"Boobie" Gibson
In the Rotation
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2008
- Messages
- 2,438
- Reaction score
- 880
- Points
- 113
-
Changing RCF's index page, please click on "Forums" to access the forums.
Cavs/Bucks and Ilyasova
- Thread starter MirORich
- Start date
I LOVE YOU ABBY
Delete Me
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2010
- Messages
- 1,343
- Reaction score
- 2,063
- Points
- 113
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
Baseline Runner
In the Rotation
- Joined
- May 19, 2011
- Messages
- 832
- Reaction score
- 747
- Points
- 93
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
2nd best PER at PF last season but he's a stiff? I guess I'm missing something.
2nd best PER at PF last season but he's a stiff? I guess I'm missing something.
Last edited by a moderator:
JMcCurry08
All-Star
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2012
- Messages
- 6,078
- Reaction score
- 6,980
- Points
- 113
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
Wish we could of signed but i dont see the Cavs making big committments in free agency yet
Wish we could of signed but i dont see the Cavs making big committments in free agency yet
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2006
- Messages
- 10,306
- Reaction score
- 23,670
- Points
- 135
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
Maybe. This news bite is probably just Ilyasova's agent beating the bush one last time to see if he can chase out another offer.
I think that $45Mil number includes a lot of unlikely bonuses and is probably a very generous interpretation of Milwaukee's final offer.
Maybe. This news bite is probably just Ilyasova's agent beating the bush one last time to see if he can chase out another offer.
I think that $45Mil number includes a lot of unlikely bonuses and is probably a very generous interpretation of Milwaukee's final offer.
AvonCavsFan
Sixth Man
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2009
- Messages
- 1,677
- Reaction score
- 1,647
- Points
- 113
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
The Bucks got the free agent signing steal of the off season. That contract is going to look ridiculously cheap as time goes on.
We should have went after this guy. Perfect compliment to our bigs. A Floor spacing big that is a good rebounder.
On the year he is shooting 46.4% from the floor and 44.8% from three. Take out the season opening slump. Since Dec 1st. Which includes 54 games, he is shooting 48.3% from the floor and 48.78% from three!! On 164 attempts!
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/ilyaser01/splits/2013/
Check out his stats on games when he plays more than 20 minutes per game:
30-39 MPG 48.8%/51.7%!
20-30 MPG 45.8%/41/6%
Since Dec 1st.
In just 28.7 mpg, he is averaging 14.92ppg/7.7rbp/1.6apg
Per 36 that is 18.67ppg/9.63rbp/2apg/1.4 steals
Since the all-star break (18 games) he is averaging 33.7 minutes and he is tossing up 19.1/9.8/1.6 on 49.8%/46.3%/86.7% shooting percentages!
If he didn't have two ball chucking guards he is playing with, who knows how good his numbers could be.
He can rebound better than that if he had to though (as he has done so in the past). The Bucks have a plethora of bigs that can rebound, so he doesn't have to.
Now to his salary: 7.9 Mil per year through 2015-16 and 8.4 Mil in 2016-17 season.
Compare to Kevin Love, whom everyone wants to trade the moon for and then pay over $15 Mil to per year. I used Love's stats from last year as this year he was awful when he did play.
What I see is Love shoots more, thus scores more. Ersan's a better long range shooter, has been for a while. And for half the cost you get 80% of the offense and better defense. Ersan's PER would be right where Loves is if he shot 4 more shots per game and made just 35% of them.
Had we skipped signing Miles and maybe even Gee, we could have had a long term piece. And having Ersan allows us to draft THE BEST CENTER, not just one that can shoot outside to pair with Tristan (who by the way has not really played all that well lately after that small uptick earlier).
I believe we still would have had the space to do the Memphis trade as well.
AV-Zellers
Ersan-TT
?
Waiters-Oladipo?
Kyrie-Livingston
Ersan is even better at what Miami has Bosh doing. AV is better than whoever they roll out at center. TT is better than whatever they have backing up. Irving is better than Chalmers.
I know we didn't want to blow our cap space. But when good values present themselves we need to take advantage..and Ersan is/was a good value.
The Bucks got the free agent signing steal of the off season. That contract is going to look ridiculously cheap as time goes on.
We should have went after this guy. Perfect compliment to our bigs. A Floor spacing big that is a good rebounder.
On the year he is shooting 46.4% from the floor and 44.8% from three. Take out the season opening slump. Since Dec 1st. Which includes 54 games, he is shooting 48.3% from the floor and 48.78% from three!! On 164 attempts!
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/ilyaser01/splits/2013/
Check out his stats on games when he plays more than 20 minutes per game:
30-39 MPG 48.8%/51.7%!
20-30 MPG 45.8%/41/6%
Since Dec 1st.
In just 28.7 mpg, he is averaging 14.92ppg/7.7rbp/1.6apg
Per 36 that is 18.67ppg/9.63rbp/2apg/1.4 steals
Since the all-star break (18 games) he is averaging 33.7 minutes and he is tossing up 19.1/9.8/1.6 on 49.8%/46.3%/86.7% shooting percentages!
If he didn't have two ball chucking guards he is playing with, who knows how good his numbers could be.
He can rebound better than that if he had to though (as he has done so in the past). The Bucks have a plethora of bigs that can rebound, so he doesn't have to.
Now to his salary: 7.9 Mil per year through 2015-16 and 8.4 Mil in 2016-17 season.
Compare to Kevin Love, whom everyone wants to trade the moon for and then pay over $15 Mil to per year. I used Love's stats from last year as this year he was awful when he did play.
What I see is Love shoots more, thus scores more. Ersan's a better long range shooter, has been for a while. And for half the cost you get 80% of the offense and better defense. Ersan's PER would be right where Loves is if he shot 4 more shots per game and made just 35% of them.
Had we skipped signing Miles and maybe even Gee, we could have had a long term piece. And having Ersan allows us to draft THE BEST CENTER, not just one that can shoot outside to pair with Tristan (who by the way has not really played all that well lately after that small uptick earlier).
I believe we still would have had the space to do the Memphis trade as well.
AV-Zellers
Ersan-TT
?
Waiters-Oladipo?
Kyrie-Livingston
Ersan is even better at what Miami has Bosh doing. AV is better than whoever they roll out at center. TT is better than whatever they have backing up. Irving is better than Chalmers.
I know we didn't want to blow our cap space. But when good values present themselves we need to take advantage..and Ersan is/was a good value.
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2006
- Messages
- 10,306
- Reaction score
- 23,670
- Points
- 135
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
What makes you think he would have come to Cleveland if we only matched the Bucks offer? Why would you show his stats leaving out his slump? This is cherry picking with hindsight in the worst sort of way.
What makes you think he would have come to Cleveland if we only matched the Bucks offer? Why would you show his stats leaving out his slump? This is cherry picking with hindsight in the worst sort of way.
STAT
Champions
- Joined
- Jun 29, 2012
- Messages
- 1,279
- Reaction score
- 2,271
- Points
- 113
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
Avon makes no indication that he believes that matching the Bucks' offer would have guaranteed Ilyasova coming to Cleveland. He seems to be saying that he believes that the Cavs should have at least attempted to land Ilyasova.
Avon actually did post Ilyasova's shooting percentages and advanced stats for the season, so I'm not sure why you're saying that he didn't (that is, including the slump), but if that is not sufficient for you, here are his basic numbers on the season: 13.3 PPG, 7.1 RPG on 46.4-44.8-79.3 shooting in 27 MPG. Further, Avon seems to have been mentioning Ilyasova's post-slump numbers as much as he did because not only are they very impressive and over a workable sample size, but also for the same reasons we do a similar thing when we post about Dion or Tristan - to illustrate play of late.
While I was somewhat interested in going after Ilyasova in the off-season I was not bothered that the Cavs didn't. Seeing him play lately (as in, any of last 50 games or so) makes me think, as Avon does, that pursuing him more actively would have been a better decision.
Avon makes no indication that he believes that matching the Bucks' offer would have guaranteed Ilyasova coming to Cleveland. He seems to be saying that he believes that the Cavs should have at least attempted to land Ilyasova.
Avon actually did post Ilyasova's shooting percentages and advanced stats for the season, so I'm not sure why you're saying that he didn't (that is, including the slump), but if that is not sufficient for you, here are his basic numbers on the season: 13.3 PPG, 7.1 RPG on 46.4-44.8-79.3 shooting in 27 MPG. Further, Avon seems to have been mentioning Ilyasova's post-slump numbers as much as he did because not only are they very impressive and over a workable sample size, but also for the same reasons we do a similar thing when we post about Dion or Tristan - to illustrate play of late.
While I was somewhat interested in going after Ilyasova in the off-season I was not bothered that the Cavs didn't. Seeing him play lately (as in, any of last 50 games or so) makes me think, as Avon does, that pursuing him more actively would have been a better decision.
AvonCavsFan
Sixth Man
- Joined
- Feb 12, 2009
- Messages
- 1,677
- Reaction score
- 1,647
- Points
- 113
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
I think you were cherry picking what you were reading maybe?
And his slump was 11 games. He has played 54 games since then. Sample size says the 54 games is more in line with his true level of play. But that being said, I did include his entire year shooting percentages if you would like to re-read.
And I did not we would get him if we matched the offer in my original comment. But I firmly believe we would have had a great chance had we been just slightly higher as I think he felt disrespected by the Bucks in the negotiations.
I think you were cherry picking what you were reading maybe?
And his slump was 11 games. He has played 54 games since then. Sample size says the 54 games is more in line with his true level of play. But that being said, I did include his entire year shooting percentages if you would like to re-read.
And I did not we would get him if we matched the offer in my original comment. But I firmly believe we would have had a great chance had we been just slightly higher as I think he felt disrespected by the Bucks in the negotiations.
CornerThree
13-7-9-14
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2005
- Messages
- 4,812
- Reaction score
- 1,274
- Points
- 113
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
Illysova, Asik, and even Ryan Anderson were all out there for free this offseason and we didn't get any of them. Any of those 3 would be probably our 2nd best player right now and a good piece for the next several years.
Illysova, Asik, and even Ryan Anderson were all out there for free this offseason and we didn't get any of them. Any of those 3 would be probably our 2nd best player right now and a good piece for the next several years.
Cassity14
Gold Star Member
- Joined
- Oct 17, 2012
- Messages
- 6,956
- Reaction score
- 14,484
- Points
- 123
Re: Cavs not that interested in Ilyasova
I like Ilyasova's game a lot. That said, is he a 3 or a 4? Does his game open up because he plays with offensive threats like Jennings and Ellis? Is he anything more than an average defender?
Again, DO NOT take this post as saying I wouldn't love to have Ersan on my team. Take it as questioning whether or not his presence truly aids this rebuild over the long haul. Personally, I don't see him as a #1 option and I see him as an average #2 offensive option. His stats compare to Love's, but I certainly wouldn't put him in the same category as Love as a rebounder or an offensive weapon. He would not have been worth skipping a year on the tank and going into "win now" mode. JMO
I like Ilyasova's game a lot. That said, is he a 3 or a 4? Does his game open up because he plays with offensive threats like Jennings and Ellis? Is he anything more than an average defender?
Again, DO NOT take this post as saying I wouldn't love to have Ersan on my team. Take it as questioning whether or not his presence truly aids this rebuild over the long haul. Personally, I don't see him as a #1 option and I see him as an average #2 offensive option. His stats compare to Love's, but I certainly wouldn't put him in the same category as Love as a rebounder or an offensive weapon. He would not have been worth skipping a year on the tank and going into "win now" mode. JMO
