Let's Talk about Jesus Christ, Creation, and Whether You Believe or Not

All the Jesus talk in this thread has gotten old. When do we get to discuss Wicca?

The Human Q-Tip said:

I was thinking the same thing (similar issue involving a relative), but not being sufficiently well-versed in evangelical doctrine, I had a question.

Is it possible that the purpose itself is simply the act of proselytizing, rather than the result? He talks, and whether others choose to believe is mostly irrelevant?

I honestly don't know the answer - but the thought occured to me.

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It's a tremendously important question. Looking at the Church of LDS send young men out on their mission work, I always assumed the purpose of telling a sheep that he is in fact a shepherd is to strengthen his tie to the church. I don't know if we will get a straightforward answer from the shepherd, and the sheep may not have the capacity.

I'd be fascinated to hear skyscraper actually answer the question. I'm trained on actually educating, and what these "mission" or "evangelist" escapades are set up to do have little to do with educating.

Skyscraper said:

Again, another man lying on me claiming he knows how I preach and what I preach on.

Why spread lies on me like that? I know you hate me solely for the Lords name, but dont stoop so low. Be more upright than that.

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DJTJ said:

Y'all realize he called himself a street preacher earlier in this thread, right? You know... the guy with the signs preaching at you?

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Sorry for correcting you and showing you Exactly what I'm talking about which I have not lied about...

But now that you have clarity and know I was telling you the truth, feel free to flood me with X's.

selby56 said:

All the Jesus talk in this thread has gotten old. When do we get to discuss Wicca?

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I offered to start a cult where I'm the religious figure. I'd be happy to incorporate some elements of Wicca if you're willing to get cucked and/or commit regular blood sacrifices.

Are you married/have a girlfriend?

Randolphkeys said:

It's a tremendously important question. Looking at the Church of LDS send young men out on their mission work, I always assumed the purpose of telling a sheep that he is in fact a shepherd is to strengthen his tie to the church. I don't know if we will get a straightforward answer from the shepherd, and the sheep may not have the capacity.

I'd be fascinated to hear skyscraper actually answer the question. I'm trained on actually educating, and what these "mission" or "evangelist" escapades are set up to do have little to do with educating.

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Quoting irrelevant men and women is not teaching.

I'm through 55 posts and this, my friends, is what mania looks like.

The Oi said:

I will summarize:

A street preacher, who seems like a decent guy appears to genuinely believe in what he’s preaching here.

His opinions are not backed by science or history, but he claims they’ve helped him turn his life and other lives around and contribute to a greater good. You know...faith and zeal.

Gourimoko and his tribe are baited in.

People try to prove him wrong using science and reason and he inevitably uses Bible verses to prove them wrong in turn.

They attack his Bible verses and ask him to respond to more science and history.

More Bible verses.

More anger. More science and history.

Later rinse repeat.

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Don't forget said street preacher spouting off historical inaccuracies (easily disprovable ones at that), to prove some nonsense beliefs and dispel multiple religions. Getting called on this bullshit and playing the victim.

Skyscraper said:

Sorry for correcting you and showing you Exactly what I'm talking about which I have not lied about...

But now that you have clarity and know I was telling you the truth, feel free to flood me with X's.

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You're an evangelist street preacher. I've had considerable conversations with ones that have people at colleges lining up to yell insults.

You undoubtedly have signs/visual material, you undoubtedly preach at people. Otherwise, they'll do nothing but cast you aside as a crazy person just talking.

Your MO, as a street preacher, is to get as big of a crowd as you can, disperse the crowd of people who aren't willing to listen, and then to simply discuss your actual message once they've left.

You want to know how I know how the street preacher game works? I bought dinner for one in college just to talk about how he does what he does. The actual skematics.

Randolphkeys said:

I'm trained on actually educating....

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So here's another question. A rare but essential quality for any great teacher is the ability to, as you put it, to "read the room". Amd Inmean in person, not on message board. All the body language, facial expressions, etc..

I've done more seminars than I can count, and seen lots and lots of different speakers, including quite a few multiple times over the years. Trials are also, at their best, teaching as well.

Do you think "reading a room" - and doing it well, is a skill we can all learn, or is it more akin to a talent? I lean towards it being a talent. A fair number of people who are otherwise really sharp just don't seem able to do that well, or even understand what you're talking about when you try to explain how it is done.

Skyscraper said:

I must say, I am impressed and well pleased with the the posters of RCF and the amount of cordiality in which they are displaying during this topic of discussion. Rare form, RCF. Rare form. I applaud you.

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Sounds like you've been here before....

Skyscraper said:

http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/carbondating.html

"Living penguins have been carbon dated and the results said that they had died 8,000 years ago! This is just one of many inaccurate dates given by Carbon dating."

"The shells of living mollusks have been dated using the carbon 14 method, only to find that the method gave it a date as having been dead for 23,000 years!(Science vol. 141 1963 pg. 634-637)"

"The body of a seal that had been dead for 30 years was carbon dated, and the results stated that the seal had died 4,600 years ago! ("The Illustrated Origins Answer Book" by Paul Taylor)"

etc.
....
"Many people are under the false impression that carbon dating proves that dinosaurs and other extinct animals lived millions of years ago. What many do not realize is that carbon dating is not used to date dinosaurs.

The reason? Carbon dating is only accurate back a few thousand years. So if scientists believe that a creature lived millions of years ago, then they would need to date it another way.

But there is the problem. They assume dinosaurs lived millions of years ago (instead of thousands of years ago like the bible says). They ignore evidence that does not fit their preconceived notion.

What would happen if a dinosaur bone were carbon dated? - At Oak Ridge National Laboratory, Scientists dated dinosaur bones using the Carbon dating method. The age they came back with was only a few thousand years old.

This date did not fit the preconceived notion that dinosaurs lived millions of years ago. So what did they do? They threw the results out. And kept their theory that dinosaurs lived "millions of years ago" instead.

This is common practice.

They then use potassium argon, or other methods, and date the fossils again.

They do this many times, using a different dating method each time. The results can be as much as 150 million years different from each other! - how’s that for an "exact" science?"
.....
"To know if carbon dating is accurate, we would have to know how much carbon was in the atmosphere in the beginning, and also how long it has been increasing, or decreasing. Since no one was there, no one knows for sure. It's like trying to figure out how long a candle has been burning, without knowing the rate at which it burns, or its original size."

Good read if you are interested in actually reading.

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Skyscraper, I really hope this post doesn't come off as an insult, because I really don't mean any offense by this, but I'd prefer to hear from others who are actually well-versed on the topic. You've shown yourself to be, by your own admission, misinformed, at best. So while I appreciate the attempt, please know that I would not consider you, or angelfire.com, a reliable source when it comes to this topic.

I am, however, interested in something... how do you pick and choose which parts of the bible you believe? Are you only a New Testament guy? Only the gospels? Is the Old Testament still cool with you? And do you literally believe all of it? Or do you only literally believe some of it, and other parts are just stories to take life lessons from?




@Zeus69 thanks for answering the question re: carbon dating. What's your background?

@The Human Q-Tip - My first year in education I would have told you it's an innate talent. Scaffolding something that is otherwise difficult to understand quickly while maintaining attention from the audience came more easily for me than others, probably because my parents are also teachers.

Now that I'm in year thirteen or fourteen of education? I'd call that naive self confidence. The best way to become a successful educator is studying proven techniques, experimenting with different techniques several times, then reflecting upon the successes and failures of that experiment. Additionally, get an accurate measurement of what your audience knew before you began the lesson as well as a measurement afterwards. If your lesson brought about change for the better, you are on your way to having a new tool in the tool belt. If it failed, examine why it failed. The content cannot carry excellent teaching, even if it is the Word of God.

Skyscraper said:

Quoting irrelevant men and women is not teaching.

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Again, because of genuine interest from at least Q-Tip and myself:

1. What was the purpose of evangelism on a website when you began?

2. How successful do you feel you have been in your purpose?

DJTJ said:

You're an evangelist street preacher. I've had considerable conversations with ones that have people at colleges lining up to yell insults.

You undoubtedly have signs/visual material, you undoubtedly preach at people. Otherwise, they'll do nothing but cast you aside as a crazy person just talking.

Your MO, as a street preacher, is to get as big of a crowd as you can, disperse the crowd of people who aren't willing to listen, and then to simply discuss your actual message once they've left.

You want to know how I know how the street preacher game works? I bought dinner for one in college just to talk about how he does what he does. The actual skematics.

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Well, my friend, you are not talking about me so thats all I have to say about that.

Tom the preacher used to hit up the Oval at Ohio State. He was fun because he was steadfast and illogical but he would listen to anybody.

I got into a God discussion with a fellow Tom viewer once. He claimed to be a former atheist turned Catholic. We went back and forth and had what I thought was a good talk. When we ended he said I hope I did some research on the stuff he was discussing. As a final goodbye I said “and I hope you research-“ he interrupts me “I already have.” This is what I can’t stand, someone who thinks they have it al figured out. Science does not have all the answers, there’s so much we don’t even know we don’t know. Whether there is a God is certainly unknown.



One last attempt because I really do love these discussions when both sides are willing to actually bring something to the table: Slyscraper, how do you explain early hominids and the body of work supporting the process of evolution? Because while I believe you can be religious and accept evolution, I don’t think it makes sense to pretend it’s “just a theory” (keep in mind the colloquial term theory is vastly different from a scientific theory).

Edit: I don’t think you’re trolling, you seem sincere. But so far the debate has felt like talking to a wall. I’m interested in sharing ideas rather than the apparent intention you have.

Skyscraper said:

What did I do ban-worthy? Was it something I said? Was I harrassing somebody? Maybe it's my faith and walk with the Lord which I express to you and you which you have zero tolerance for? Maybe if I came here agreeing with everything you said, saying things about basketball which you agreed with, then you may like me and receive me as your own... but such is not the case. Like the Lord said,

"If the world hate you, you know that it hated me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love his own: but because you are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hates you." (John 15:18-19)

Amen.

The Lord knew this 2,000 years ago. Praise the LORD for His infallible Word. Amen.

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Why did 3 people like the post @Kiddo made about what religion has done for him/her and his/her beliefs and the rest of the board is throttling you? Because you're talking down. Enjoy your religion; don't invade everyone else's space with your agenda.