To those of you who love to complain about the Indians' payroll...

[imahustla]

The Oakland A's have a smaller payroll than the Tribe, yet they just crushed Minnesota and steamrolled into the ALCS, where they might be favored no matter who they play (yes, even NYY). Tribe fans complain so much about Dolan's lack of spending and whining about "oh we just don't have the resources to go get the right players." Well, Oaktown and their management doesn't make excuses. They just put up their fourth AL West Champions banner in seven years, made the playoffs for the fifth time since 2000, and are now finally in the ALCS with a team infinitely weaker than the ones they've had in the past.

Sure, you might say, "well they went out there and signed Frank Thomas and Esteban Loiza!" You are kidding me if you thought that the Big Hurt was going to do anything for the rest of his career after seeing how his White Sox tenure ended. And the Yankees...the Yankees...gave up on Loaiza. But you know what? Oakland GM Billy Beane went bargain hunting and got the most bang for his buck, picking up a guy who turned out to be his best hitter, Thomas, for a one-year, incentive-laden deal (a "Kevin Millwood" contract, as I like to call it) while other teams went after other younger, less-established, and more expensive guys. Loaiza gave him an unbelievable RHP to put behind Zito in the rotation while the Tribe went after the Paul Byrds and Jason Johnsons of the world.

And if you think the Indians have had bad luck watching free agent after free agent leave town (Belle, ManRam, Thome), the A's watched Giambi, Tejada, Hudson, and Mulder all leave yet stayed competitive and above .500 without them. Did they blame their owner? Did they bitch and moan about "We need to spend more!" No. Winners do their winning while whiners do their whining.

If $55-60 million is enough to get you to the ALCS, then nobody should be bitching about our $61 million payroll. I leave it to you to find out who the REAL blame lies with.

 

[lebron720]

(Sure, you might say, "well they went out there and signed Frank Thomas and Esteban Loiza!" You are kidding me if you thought that the Big Hurt was going to do anything for the rest of his career after seeing how his White Sox tenure ended.)



THEN IM KIDDING YOU. EVERY FREAKING PERSON HERE KNOWS A HEALTHY FRANK THOMAS IS ONE OF THE BEST HITTERS IN THE GAME.

 

[cdt]

Alright then lets just sit at 61 million and win 70 games a year then CA. And all will be right with the world.

We can sign a 35 year old utility infielder each year whos on the ropes of his career and deal him at the deadline for a bag of chips to be named later.

Not to mention the AL West isn't as good as the AL Central or the fact that the A's almost dealt Zito this season because they didn't look like they were going to get in but I digress.

 

[imahustla]

(Sure, you might say, "well they went out there and signed Frank Thomas and Esteban Loiza!" You are kidding me if you thought that the Big Hurt was going to do anything for the rest of his career after seeing how his White Sox tenure ended.)



THEN IM KIDDING YOU. EVERY FREAKING PERSON HERE KNOWS A HEALTHY FRANK THOMAS IS ONE OF THE BEST HITTERS IN THE GAME.

Then why did he get one of the smallest contracts in free agency last winter? Why was most of it non-guaranteed?

 

[imahustla]

Alright then lets just sit at 61 million and win 70 games a year then CA. And all will be right with the world.

We can sign a 35 year old utility infielder each year whos on the ropes of his career and deal him at the deadline for a bag of chips to be named later.

Not to mention the AL West isn't as good as the AL Central or the fact that the A's almost dealt Zito this season because they didn't look like they were going to get in but I digress.

That isn't Dolan's fault. Dolan isn't the one who makes the trades. Yeah, his payroll isn't what we're used to, but Florida won the WS three years ago with a $49 million payroll and now Oakland won 94 games and is in the ALCS with a payroll less than ours. And Boston is out of the playoffs with a payroll twice as big as anyone's except the Yankees'. Speaking of the Yankees, they might have spent $200 million for the right to lose to Detroit in the first round.

It's not how much money you spend. It's how you spend it. There are some genius GMs out there (true geniuses, not just guys who get that label and then do nothing with it) like Billy Beane and Minnesota's Terry Ryan, who have made juggernauts out of next to NOTHING. You can spend all the money in the world, like the BoSox and Yanks do. That doesn't guarantee championships. Hell, it doesn't even guarantee playoffs. Just ask Boston. My point is for people to quit whining about the payroll and look at our GM, who uses his money to sign clowns like Paul Byrd and Jason Johnson when he could have gone after Esteban Loiza, who didn't get that big of a contract, anyways? He got three years and $21 million. You know what we paid Paul Byrd? Freaking $14 million over two years! We gave Johnson $4 million for a year! So we go out and spend $11 million for this season (7 for Byrd, 4 for JJ) on two stiffs while a playoff team went out and got a solid #2 guy behind Zito.

You know what they gave to Frank Thomas? $500,000 a year! It was incentive-laden, and he hit all his incentives. Still, they got the most bang for their buck at almost NOTHING! That PROVES that not many people thought that Frank Thomas still had it or could stay healthy anymore when he's getting one-year deals for less than $1 million.

And yes, the Indians are out there signing clowns like Jason Michaels. Yet it's Dolan's fault.

 

[lebron720]

Then why did he get one of the smallest contracts in free agency last winter? Why was most of it non-guaranteed?

u should have said that '' no one expected thomas to stay healthy'' i would agree 100% with that. but everyone knows that if he is healthy, thomas is one of the best u can get. A's took a chance and it payed off big time.

 

[Cavs1]

when he could have gone after Esteban Loiza, who didn't get that big of a contract, anyways? He got three years and $21 million. You know what we paid Paul Byrd? Freaking $14 million over two years!

So Byrd and Loaiza make exactly the same amount of money. And each was as much of a gamble as the other. Loaiza worked out and Byrd didn't. You'll have that. It was hit or miss...we missed(no surprise) and they got lucky and hit.

 

[imahustla]

In May of 2005, even before we went on that great run to close the season, I was on the Jim Leyland bandwagon. I wanted Wedge gone. Leyland still had it in him, and he definitely has proved it this season. Of course, we still kept Wedge because of that false hope he gave us at the end of 2005, where "barely missing the playoffs" still remains his greatest accomplishment. Figures that in the Indians' organization, being "almost good but not good enough" warrants you long-term security.

Now I'm on the Joe Girardi bandwagon. This guy WILL be a playoff fixture in a few years, if not sooner, and is exactly what a young team like the Tribe needs. But watch us just keep Wedge, flounder to another underachieving season, watch Girardi lead some other team like Texas to the playoffs, and then watch our fans somehow find fault with Dolan over all this while some other team with a penny-pinching payroll makes the World Series instead of finding excuses.

 

[Smooth]

Now I'm on the Joe Girardi bandwagon. This guy WILL be a playoff fixture in a few years, if not sooner, and is exactly what a young team like the Tribe needs. But watch us just keep Wedge, flounder to another underachieving season, watch Girardi lead some other team like Texas to the playoffs, and then watch our fans somehow find fault with Dolan over all this while some other team with a penny-pinching payroll makes the World Series instead of finding excuses.

I don't know CA.. But I kinda have to agree with you on this one.. I really liked how Girardi handled himself in Florida and got the young players to play well for him...

 

[cavincali]

Nobody brought this up so I will...

Shapiro dealed ben and perez and they sucked for the mariner. Garko steeped in played great and now we have a 5 hitter. Another great move.

This team will be dominate again, in the short future.

 

[imahustla]

^^^We'll see, Cali. We'll see. I'm afraid that 93 wins in 2005 was this team's ceiling, and we might not see it again. If we do, it won't be under Wedge.

 

[Mac]

It was the ceiling if we dont get some arms in here..

The difference between the As and the Indians is that their farm system has produced one of the best rotations in baseball.

 

[lebron720]

^^^We'll see, Cali. We'll see. I'm afraid that 93 wins in 2005 was this team's ceiling, and we might not see it again. If we do, it won't be under Wedge.

well wedge took us to the 93 wins in the first place.

I expect are pitching coach to be gone to. this guy just sits on the bench and gives blank stares. we need someone who will be involved.

 

[James]

well wedge took us to the 93 wins in the first place.

I expect are pitching coach to be gone to. this guy just sits on the bench and gives blank stares. we need someone who will be involved.

dumbest thing i have ever heard ever. what do you want him to do? get out there and show him how to pitch like its some little league game or something? they do that in practice.

 

[lebron720]

cdt edit: Hey buddy why don't you layoff the swearing a little bit eh? This isn't OT EAYOR. Keep it clean.