David.
Radical Centrist
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[/QUOTE]I'd say that is a good thing.
Why?
[/QUOTE]I'd say that is a good thing.
Why?
Can you think of any legislation that would give a fair and balanced view and restrict propagation we see now or do you feel the free market of information will sort itself out?
Will never happen, and there's ways around doing it blatantlyYes. Ban all government money that goes to anyone involved with a media company, including contracts that go to parent companies that own media outlets. (Ex. GE, with billions in defense contracts, owns NBC, Time Warner, with billions in their own government contracts, owns CNN, Disney, which actually contracted to make WWII propaganda for the U.S. government, owns ABC.) If the government isn't putting money in their pockets and they are forced to compete in the market on quality of journalism, you will have more accurate information out there. In other words, a free market would sort itself out, so let's have one.
Idk. I'm of the opinion that aligning consistently with one party more consistently on every issue seems less natural than being in the middle.
Be mindful of drawing false equivalence...
At certain points in history, certain political parties just get it right and others don't. Sure there are things that both parties fuck up, but, I would have a rational debate with anyone that wants to regarding the veracity of the Republican platform compared to that of the Democrats.
Why do you think voters are becoming more and more aligned with one ideology over the other?
I think I still have the tab open somewhere.. but that trend has developed over the last 20 years pretty smoothly. It doesn't look like it has to do with any particular president.
I'm not debating either is better in this post, I'm more interested in the polarization and the variables
Voters, historically, are becoming more liberal.
This has to do with a few factors but the largest three are:
1) A decrease in the normative class' share of the overall population and an increase in minority share;
2) The reduction of relevance to evangelicalism as a motivating political factor;
3) A new baby boom in the form of millennials who are, by and large, associated with liberal ideologies;
4) The normalization of certain values that form an ideological bedrock so to speak that pushes/keeps particular voters within the liberal ideological camp; i.e., LGBT rights, minority rights, feminist causes.
I'm not sure why we would attempt to correlate who is President with voter ideology? Liberals voted for Reagan twice.
I'm not sure why we would attempt to correlate who is President with voter ideology? Liberals voted for Reagan twice.
The overreach of socially progressive movements have absolutely turned some moderates away.
I'd argue the same for false equivalence regarding WHY there are more liberal voters. I'm pretty sure we both know each others positions as to why.
Rather than opening that can of worms, there is a lot of info here vv
Interested in what you think. Shows (amongst other things) the proportion of consistently liberal and constantly rep switches over the last 20, but polarization is growing in both directions.
http://www.people-press.org/2014/06/12/section-1-growing-ideological-consistency/
I alluded to why I thought young people were identifying as liberals a little further upthread. There's been more mainstream media from the daily show, mtv, all media outlets outside of fox news, celebrities, teen Vogue, universities, etc. Influencing the impressionable at a higher rate than the right possibly could given their resources. It's likely why trump is pulling brietbart up by the bootstraps.While there is surely true to a very limited extent, there's almost no evidence of this being the case to a significant degree. Believe me, I've heard this before, but, anyone turned away by progressivism wasn't a liberal to begin with... Essentially, there are always neoreactionaries, this isn't a new phenomena; yet, invariably, reactionary movements always consider themselves new phenomena.
I have no idea what you mean by this?
I actually try not to assume I know what you or anyone else thinks; doing so can short-circuit dialogue and discourse with false and almost assuredly incomplete (thus inaccurate) information.
What can of worms? I'm really not sure I know what you mean?
I think this coincides with my previous post, and I generally agree with the conclusions here. I would also point out that this kind of study doesn't really explain the "why" rather than the "how" of the issue. I think the why might be just as important, particularly given the problems we're facing with access to valid information and political discussion.
I alluded to why I thought young people were identifying as liberals a little further upthread. There's been more mainstream media from the daily show, mtv, all media outlets outside of fox news, celebrities, teen Vogue, universities, etc. Influencing the impressionable at a higher rate than the right possibly could given their resources. It's likely why trump is pulling brietbart up by the bootstraps.
I generally do think, that the left is more idealist and the right is more realist, in certain aspects.
Who wouldn't get behind the idea that "everyone should be treated equal"? I'm for that idea too.. but one party is addressing it in a way that seems to be somewhat aesthetic, the other more pragmatic. I feel the left uses it in an inflammatory way, to garner votes from the young.
We both know about Lyndon Johnson and who he thought he'd have voting for 200 years by putting something into place. I'm aware of the possibility that he had the right pitch to sell to the right people in that situation, but it makes me wonder, and I'm not one that is going to trust our government on their statements or intentions.
As far as the significance of the over each of progressive movements turning people , do you have a study?
I actually think "progressive" in the traditional sense has been abandoned by what is considered progressive at this moment.
It's the anti anti circle jerk.. progressive movements like battling sexism can actually become unfairly sexist. Then they are the problem.
Traditionally, I am a progressive. I'm pushed away by what's developed.
There are tweets about wishing for a white genocide for Christmas.
There's a teacher calling voting for a candidate they don't agree with an act of terrorism, and asking any child who supported someone they did to stand up and identify themselves.
That's fucking nuts bro.
Extreme examples? Sure. I'm confident that in the spectrum of things, they are representative of who has power and what their beliefs are.
My ACCOUNTING professor gave an outraged, misinformed lecture on the wage gap. Last place you should expect to hear that, no?
To assume I was never a liberal in the first place is what you said you wouldn't do a post prior, you don't assume because it cuts conversation short. I'm a moderate,
and was pushed away primarily because people want my race dead,
or I can't see mainstream media blaming me for being a white male for a litany of issues. How can I get behind that ideology?
It's extreme, it's racist, is sexist, and it's not the kind of progressive movement I'm going to get behind.
No, I don't ever want to vote for a party if that many "progressives" will have the power of media, government, and the sense of "being right" in their corner.
I'm an independent.
Haven't finished fully going over each ideologys position on each issue w ENOUGH information, but I'll tell you right now, nuts to bolts, I'd be shocked as hell if I went down the line and put a check mark in every box for one party or the other.
^^I think this is the way you form your opinions. Knowledge and life experience. Being a lib looks great on paper. Millenials are subject to going off what looks good on paper rather than having a significant amount of life experience and knowledge about all the issues, their context, and how everything works.
The fact thatmore and more people are doing just that is a problem.
I agree with "why" being as important as "how" in those studies.. if I was to guess, it would be the media and how we communicate politics with each other that drive everyone further apart.
I alluded to why I thought young people were identifying as liberals a little further upthread. There's been more mainstream media from the daily show, mtv, all media outlets outside of fox news, celebrities, teen Vogue, universities, etc. Influencing the impressionable at a higher rate than the right possibly could given their resources. It's likely why trump is pulling brietbart up by the bootstraps.
I generally do think, that the left is more idealist and the right is more realist, in certain aspects. Who wouldn't get behind the idea that "everyone should be treated equal"? I'm for that idea too.. but one party is addressing it in a way that seems to be somewhat aesthetic, the other more pragmatic.