Andrew Bynum Returns

JFT said:

The entire team has not been good by any stretch....but they will be. It's simply going to take the entire season to get there and those that say we should trade someone because of a bad day, or after just 26 games (just like I saw when Kyrie had the "0" day) are fooling themselves into thinking that a single player makes a difference over the short term. It simply doesn't happen that way.

Take a look at the Pacers team and their game against the Heat. That's what we will become in few years IF we stay the course.

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Bynum will be riding around on a Rascal in a few years

D-Wreck said:

Bynum will be riding around on a Rascal in a few years

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I would love a photoshop of this.

Nathan S said:

The only reason he's averaging 15 points per 36 (which, I should point out, is just ahead of Zeller and just behind Miles) is because he's attempting a career-high 15.6 shots per 36. Yes, you read that right. He's actually shooting the ball 15% more often than he was in his All-Star campaign with the Lakers! And people are saying we need to feed him the ball more. Absolute madness.

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The fact that Bynum's PER is above average despite his shooting 41% should be enough to discredit PER as a stat. His PER is high because, basically, he shoots a lot. And we aren't even discussing his defensive shortcomings which PER makes no attempt to capture.

According to NBAWowy

From 12-01-13 to 12-24-13

Andrew Bynum: ON Court - Anderson Varajao: OFF Court = 1.11 points per possession (PPP) allowed

Tristian Thompson: ON Court - Andrew Bynum: OFF Court = 1.02 points per possession (PPP) allowed

Andrew Bynum: ON Court - Tristian Thompson: OFF Court = 0.94 points per possession (PPP) allowed

AB21Fan said:

According to NBAWowy

From 12-01-13 to 12-24-13

Andrew Bynum: ON Court - Anderson Varajao: OFF Court = 1.11 points per possession (PPP) allowed

Tristian Thompson: ON Court - Andrew Bynum: OFF Court = 1.02 points per possession (PPP) allowed

Andrew Bynum: ON Court - Tristian Thompson: OFF Court = 0.94 points per possession (PPP) allowed

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Nice try, but the sample size for that is just 36 minutes. If you look at the whole season (which is still a small-ish sample size of 106 minutes), we have 1.09 points per possession allowed with Bynum on court and Tristan off court.

kovanovich said:

The fact that Bynum's PER is above average despite his shooting 41% should be enough to discredit PER as a stat. His PER is high because, basically, he shoots a lot. And we aren't even discussing his defensive shortcomings which PER makes no attempt to capture.

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PER isn't totally useless, it's just important to understand where it fails. Which is, unfortunately, in a lot of places. Ok, maybe it's useless :chuckles:

Yeah, let's just get rid of our 7' 2" all star center after he's only played 27 games since missing a full season and this years training camp. Be careful what you wish for..

This is why stats is stupid. You can throw all the stats you want but it does not reflect how atrocious the flow of the game is when Bynum is on the floor. The defense scrambles too much too because he can not rotate that well. Opponent bigs outruns him most of the time giving up easy points. The offense through him is not that good of you only have 2 players alongside him that can hit a perimeter shot.

JFT said:

Oh come on now. Trade him, bench him, cut him. The guy has one bad game and this thread goes off the deep end and is ready to get rid of Bynum to save an extra $6M. Give me a break.

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You aren't reading what people are saying if you think this is about one game...

Per 36, he's averaging 15 PPG, 10 RPG, 2.1 BPG, with a 15.6 PER, and he's continually improving from the beginning of the year with increasing minutes.

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He's 408th in the league out of 427 players in +/- with a -117 in only 30% of the minutes played. That's atrocious. He's a -12.3 "on court". That's the worst on the team for anyone over 10% of the minutes.

We could have only dreamed he'd be able to do that back when we signed him, AND this is ONLY 31 games into a season where he hadn't play in over a year and had multiple surgeries. He's no where near his full stride yet.

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His knees will never regenerate. His ceiling is limited. He will never hit full stride again...

Bynum, and the team, will hit their stride by the end of the season, slowly improving over time, so get used to it. And when that happens we'll truly, and finally, be a playoff team again -- the post-traitor era will finally have arrived.

And that will be the best present of all. Merry Christmas.

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He will never be part of this team when they hit their stride by the end of the season...he will have been traded or injured.

You could make that argument for Bennett. A rookie who will likely get better. Bynum isn't going to get any better. Bynum is a former all star, who's best hope is having a patrick ewing type end to his career, where you need to keep an extra big man around anyway due to his likelyhood of reinjury. If they can grab something for the guy I think you have to do it.

Andrew Bynum and Kyrie Irving sport the worst plus minus player pair on the team. -121. They go together like fire and water

Per 100 possessions they are our 11th worst player pair.

Who's number 1? Waiters/Bynum. With a whopping -35 per 100 possessions. So Bynum has been completely ineffective with both of our best players.

the bynum numbers continue to flesh out that the starting lineup issue is about Kyrie and bynum and not about Kyrie and Dion.
Dion was a scapegoat.

this bring in the question if Dion was benched for his "fit" with irving. should Bynum be as well?

basketballfan said:

Yeah, let's just get rid of our 7' 2" all star center after he's only played 27 games since missing a full season and this years training camp. Be careful what you wish for..

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Come on man. You're better than that. I know you are a huge Bynum fan, and that's cool but you gotta admit that he is a shell of his former self and has been playing pretty bad. The way he is limited by his knees, he can't get much better, in terms of agility and fitness, than he is now. He has a pretty low ceiling, and it becomes apparent with every game that passes that he doesn't have a place on this team long-term.

basketballfan said:

Yeah, let's just get rid of our 7' 2" all star center after he's only played 27 games since missing a full season and this years training camp. Be careful what you wish for..

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All Star when? 3 years ago when he still had cartilage in his knees?

Maximus said:

His knees will never regenerate.

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All season he played with stuff on both knees. Starting I think 3 games ago, he took it off of his left knee. Does that mean his left knee is feeling better than it was?

I got to the game way early and saw his pre-game workout that game. He worked hard and looked great. In that game, he got the same shots he was taking in his pre game workout. They didn't fall in the game. But he's clearly capable of making all of those very shots based on what he did pre-game.

He had that nice stretch of games where he had 20/10, 14/7, 20/13, 18/6. We won 3 of those 4 games including wins over the Nuggets and Clippers. He shot .571 or better in 3 of the 4 games. In the 7 fames since then, he's only had two games like those. 13/9 vs Portland who we lost to at the last second and 19/7 vs the Bulls, which was just 2 games ago. Which player can he be, the one who shot 9/15 just 2 games ago vs the bulls or the one who was 0-11 the next game.

The 20/10/5 game was the only game all year we played him 30 minutes.

I think we need to start playing him 30 minutes/night and stop trying to get him the ball every possession. Get him the same number of touches he gets now, but spread out over more minutes so it's not so predictable for the defense. Do that for the next 6 or 7 games and see how things look. He doesn't have to be the same player he was 2 years ago. If he can just consistently be the player we had on that 4 game stretch he can still impact the game. If we can establish him at that level, he'll be valuable to this team and will have trade value beyond his contract expiring. Now is the time to see if he can do that before Jan 7th.

Marcus said:

All Star when? 3 years ago when he still had cartilage in his knees?

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When? The last year he played..