The Trump Administration (just Trump) Thread

[Los216]

I really could not care less about Russia. If Trump or anyone else committed a crime then put them in prison. President Pence would be better anyone. Regardless of what happens I will not regret my vote because the alternative was much worse.

lol at thinking that Trump will go down without bringing everyone he can with him. Don't you get it dude? If Trump goes down he's taking everybody with him. That includes Mike "I always suspiciously seem to be out of the loop on all this Russia talk even though I'm the Vice president" Pence.

 

[Los216]

That report says "Trump transition officials". Which, yes, that was when Trump was already elected president. He admitted to FBI he reached out to Russia among other countries about UN Sanctions.

The question right now is whether Trump directly asked Flynn to work with Russian officials as a presidential candidate...not during the transition, and if he did as a candidate, what was it in regards to....

That tweet isn't really further confirmation of anything that important. Flynn was undermining outgoing administration by reaching out to UN contacts asking them to sit tight until new administration came in.

Guys.....

Don't do this.

 

[Binkster]

Comey weighs in:
View: https://twitter.com/Comey/status/936641449294286848

 

[billmac91]

Guys.....

Don't do this.

I was just clarifying the tweet he posted as further corroboration of "Trump directing Flynn to reach out to Russia as a candidate".

That tweet doesn't say that....that tweet references the transition team. Just trying to help clarify....

 

[Binkster]

Guys.....

Don't do this.

 

[Los216]

I really could not care less about Russia. If Trump or anyone else committed a crime then put them in prison. President Pence would be better anyone. Regardless of what happens I will not regret my vote because the alternative was much worse.

1

That report says "Trump transition officials". Which, yes, that was when Trump was already elected president. He admitted to FBI he reached out to Russia among other countries about UN Sanctions.

The question right now is whether Trump directly asked Flynn to work with Russian officials as a presidential candidate...not during the transition, and if he did as a candidate, what was it in regards to....

That tweet isn't really further confirmation of anything that important. Flynn was undermining outgoing administration by reaching out to UN contacts asking them to sit tight until new administration came in.

2






View: https://twitter.com/imillhiser/status/936634778425622528




3 and to the 4. Special Prosecutor Robert Mueller's at the door

 

[Mr. Orange]

 

[Los216]

Before anyone ask. There is no white collar Prison for the crimes Trump will ultimately be charged of. Also there will most likely be state crimes brought up on many of these people so say goodbye to those Presidential Pardons.

 

[billmac91]

1







2






View: https://twitter.com/imillhiser/status/936634778425622528




3 and to the 4. Special Prosecutor Robert Mueller's at the door

Right....you'd be talking about VP Pence (if that was the senior campaign official) directing the National Security Adviser (Flynn) to reach out to countries within the UN to convey some type of message, but this is important....after Trump had already won the election.

Then what? Incoming administrations do this all the time. I'm not trying to trivialize it. Even Obama did it in 2008. But they're using these 3 relatively small charges to get him to cooperate. Where that goes will be interesting. But the charges slapped on Flynn today are not that shocking, traitorous, or even alarming....it's leverage for what else he might know.

But I think it's important to make sure people understand what they're posting. There's a major difference between "Transition team" activity and "candidate Trump" activity. And to go a step further, if there was "candidate Trump" campaign activity with Russia, what was that activity. Was he promising removal of sanctions for a flood of fake news? Were they reaching out to discuss mechanics of communication going forward should he win? Were they discussing Trump properties in some quid pro quo scheme? Were they discussing the Magnitsky Act?

I don't find today that troubling for Trump personally. The charges on Flynn just aren't that scrupulous or underhanded.

We'll see I guess.....

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

He gave three different stories as to what happened.

1. Shot at a seal.
2. Found a gun.
3. Accidental discharge.

He always claimed to have found the gun. The three different stories were that 1) it accidentally discharged three times, either by accidentally pilling the trigger or by stepping on it, depending on which of his stories you believe; 2) shooting at seals. In either case, at trial (which is all that matters) his lawyers admitted he pulled the trigger bit claimed it was an accident).

Negligent homicide was not on the table. How can you not be quite sure why he wasn't convicted? It wasn't even a lesser charge the prosecutors sought.

Quit digging. You're simply wrong. Again.

The jury was in fact given the option to convict on the lesser included charge of involuntary manslaughter, which is what California call negligent homicide:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/30/us/kate-steinle-murder-trial-verdict/index.html

Try reading up on it a bit. No intent or malice is required, and applies to accidental killings:

Manslaughter is the unlawful killing of a human being without malice...In the commission of a lawful act which might produce death, in an unlawful manner, or without due caution and circumspection.

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?lawCode=PEN&sectionNum=192.

What version of facts could the jury have reasonably believed thay wouldn't fit that definition, given that he admitted firing the gun thay killed her?

The defendant did not testify at trial, so his version of events came in through his pre-trial statements, where he literally came up with three different versions of how the gun managed to fire. Leaving aside the entire possibility that he did this deliberately. He either 1) stepped on it and it fired three time (impossible), picked it up and it fired accidentally three times (also impossible), or 3) picked it up to shoot at sea anals on the pier, which is prettyuch the perfect definition of negligent homicide.

I'd add again the thought experiment if you changed up the parties here. A white guy convicted of seven prior felonies shoots and kills a black guy in public, tells three different bizarre versions of how it happens, and walks completely. No affirmative defense, nothing.

What would be the reaction?

 

[MediumBaller]

I'm not gonna touch this take given what happened last time... Uh, okay let me focus on the positive uhhhhh I honestly feel like I've enjoyed your posts more and more over the last couple months even though we still disagree on so much. And this take is still really awful. Damn it.

I know many will see this as un-American, and I understand why, but frankly I do not feel very patriotic these days. Our country is a mess. Better than most other alternatives, but a mess nonetheless. We have veterans who are living on the streets after leaving their families and going overseas to protect the rest of us. They often come back with psychological issues and then do not receive adequate medical assistance. Our educational system is lagging behind other countries. Far too often kids are growing up in poorly funded schools and spend years trying to play catch up with their more privileged peers. We have young black men in inner cities who grow up fearing both gang violence and law enforcement. I believe that most police officers are good people, but the bad apples ruin it for everyone and create a distrust that is hard to get rid of. We have Muslims walking around dealing with random fuckheads calling them terrorists because they dress or look a certain way. We have white people struggling with opioid addictions. We have gay people wondering if they're going to be able to remain married or if marriage equality will eventually be overturned. We have Jews having to see people marching through the streets waving Nazi flags and chanting blood and soil. It feels like people have drifted so far to the extremes on all sides and there's so much animosity and tension in this country.

I guess all of this has made me feel apathetic to the current state of affairs and make me feel little pride in being an "American" lately. I know saying I don't care what happened regarding Russia is a bad look, but I'm just being honest.

 

[Binkster]

I just want to see Don Jr. and Flynn Jr. in prison jump suits. Is that so much to ask?!

 

[-Akronite-]

Let's say somehow this plea deal and testimony doesn't mean anything and the Trump admin didn't do anything wrong...

WHY HAVE THEY LIED ABOUT EVERY DETAIL ALONG THE WAY?

Trump has vehemently denied ANY contact with Russia period. LOL

 

[Los216]

Right....you'd be talking about VP Pence (if that was the senior campaign official) directing the National Security Adviser (Flynn) to reach out to countries within the UN to convey some type of message.

Then what? Incoming administrations do this all the time. I'm not trying to trivialize it. Even Obama did it in 2008. But they're using these 3 relatively small charges to get him to cooperate. Where that goes will be interesting. But the charges slapped on Flynn today are not that shocking, traitorous, or even alarming....it's leverage for what else he might know.

But I think it's important to make sure people understand what they're posting. There's a major difference between "Transition team" activity and "candidate Trump" activity. And to go a step further, if there was "candidate Trump" campaign activity with Russia, what was that activity. Was he promising removal of sanctions for a flood of fake news? Were they reaching out to discuss mechanics of communication going forward should he win? Were they discussing Trump properties in some quid pro quo scheme? Were they discussing the Magnitsky Act?

I don't find today that troubling for Trump personally. The charges on Flynn just aren't that scrupulous or underhanded.

We'll see I guess.....

Follow this man. Read everything. I'm giving you the game for free my man.

View: https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/936602442996813824

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

There is more context out now....The Obama Administration, specifically Susan Rice, felt the Trump transition team "was getting out in front of their skis" and undermining the current administration. The outgoing administration knew the Trump Transition team, specifically Flynn, was contacting nations within the UN to discuss specific sanctions...including Russia.

My.poiny is that Susan Rice believing that the Trump Administration was getting ahead of itself does not constitute a crime. Worth noting that Flynn wasn't even charged with a Logan Act violation.

Flynn never lied to the FBI about reaching out to UN nations while in transition. They viewed that act as illegal, and he admitted he had done it at the request of a senior campaign official.

Though again, there's no charge on that, and "I was just following orders" isn't a valid defense so he should have been charged if it wasnin fact illegal. What got Flynn was lying about it under oath. Had he just told the trith,there's nothing to prosecute.

Ultimately, at worst he was looking at 60 years of prison for the charges. What he's accused of doing, in no way, shape, or form would be considered worth 60 years of jail-time. Obviously the government will hold charges over his head to get him to cooperate, but the 3 charges they used today, obviously show minor level stuff......actually stuff just about all transition teams have done in some shape or form. Even Obama's team had foreign communications with Iran and Hamas during his presidential run, in which a senior member of the campaign (Robert Malley) had to step down for the illegal contact.

Agree - but I'm curious - where did you come up with that 60 years figure? Is there something beside the lying under oath and Logan Act that is arguably applicable here?