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2017 Draft Prospects Thread

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A high second that could turn into a mid first? I think he would.

In my mind it was a 3rd that could be a 2nd. Even then that's pushing it for me.

Still, don't want Jimmy either way for the price I think it'll take and the chance he leaves.
 
Feel pretty confident any trade for Garpoppolo would be contingent on him signing a contract extension as well.

Anyone trading for him is doing so under the guise he's going to be THE guy for their franchise and will pay him somewhere between 16-20M per season accordingly.
 
Feel pretty confident any trade for Garpoppolo would be contingent on him signing a contract extension as well.

Anyone trading for him is doing so under the guise he's going to be THE guy for their franchise and will pay him somewhere between 16-20M per season accordingly.

See I feel that's the wrong move just for the contract reasons.

"Hey, we're gonna give you a fuckton of money even though we've never seen you start a full season"....doesn't sound smart to me.

Fucking the Texans at the moment for that very reason but they at least didn't have to give up high draft picks for Mallet.
 
See I feel that's the wrong move just for the contract reasons.

"Hey, we're gonna give you a fuckton of money even though we've never seen you start a full season"....doesn't sound smart to me.

Fucking the Texans at the moment for that very reason but they at least didn't have to give up high draft picks for Mallet.

I think the Texans would have made the playoffs this year if Josh McCown started all 16 of their games
 
I think the Texans would have made the playoffs this year if Josh McCown started all 16 of their games

What do you mean..because they just won in the first round of the playoffs.

Or were you being facetious?
 
See I feel that's the wrong move just for the contract reasons.

"Hey, we're gonna give you a fuckton of money even though we've never seen you start a full season"....doesn't sound smart to me.

Fucking the Texans at the moment for that very reason but they at least didn't have to give up high draft picks for Mallet

While I don't believe the Patriots are actually going to get a 1st and a 4th for Garoppolo, let's just say hypothetically they do.

Anyone who is willing to give up that substantial price for that QB does so feeling totally comfortable that he's a franchise caliber guy. Thus, whoever acquires him is going to want to lock him up as soon as possible.
 
While I don't believe the Patriots are actually going to get a 1st and a 4th for Garoppolo, let's just say hypothetically they do.

Anyone who is willing to give up that substantial price for that QB does so feeling totally comfortable that he's a franchise caliber guy. Thus, whoever acquires him is going to want to lock him up as soon as possible.

I see your point then, I agree with that assessment.

I just hope the Browns aren't one of those teams to trade and lock him up.
 
I'm speaking when looking at the overall picture and what talent we have on this Browns team. The Browns had the worst defense in the league in every category and was a 1 and 15 team. Reaching for a QB that was rated as a mid round or 2nd round before the Alabama game should not be a move they should take. Without the Alabama game, why was Watson a projected 2nd round pick? This is similar to the Cardale Jones situation when he tore up Wisconsin, Bama, then Oregon. People were ready to draft him in the lower first round but then he went back to college and came back down to earth and was draft in the lower rounds.

Eli Manning had the pedigree and he has been successful in college and the NFL winning multiple superbowls behind great defenses. Ben was a small school guy that was drafted later than Eli and but has win multiple superbowls behind great defenses. Eli was not a failure, nor was Ben. But what did they have in common?? Great defenses. Defense, Defense, Defense. Baltimore won their first superbowls behind a great defense and Trent freaking dilfer at QB, Tampa Bay won their superbowls behind a great defense with Brad freaking Johnson as their QB. Seattle won behind a great defense and a QB drafted in the later rounds, Raiders built their defense and drafted a QB in the later rounds.

The Browns are in the position to draft players that would make their defense great because this might be the strongest defensive draft in long long time. Multiple DEs, Safeties and linebackers in this draft and the Browns can come out with 2 of the them.

Is Watson worth the risk of building a great defense? Is he in the mold of Andrew Luck, Cam Newton, and Payton Manning? A lot of people would say no or hell no before the Bama game. So do you think he's worth giving Up myles Garrett, and Hooker?

Why give up this opp?

Comparing Cardale Jones to Deshaun Watson makes me think I might be wasting my time....but here goes...

I think many people are too close minded in regards to the defense.....where they think one player can be that transformative. The effect one defensive player has is completely dwarfed by the effect one offensive player can have (QB).

If you (as an organization) rank Garrett as a 97 but Watson as a 95, are you saying you should take Garrett? For arguments sake.....you're deciding, is a great DE prospect worth more than a really, really good QB prospect?

Ultimately, that's really tough to answer. I tend to lean towards gambling on the QB but I understand some people like the opposite. I don't think one opinion is more right than the other, I just think the reasoning you are putting forward and have been putting forward for WHY you would select the defensive player is completely misguided.

I'm not saying draft a QB #1 just because he's a QB. I'm saying don't evaluate a QB based solely on his college statistics or scout rankings. That was why people were pushing back on your comments. There's a lot of gray areas with QB's and you're trying to tell people it is assessed only in black and white. There are plenty of examples of guys who had great college stats who were awful pros and guys who had awful college stats but were great pros. You're trying to be too absolute when assessing Watson's pro prospects. That's all I was responding to.
 
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Comparing Cardale Jones to Deshaun Watson makes me think I might be wasting my time....but here goes...

I think many people are too close minded in regards to the defense.....where they think one player can be that transformative. The effect one defensive player has is completely dwarfed by the effect one offensive player can have (QB).

If you (as an organization) rank Garrett as a 97 but Watson as a 95, are you saying you should take Garrett? For arguments sake.....you're deciding, is a great DE prospect worth more than a really, really good QB prospect?

Ultimately, that's really tough to answer. I tend to lean towards gambling on the QB but I understand some people like the opposite. I don't think one opinion is more right than the other, I just think the reasoning you are putting forward and have been putting forward for WHY you would select the defensive player is completely misguided.

I'm not saying draft a QB #1 just because he's a QB. I'm saying don't evaluate a QB based solely on his college statistics or scout rankings. That was why people were pushing back on your comments. There's a lot of gray areas with QB's and you're trying to tell people it is assessed only in black and white. There are plenty of examples of guys who had great college stats who were awful pros and guys who had awful college stats but were great pros. You're trying to be too absolute when assessing Watson's pro prospects. That's all I was responding to.

Think both of you are missing some key points.

To your point, I'd remind you that he's not trying to compare the skillset of Jones to that of Watson, but the situation of having them perform like a champion and raise their draft stock.

While I agree with your assessment of having a close call and giving the edge to the quarterback, this also isn't one of those situations.

I can't imagine there is anyone out there that matters who believes Watson is even remotely close to Myles Garrett or Jon Allen as a prospect.

He just isn't, and one game doesn't a career make. Perhaps he is a first round pick, potentially even at the back end of the top half round 1.

But this isn't a 97 vs 95 situation.
 
To your point, I'd remind you that he's not trying to compare the skillset of Jones to that of Watson, but the situation of having them perform like a champion and raise their draft stock.

I think that's a pretty serious leap given the amount of tape on each (and how completely dissimilar their resumes are) but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt so we can just move on.

I also was ranking guys in an arbitrary sense to illustrate how the highest rated player isn't necessarily who you are taking #1. There are positional considerations like individual impact and scarcity.....to go along with stats and other scouting metrics.

I believe we will and should take Garrett but that doesn't mean we will.
 
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