Cleveland Browns Quarterback Position

[bob2the2nd]

The basis of your "injury prone" label is one week.

your basis that he is going to be a good quarterback, worthy of trading a top 33 pick, and 15 million a year is 94 passes.

 

[godfather]

your basis that he is going to be a good quarterback, worthy of trading a top 33 pick, and 15 million a year is 94 passes.

He never existed beyond coming to the NFL?

You do realize teams have mortgage a lot more than that for players that never have played in the NFL at all...

 

[bob2the2nd]

He never existed beyond coming to the NFL?

You do realize teams have mortgage a lot more than that for players that never have played in the NFL at all...

and how often does it ever work out?

 

[Randolphkeys]

He never existed beyond coming to the NFL?

You do realize teams have mortgage a lot more than that for players that never have played in the NFL at all...

Too true. I just wanted to talk about the "injury prone" label that was being thrown around because it was disingenuous, but we can switch to topic back to the value of a starting quarterback.

Goff trade -
Tennessee gets:
Rams' first-round pick (2016), two second-round picks (2016), a third-round pick (2016), a first-round pick (2017) and another third-round pick (2017).

Rams get:
Titans' first-overall pick (2016), a fourth-round pick (2016) and a sixth-round pick (2016).

Wentz trade -

Eagles get -
2016 first round pick - No. 2 overall, 2017 fourth round pick

Browns get -
2016 first round pick - No. 8 overall
2016 third round pick - No. 77 overall
2016 fourth round pick - No. 100 overall
2017 first round pick, 2018 second round pick

But hey, I'm not named Sashimi Brown.

 

[AZ_]

All quality points, and I actually like Jimmy more than any other QB on the market by a wide margin. As I've stated previously, it's his cost (and dealing with the Patriots) I dont like, especially if Chicago and SF decide to go hard after him.

So I wont take your last statement too literally and ask you this. What is your best offer for him? 12 and a conditional 2 next year?

I don't give up 12 for him under any circumstance.

33 and a conditional pick is my ceiling for this deal. The Bears and 49ers certainly aren't offering their first round pick, so if the Pats find a better deal than that, they're welcome to take it.

 

[spydy13]

But hey, I'm not named Sashimi Brown.

Sick burn.

(I know it was unintentional, but still funny nonetheless.)

 

[bob2the2nd]

Too true. I just wanted to talk about the "injury prone" label that was being thrown around because it was disingenuous, but we can switch to topic back to the value of a starting quarterback.

Goff trade -
Tennessee gets:
Rams' first-round pick (2016), two second-round picks (2016), a third-round pick (2016), a first-round pick (2017) and another third-round pick (2017).

Rams get:
Titans' first-overall pick (2016), a fourth-round pick (2016) and a sixth-round pick (2016).

Wentz trade -

Eagles get -
2016 first round pick - No. 2 overall, 2017 fourth round pick

Browns get -
2016 first round pick - No. 8 overall
2016 third round pick - No. 77 overall
2016 fourth round pick - No. 100 overall
2017 first round pick, 2018 second round pick

But hey, I'm not named Sashimi Brown.

but this is an absolute horseshit comparison and you know it. Those are rookie quarterbacks getting drafted under 5 years of control at manageable prices. Jimmy G would be under 1 year of team control, and then you have to pay a fucking shit ton to keep him. And trying to sign him to a contract extension is filled with just as many risks and not signing him to a contract.


so thank god you arent named Sushi Brown.

 

[bob2the2nd]

I don't give up 12 for him under any circumstance.

33 and a conditional pick is my ceiling for this deal. The Bears and 49ers certainly aren't offering their first round pick, so if the Pats find a better deal than that, they're welcome to take it.

I think i would offer 52 and a conditional pick being worth up to a 2nd next year being if Jimmy goes to the probowl, and it goes down from there.

To me that 33 pick is just too damn valuable, it is basically a first round pick. Its a prime slot to pick the guy that fell or to trade for a future first next year.

 

[The Wizard of Moz]

Guys, and I really want to stress this because it constantly gets brought up as a negative when it shouldn't, the word rental should never ever ever be thrown around in reasons why this trade doesn't work.

Have you noticed how good quarterbacks that are highly sought after rarely ever hit free agency? It's because football is all about guaranteed money. All of these guys know how much they can kill their value in just one year. Or an injury could kill their career. You can franchise tag a guy 3 years in a row. So we immediately have 4 years of automatic team control of Jimmy if we bring him in. Now is that team control extremely expensive? Yes. But if we want to keep him here he has no say in leaving for 4 NFL seasons.

What that usually does is get players to sign a contract with more guaranteed money up front in order to avoid playing for the tag and potentially killing their value.

I can see the points of people opposed to bringing in Jimmy. I can see why people wouldn't want to tag a guy for top 5 salary after one NFL season if it came down to that (I personally will spare no financial expense to find a FQB so I don't care).

But please stop mentioning the term rental. If we trade for Jimmy he is either here until he proves he is an above average league starter or he flames out. There is no scenario where he balls out and walks.

 

[Pick6]

Guys, and I really want to stress this because it constantly gets brought up as a negative when it shouldn't, the word rental should never ever ever be thrown around in reasons why this trade doesn't work.

Have you noticed how good quarterbacks that are highly sought after rarely ever hit free agency? It's because football is all about guaranteed money. All of these guys know how much they can kill their value in just one year. Or an injury could kill their career. You can franchise tag a guy 3 years in a row. So we immediately have 4 years of automatic team control of Jimmy if we bring him in. Now is that team control extremely expensive? Yes. But if we want to keep him here he has no say in leaving for 4 NFL seasons.

What that usually does is get players to sign a contract with more guaranteed money up front in order to avoid playing for the tag and potentially killing their value.

I can see the points of people opposed to bringing in Jimmy. I can see why people wouldn't want to tag a guy for top 5 salary after one NFL season if it came down to that (I personally will spare no financial expense to find a FQB so I don't care).

But please stop mentioning the term rental. If we trade for Jimmy he is either here until he proves he is an above average league starter or he flames out. There is no scenario where he balls out and walks.

Has franchising a guy three times (or even twice) in a row ever even happened? seems unprecedented to me. It's interesting you have these thoughts when it pertains to the Browns but seem to think there is a real chance Kirk walks from the Redskins.

 

[The Wizard of Moz]

Has franchising a guy three times (or even twice) in a row ever even happened? seems unprecedented to me.

The exact reason it doesn't happen is because of the threat of it happening...

Guys want to cash in on guaranteed money. It never gets to that point because guys know that possibility exists so they ink the guaranteed deal. You can name as many times a guy has been tagged 3 times as a FQB with no injury concerns hitting free agency.

It's interesting you have these thoughts when it pertains to the Browns but seem to think there is a real chance Kirk walks from the Redskins.

Redskins can tag Cousins again. I think the chance that Cousins isn't a Redskin is if they decide to trade him to the highest bidder after tagging him. Of which I'd be very interested in entering said bidding and would gladly part with the #12 overall something I've made clear.

 

[Randolphkeys]

but this is an absolute horseshit comparison and you know it. Those are rookie quarterbacks getting drafted under 5 years of control at manageable prices. Jimmy G would be under 1 year of team control, and then you have to pay a fucking shit ton to keep him. And trying to sign him to a contract extension is filled with just as many risks and not signing him to a contract.


so thank god you arent named Sushi Brown.

Look, I'm just a grownman paid to teach children, not Sake Brown, but my post wasn't horseshit. If you read my previous posts I'm arguing for a contract extension before the trade. The Browns have an exorbitant amount of money under the cap this offseason. Front load an extension and lock Jimmy down so that the team has cap room in the future.

That's no horseshit... That's thoroughbred stallion sperm!

 

[ajz20]

Look, I'm just a grownman paid to teach children, not Sake Brown, but my post wasn't horseshit. If you read my previous posts I'm arguing for a contract extension before the trade. The Browns have an exorbitant ount ofoney under the cap this offseason. Front load an extension and lock Jimmy down so that the team has cap room in the future.

That's no horseshit... That's thoroughbred stallion sperm!

Keys bottom line. No matter if it is trading for JG or drafting the right rookie this year, if the Browns still have a whole at QB in two years and the team is still well below .500 this admin is out the door. I liked JG out of college but I can not pretend he is a sure thing as a top 15 NFL guy. Do we have the right talent evaluaters to look at his college tape and limited pro action and make that determination? That is the million dollar question. The selection of Kessler and RG 3 are pretty alarming to be honest as the brief history of the staff's ability to evaluate qb play.

 

[Seiklis]

Keys bottom line. No matter if it is trading for JG or drafting the right rookie this year, if the Browns still have a whole at QB in two years and the team is still well below .500 this admin is out the door. I liked JG out of college but I can not pretend he is a sure thing as a top 15 NFL guy. Do we have the right talent evaluaters to look at his college tape and limited pro action and make that determination? That is the million dollar question. The selection of Kessler and RG 3 are pretty alarming to be honest as the brief history of the staff's ability to evaluate qb play.

While I agree with that, the fact they were clearly in the tank last year kinda explains some of the thinking process. RGIII was a complete shot in the dark they were hoping would show something, Kessler I still think was drafted to be a backup, a guy who stays around as long as Hue does and does his job. Maybe Hue thought more of him, I didn't really. Just not enough arm there.

Well maybe Sashay Brown will get this finally, gut feeling it's going to be JG or TT along with Dobbs

 

[ajz20]

While I agree with that, the fact they were clearly in the tank last year kinda explains some of the thinking process. RGIII was a complete shot in the dark they were hoping would show something, Kessler I still think was drafted to be a backup, a guy who stays around as long as Hue does and does his job. Maybe Hue thought more of him, I didn't really. Just not enough arm there.

Well maybe Sashay Brown will get this finally, gut feeling it's going to be JG or TT along with Dobbs

Not sure why anyone wants Dobbs in the NFL. He could not even complete balls to wide open wrs on a consistent basis on the college level if you watched Tenn football. He will probably have a miserable time vs second and third stringers in pre season, let alone the real guys if he ever gets reg season time. You are not the first person to bring him up, but there really is no basis for thinking he can play a lick at the pro level.