2020 Off-Season Rumors/News

[sportscoach]

Lynn becomes their #2 behind Giolito. Then it will be Kuechel, Cease, and Lopez. God forbid Kopech comes back and regains his form. They also have Crochet and Steiver that are ready. They may leave Crochet and his 100 mph FB in the pen for now.

Meanwhile, they have Grandall at C, Abreu at 1B, Madrigal at 2B, Moncada at 3B, Anderson at SS, and an OF that consists of Jimenez, Robert, Engel, and Eaton. Oh yeah, there are rumors that they are interested in signing Brantley also. If I were them I would give Adolfo every opportunity possible. If he proves ready then you're looking at an OF of Jimenez, Robert, and Adolfo. That's would be ridiculous IMO.

Then there's us lucky Indian's fans quibbling over who should be in the OF mix out of Bauers, Naylor, Johnson, Luplow, and Mercado. We won't have Lindor, we won't have Hernandez, our catchers are the best defensively but can't f'n hit a lick, 1B will likely be one of Bauers, Naylor, or Bradley. We do have Ramirez and a solid pitching staff, so an astute trade or 2 could fill some holes and keep us competitive. As it stands now IMO, we would only finish in front of the Royals and maybe the Tigers due to the lack of offense.

Its not because of what Lynn could do, its because of what Dunning could be. I feel Dunning could have the same production as Lynn.

 

[CalBuckeyeRob]

Lynn becomes their #2 behind Giolito. Then it will be Kuechel, Cease, and Lopez. God forbid Kopech comes back and regains his form. They also have Crochet and Steiver that are ready. They may leave Crochet and his 100 mph FB in the pen for now.

Meanwhile, they have Grandall at C, Abreu at 1B, Madrigal at 2B, Moncada at 3B, Anderson at SS, and an OF that consists of Jimenez, Robert, Engel, and Eaton. Oh yeah, there are rumors that they are interested in signing Brantley also. If I were them I would give Adolfo every opportunity possible. If he proves ready then you're looking at an OF of Jimenez, Robert, and Adolfo. That's would be ridiculous IMO.

Then there's us lucky Indian's fans quibbling over who should be in the OF mix out of Bauers, Naylor, Johnson, Luplow, and Mercado. We won't have Lindor, we won't have Hernandez, our catchers are the best defensively but can't f'n hit a lick, 1B will likely be one of Bauers, Naylor, or Bradley. We do have Ramirez and a solid pitching staff, so an astute trade or 2 could fill some holes and keep us competitive. As it stands now IMO, we would only finish in front of the Royals and maybe the Tigers due to the lack of offense.

Which is why this may be the time to move Ramirez and just accept that the team is not really a playoff team without Lindor even though Jose is great. This starting staff should have a wide window so rebuild the offense to match.

 

[CDAV45]

Its not because of what Lynn could do, its because of what Dunning could be. I feel Dunning could have the same production as Lynn.

Well I guess he could, but it's not likely because he doesn't have that kind of upside. The White Sox are ready to win more than just the AL Central right now so what Dunning "could be" is of little consequence to them. They are loaded and they're adding to it. The Indians should look to trade all of Lindor, Carrasco, and Ramirez to get as much ready, high upside talent as possible(like the White Sox) which would also create the needed salary room for additions when things normalize.

 

[Gson]

Well I guess he could, but it's not likely because he doesn't have that kind of upside. The White Sox are ready to win more than just the AL Central right now so what Dunning "could be" is of little consequence to them. They are loaded and they're adding to it. The Indians should look to trade all of Lindor, Carrasco, and Ramirez to get as much ready, high upside talent as possible(like the White Sox) which would also create the needed salary room for additions when things normalize.

With the addition of Lynn.. along with the readiness of Kopech, Stiever and three more 25/25 year old guys.. the depth of the CWSox pitching staff is solid.. If Garrett Crochett succeeds in the closer role.. the CWSox entire pitching staff can be very VERY TOUGH. There are more than enough position player and position prospects to keep the CWSox relevant for the next two years.. after or during the second year of that.. then it's OUR turn..

Thoughts?

 

[Criznit]

With the addition of Lynn.. along with the readiness of Kopech, Stiever and three more 25/25 year old guys.. the depth of the CWSox pitching staff is solid.. If Garrett Crochett succeeds in the closer role.. the CWSox entire pitching staff can be very VERY TOUGH. There are more than enough position player and position prospects to keep the CWSox relevant for the next two years.. after or during the second year of that.. then it's OUR turn..

Thoughts?

Until an internal option who as of now is an unknown person steps up it could next year or 5. We are going to start putting our youngsters to the test and we got some interesting ones. Like you, I speculate how close Freeman is. Johnson, Miller, Bauers, Bradley, Jones, Chang, Mercado. That's your frontline. I might be missing someone of course..

ChiSox look great on paper even with the aggressive get of Lynn. Oh and they are probably not done..... Wooooooo

 

[CDAV45]

With the addition of Lynn.. along with the readiness of Kopech, Stiever and three more 25/25 year old guys.. the depth of the CWSox pitching staff is solid.. If Garrett Crochett succeeds in the closer role.. the CWSox entire pitching staff can be very VERY TOUGH. There are more than enough position player and position prospects to keep the CWSox relevant for the next two years.. after or during the second year of that.. then it's OUR turn..

Thoughts?

I really want to believe you, but right now we don't have the system to do that. I'm sure a Lindor and/or Carrasco trade would help infuse a good portion of the needed talent so we'll see what happens.

 

[CDAV45]

Until an internal option who as of know is an unknown person steps up it could next year or 5. We are going to start putting our youngsters to the test and we got some interesting ones. Like you, I speculate how close Freeman is. Johnson, Miller, Bauers, Bradley, Jones, Chang, Mercado. That's your frontline. I might be missing someone of course..

ChiSox look great on paper even with the aggressive get of Lynn. Oh and they are probably not done..... Wooooooo

Therein lies the problem. Guys like Bauers, Bradley, Chang, and Mercado are being relied upon.........heavily, and they are not even good prospects. Miller is solid, but has a limited upside. Johnson looks the part, but hasn't been given an opportunity because they've f'd around with the likes of Naquin, DeShields, and Mercado. Jones looks the part with the bat and is the type of prospect/player we need more of, but finding a position for him is proving to be a challenge. They waited too long to trade Kluber. They waited too long to trade Lindor. They don't have the monetary wherewithal to add to this roster. They need to be proactive and aggressive if they don't want this pitching staff to go to waste.

 

[Criznit]

Therein lies the problem. Guys like Bauers, Bradley, Chang, and Mercado are being relied upon.........heavily, and they are not even good prospects. Miller is solid, but has a limited upside. Johnson looks the part, but hasn't been given an opportunity because they've f'd around with the likes of Naquin, DeShields, and Mercado. Jones looks the part with the bat and is the type of prospect/player we need more of, but finding a position for him is proving to be a challenge. They waited too long to trade Kluber. They waited too long to trade Lindor. They don't have the monetary wherewithal to add to this roster. They need to be proactive and aggressive if they don't want this pitching staff to go to waste.

I'm kind of indifferent to it I think. Making the playoffs in 2021 is still a semi-realistic possibility even with the loss Lindor, but additional causalities doom us. Take the year off... Push some guys like Chang, Bauers, Bradley, Mercado to produce.... I mean.... What else are we actually going to do? There is a likely possibility the return for Lindor addresses some of our needs, but I'm scared to spread that hope too thin.

 

[Gson]

I really want to believe you, but right now we don't have the system to do that. I'm sure a Lindor and/or Carrasco trade would help infuse a good portion of the needed talent so we'll see what happens.

We're going to diverge a little more here.. The Indians absolutely MUST protect their pitching staff by whatever means possible.. The same level of care doesn't need to be applied to the position players.. Ours aren't good enough now.. The ones we have may never be good enough.. but, they have to be able to catch and throw.. the necessary requirements for run prevention..

The Pitching Staff protection means a great pen (Karinchak, Wittgren, Clase, etc etc) along with the starters.. have to be talented (they are) and plentiful. If one of Lindor or JRam get moved.. and an upside SP/RP can be brought in along with a within two years position player(s).. that's the right deal.. If Cookie gets moved.. an upside SP has to be coming back.. Someone mentioned McClannahan from the Rays.. he's exactly the kind of upside LHP / LHRP that the tribe needs to return..

For the Indians..it's all about the pitching staff.. it's the only way they stay competitive. If the Tribe sees some of the kids (Freeman, Arias, Nolan, etc etc) start making their mark at the ML level.. It's depth and talent in the pitching staff with a mind set to continuously add and improve that keeps the Tribe relevant w/r to winning baseball.

Thoughts?>.

 

[CDAV45]

We're going to diverge a little more here.. The Indians absolutely MUST protect their pitching staff by whatever means possible.. The same level of care doesn't need to be applied to the position players.. Ours aren't good enough now.. The ones we have may never be good enough.. but, they have to be able to catch and throw.. the necessary requirements for run prevention..

The Pitching Staff protection means a great pen (Karinchak, Wittgren, Clase, etc etc) along with the starters.. have to be talented (they are) and plentiful. If one of Lindor or JRam get moved.. and an upside SP/RP can be brought in along with a within two years position player(s).. that's the right deal.. If Cookie gets moved.. an upside SP has to be coming back.. Someone mentioned McClannahan from the Rays.. he's exactly the kind of upside LHP / LHRP that the tribe needs to return..

For the Indians..it's all about the pitching staff.. it's the only way they stay competitive. If the Tribe sees some of the kids (Freeman, Arias, Nolan, etc etc) start making their mark at the ML level.. It's depth and talent in the pitching staff with a mind set to continuously add and improve that keeps the Tribe relevant w/r to winning baseball.

Thoughts?>.

The same level of care needs to be applied in regards to manning positions as has been building the pitching staff. You are correct in stating that our position players aren't good enough now(speaking collectively). Waiting and skimming from the leftover free agents isn't going to help this pitching staff or the overall quality of the Cleveland Indians. Freeman isn't ready. Jones doesn't have a defensive position. Arias is a year or 2 away. Chang is a longshot. Miller is a solid prospect with a low ceiling. Nobody knows WTF Mercado is, but we know his swing quickly gets long. Naylor shouldn't be playing 1B. Bauers shouldn't be part of the conversation. Zimmer is a toss up. Perez and Hedges are as bad offensively as they are good defensively.

Call it a rebuild, retool, or reboot. I don't really give a shit, but it needs to happen and I find it hard to believe that MC and CA don't share that same thought. Not having Lindor, Carrasco, and Ramirez doesn't have to be equivalent to throwing in the towel either. We're f'n floating around in purgatory and we don't know which direction this franchise is going to go. I know what direction I would like to see it go, but I'm afraid we're going to see more of the same. The White Sox, Twins, and Tigers aren't waiting around for us to figure it out either.

 

[CDAV45]

I'm kind of indifferent to it I think. Making the playoffs in 2021 is still a semi-realistic possibility even with the loss Lindor, but additional causalities doom us. Take the year off... Push some guys like Chang, Bauers, Bradley, Mercado to produce.... I mean.... What else are we actually going to do? There is a likely possibility the return for Lindor addresses some of our needs, but I'm scared to spread that hope too thin.

How do you know additional casualties "doom us" without knowing the return(s)? What will doom us is the same damn thing that is dooming us. In fact, it has doomed us the last 2 yrs. No AL Central pennant and an early playoff exit with the best pitching staff in the league. The fans aren't going to show up for this mess, but they could create a roster that will generate fan interest once the young studs start to show if they choose to do so.

Trading Lindor will surely address an immediate need or 2, but that's not enough. They need to deal Carrasco and Ramirez and fill this roster with real talent while strengthening the minor league system. All the while getting the payroll to the point that it's covered by the shitty TV deal which is around $50M. Trading all 3 would actually get the payroll below $40M if I'm not mistaken. Add in revenue sharing and just like that you have a good chunk of cash to address a need or 2. The advantage of that being the these uncertain covid times has likely stretched the value of the dollar to most FA. I doubt there will be many offers refused if they are remotely reasonable.

 

[sportscoach]

The same level of care needs to be applied in regards to manning positions as has been building the pitching staff. You are correct in stating that our position players aren't good enough now(speaking collectively). Waiting and skimming from the leftover free agents isn't going to help this pitching staff or the overall quality of the Cleveland Indians. Freeman isn't ready. Jones doesn't have a defensive position. Arias is a year or 2 away. Chang is a longshot. Miller is a solid prospect with a low ceiling. Nobody knows WTF Mercado is, but we know his swing quickly gets long. Naylor shouldn't be playing 1B. Bauers shouldn't be part of the conversation. Zimmer is a toss up. Perez and Hedges are as bad offensively as they are good defensively.

Call it a rebuild, retool, or reboot. I don't really give a shit, but it needs to happen and I find it hard to believe that MC and CA don't share that same thought. Not having Lindor, Carrasco, and Ramirez doesn't have to be equivalent to throwing in the towel either. We're f'n floating around in purgatory and we don't know which direction this franchise is going to go. I know what direction I would like to see it go, but I'm afraid we're going to see more of the same. The White Sox, Twins, and Tigers aren't waiting around for us to figure it out either.

You know Naylor was moved to the OF because they signed Hosmer right? He has been a 1B for a long time, just was forced to move so if anything he shouldn't be in the OF...

We had a .228 batting average with a .689 OPS and we still won 35 games and was one game back of the division lead... Not sure how we can do any worse in 21...

We are still gonna put out a top 5 rotation, with a ton of pitching talent to fill in the bullpen. We are likely the best location for a lot of position players (outside of 3B and C, but even with C, we have no depth behind Taylor). since if Lindor is traded (even if he is kept) there is at least 5 positions with no solidified player. I think you are underestimating how good of a location we are this season for stopgap types (I feel a ton of guys may sign one year deals to wait out until the next season). We should have a very healthy competition to make this roster. We might only have at the moment a max of 5 of the 13ish position spots solidified, but 8 spots with 30ish players likely trying to get them, i think everything will turn out just fine.

 

[CDAV45]

You know Naylor was moved to the OF because they signed Hosmer right? He has been a 1B for a long time, just was forced to move so if anything he shouldn't be in the OF...

We had a .228 batting average with a .689 OPS and we still won 35 games and was one game back of the division lead... Not sure how we can do any worse in 21...

We are still gonna put out a top 5 rotation, with a ton of pitching talent to fill in the bullpen. We are likely the best location for a lot of position players (outside of 3B and C, but even with C, we have no depth behind Taylor). since if Lindor is traded (even if he is kept) there is at least 5 positions with no solidified player. I think you are underestimating how good of a location we are this season for stopgap types (I feel a ton of guys may sign one year deals to wait out until the next season). We should have a very healthy competition to make this roster. We might only have at the moment a max of 5 of the 13ish position spots solidified, but 8 spots with 30ish players likely trying to get them, i think everything will turn out just fine.

You know Hosmer was signed because they didn't want Naylor at 1B right? He was also too frumpy to play the OF and has since conditioned himself to be more athletic.

We had a top 5 rotation and a very good BP, and still do. We had a shitty lineup and we will fail to compete again if it is not improved.

We can roll with Zimmer, Mercado, Luplow, Bauers, Reyes and Johnson in the OF. I put Reyes in the mix that way we could get Bradley's powerful bat in the lineup as well. That would be outstanding! Maybe Jones forces his way into the OF conversation. He'll have to play left LF because he cannot run enough to be adequate defensively. We could put Zimmer in LF and DH Jones for him allowing our pitcher to hit.

The IF could consist of Perez, Naylor, Miller, Ramirez and Chang. If we could only sign a stopgap like Galvis then that would absolutely put us over the top.

All sarcasm aside, this is not the lineup we will see opening day because MC and CA know that it is terrible and is incapable of competing in the vastly improving AL Central. If they don't know that then my trust in them has been misplaced.

 

[sportscoach]

You know Hosmer was signed because they didn't want Naylor at 1B right? He was also too frumpy to play the OF and has since conditioned himself to be more athletic.

We had a top 5 rotation and a very good BP, and still do. We had a shitty lineup and we will fail to compete again if it is not improved.

We can roll with Zimmer, Mercado, Luplow, Bauers, Reyes and Johnson in the OF. I put Reyes in the mix that way we could get Bradley's powerful bat in the lineup as well. That would be outstanding! Maybe Jones forces his way into the OF conversation. He'll have to play left LF because he cannot run enough to be adequate defensively. We could put Zimmer in LF and DH Jones for him allowing our pitcher to hit.

The IF could consist of Perez, Naylor, Miller, Ramirez and Chang. If we could only sign a stopgap like Galvis then that would absolutely put us over the top.

All sarcasm aside, this is not the lineup we will see opening day because MC and CA know that it is terrible and is incapable of competing in the vastly improving AL Central. If they don't know that then my trust in them has been misplaced.

They grabbed Hosmer because they wanted to win now... Naylor wasn't even 22 when they signed him if I remember correctly. He was only 23 last season, so its not like he is even in his prime yet...

I want to improve the lineup as well, but we only have so many options, someone will have to step up from who we have and the team actually cannot go backwards if they tried.

 

[Gson]

The same level of care needs to be applied in regards to manning positions as has been building the pitching staff. You are correct in stating that our position players aren't good enough now(speaking collectively). Waiting and skimming from the leftover free agents isn't going to help this pitching staff or the overall quality of the Cleveland Indians. Freeman isn't ready. Jones doesn't have a defensive position. Arias is a year or 2 away. Chang is a longshot. Miller is a solid prospect with a low ceiling. Nobody knows WTF Mercado is, but we know his swing quickly gets long. Naylor shouldn't be playing 1B. Bauers shouldn't be part of the conversation. Zimmer is a toss up. Perez and Hedges are as bad offensively as they are good defensively.

Call it a rebuild, retool, or reboot. I don't really give a shit, but it needs to happen and I find it hard to believe that MC and CA don't share that same thought. Not having Lindor, Carrasco, and Ramirez doesn't have to be equivalent to throwing in the towel either. We're f'n floating around in purgatory and we don't know which direction this franchise is going to go. I know what direction I would like to see it go, but I'm afraid we're going to see more of the same. The White Sox, Twins, and Tigers aren't waiting around for us to figure it out either.

The more the subject of trades are mulled over & over w/r to the pending Free Agency of Lindor/make up of the club.. the lack of impact position player prospects... and the statements made by CLEFO.. the more we can conclude the Indians:

-will trade Francisco Lindor... to Cincinnati or the NYY's.. The preference is to the Reds..
-will trade Jose Ramirez... to Toronto or Atlanta.. the preference is the Braves..
-will trade Zach Plesac... to the Cardinals or LAAngels.. the preference is the Cardinals
-will not trade Carlos Carrasco..
-will sign one mid-tier FA... like Cesar Hernandez..

The general return will be one corner infielder, two middle infielders, three outfielders, one catcher and two to four pitchers. The three names listed.. may not be the only ones leaving.

w/r to the returns.. filling in the names with the preferences listed could include but are not limited to.. Senzel, Garcia, Greene, Waters, Muller, Langeliers, De La Cruz, Reyes, Edmon, DeJong, Gorman, and Herrera.

Thoughts?...