on and off the court. If you followed that team, it never meshed. Not before or after the Harden Trade. For me personally, it's hard to overlook.

Some fans like blaming ownership, front office, coaches... But this is a player's league. I'm not letting those guys off the hook for blowing it.

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Nah that front office was cheap and was thinking that Big 3 should be two wings and a big (ala Miami and Boston). They didn't realize how the league was going to change and over valued Ibaka way too much because of those two teams. That deal would never happen with the way league has changed now. Fine by me as I have no love for the Zombie Sonics

Back on topic: Giannis may end at being #2 behind Lebron by the end of the year. Thank god that team can't shoot 3's: you put him on a team with spacing like the Cavs and I'm not sure how you stop him.

Bucks fans must feel like Cavs did during those first few Lebron years.

Randolphkeys said:

Let's not lose focus of the years they had together that should have netted at least one championship if they learned to play off each other. That is why I can't help but question why all three are regular season stats monsters who shrink in big games. Still, three of the top 10 in the league without question. It's all splitting hairs.

@Rich. Isaiah isn't a top 20 player unless you enjoy focusing on stats, IMO. He is still a huge defensive liability for the top 20.

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So are Kyrie Irving and Damian Lillard.