Training Camp News

[Giambiwannabe7]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

The problem is... J.J.'s numbers with Z were terrible last year. It was like Z was playing with Drew Gooden all over again. Z has constantly been overcompensating for less understanding big men who can play defense correctly. Having someone that knows what they're doing makes things much easier, and the result is more wins like in 2009. Z excelled with Shawn Kemp when he wasn't high, and he's done well with Ben and Andy this past year because of their awareness.

If J.J. can actually get the defense together in his head, this should speed things up. But Shaq should make an effective partner as well. Andy's problem is being able to consistently shoot well 10-15 feet back. J.J. has proven he can do it a little better and should be able to hit that jumper because he's more capable. Z is a shooter, so it means Andy's best work can be done being paired with Z.

The way I could see it working would be (if J.J. can't start but at least do some stuff well):

• Start Shaq and Andy
  [*]With 9:00 to go in the 1st quarter, sub Andy for J.J. (Shaq and J.J./or Darnell, whatever)
• With 4 minutes to go, sub Shaq and J.J. for Z and Andy
• Second quarter? Start with Shaq/J.J. or Z/Andy, then switch with 9 minutes. At that point, having Andy take more minutes away by staying in with Z AND Shaq.

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Delonte should have no problem taking the sixth man role, as long as he doesn't obsess over it. Delonte should be fine, and if Danny and/or Mike explain how he'll have more responsibility as the result of taking control of the second unit, that will mean he may realize the importance. Last year had no real solid sixth man with the ability to create offense from everywhere, and as a result... Mo and Delonte (and Z before that) had to share the duties while waiting for LeBron's rest to be over. With Parker here, there is at least one solid member from the bench with that responsibility (Z as well, but not the ability to create as much as just giving points and not BLEEDING points as much). Delonte is younger and should have the Sixth Man of the Year ability if he goes to the bench.

But who knows if Delonte's mind is in the right spot? We should wait a little before laying it on thick.

The responsibility of Boobie also comes into play. If he can't do the point guard duties well, fine... we have more guys to take that pressure off. If he proves to improve his point guard abilities with John Lucas, then that's actually pretty important. He can take A LITTLE load off the other guys, FTW.

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Now after hearing more about the practice, I really do have much higher hopes now. This depth I keep seeing and hearing about is not only good for rest, it actually makes practices competitive. Now we can have them push each other in ways never seen before. This goes a long way to giving everyone the motivation. And if we lose 2-3 guys for any given practice, they still have depth similar to last year:

Here we go again!

Depth #|Center|Power Forward|Small Forward|Shooting Guard|Point Guard
First String|Shaquille O'Neal|Anderson Varejao|LeBron James|Delonte West|Mo Williams
Second String|Zydrunas Ilgauskas|J.J./Leon ( * )|Jamario Moon|Anthony Parker|Daniel Gibson
Third String|Luke/Darryl|Rob Kurz/Darnell|Jawad Williams|Danny Green|Coby/Russell/Andre

It's so awesome. We really can win a championship this year. So many weaknesses were addressed. Nothing could stop us if we want it badly enough!

I wouldn't make any decisions about JJ and Z on the court together based on anything from last season. As Ferry told us on draft night, JJ was a second to third year type of project. His first season looked way too overwhelming to make any kind of proper judgement for this season.

Eh, I'd rather not be subbing anyone with only 3 minutes in the book. How are these guys supposed to get any kind of rhythm going when the starting five only get 3 minutes together to start the game? You just can't pull Andy that quick.

By the looks of your rotation, Delonte wouldn't even be our 6th man. He'd be somewhere near 8 or 9 or 10, although it's not specified so it's hard to say. Then again, later in the post, your chart states he's starting.

Dude, you got me confused as hell in this post:chuckles: Not the typically well organized Rabman post I am accustomed to.

 

[cab]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

mo, delonte & lebron worked well together last yr. Im not sure I would change that. a reporter did ask mike brown if he thought delonte would be better off the bench because he is the back up point guard and he said that he was the back up point last year and it worked out fine. I really think he will start delonte unless he does really bad in training camp. hopefully he starts to get more energy and his body adjusts to the meds soon.

PF position I think you start Andy because of his defense and then JJ off the bench to give the 2nd unit more scoring. If JJ is out there with the 1st unit and will have a limited # of shots.

 

[Jon]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

The problem is... J.J.'s numbers with Z were terrible last year.

Insufficient data?

Hickson played all of 24 minutes with Z, and LeBron wasn't part of it.

Most of his minutes he was on the court with Andy and also without LeBron, and that wasn't pretty either.

JJ has the mobility and off the ball athleticism to compliment Z (or Shaq) very well, IMO he's just lacking experience and perhaps court awareness, but I really think it's way too early in his career to lay the later on him.

 

[Thunder]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

Ferry Holds West Out Of Scrimmage

Cavaliers guard Delonte West did not join his teammates for an intrasquad scrimmage on Saturday, the public’s first chance to see LeBron James and Shaquille O’Neal on the floor together as teammates.

A team spokesman said GM Danny Ferry made the decision for West to sit out the scrimmage, according to an Associated Press report.

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/61917/20091003/ferry_holds_west_out_of_scrimmage/

 

[Walter White]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/61917/20091003/ferry_holds_west_out_of_scrimmage/

RealGm was about 2 hours late on that one.

 

[rabman_gold]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

I wouldn't make any decisions about JJ and Z on the court together based on anything from last season. As Ferry told us on draft night, JJ was a second to third year type of project. His first season looked way too overwhelming to make any kind of proper judgement for this season.

Eh, I'd rather not be subbing anyone with only 3 minutes in the book. How are these guys supposed to get any kind of rhythm going when the starting five only get 3 minutes together to start the game? You just can't pull Andy that quick.

By the looks of your rotation, Delonte wouldn't even be our 6th man. He'd be somewhere near 8 or 9 or 10, although it's not specified so it's hard to say. Then again, later in the post, your chart states he's starting.

Dude, you got me confused as hell in this post:chuckles: Not the typically well organized Rabman post I am accustomed to.

Sorry about that. I tried separating the post using the "------------"s so people could tell I was going off into three different topics related to Training Camp.

The first part was discussing the front court only. As JonFromVA said, 24 minutes that J.J. played with Z doesn't tell a lot. If J.J. can be given a shot there, I suppose it could work as long as J.J. can continue to develop.

The second part was relating to Delonte only as a Sixth Man. He'd be perfect for the role, if Delonte's mindset is in the right place when the decision has to come. It's all up to him. He could either have the Jerry Stackhouse effect or the Allen Iverson effect.

The third part was relating to the great depth in general. In this case, I was using a depth chart unrelated to the first two parts. It's assuming what is the most likely, assuming Delonte was the most effective as the starter as well as Andy. Delonte being a sixth man would be a different story, but we can assume that Parker and Delonte could switch places at any given time. Leon Powe had a (*) because he's the only one currently injured and out.

Hope that clears things up.

 

[Mdog1]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

Bold prediction... you do remember we traded for Shaq this off-season?

Yes I do, and we lost two players because of it. With Powe all we lose is money. If he comes back to 100% I think he will be the best addition, not necessarily the best player, but the best addition because he would shore up the PF spot and make JJ even more expendable in a trade.

 

[Jon]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

Yes I do, and we lost two players because of it. With Powe all we lose is money. If he comes back to 100% I think he will be the best addition, not necessarily the best player, but the best addition because he would shore up the PF spot and make JJ even more expendable in a trade.

Not so different cost-wise. Sasha was going to get dumped, so Shaq pretty much just cost us money too, give or take what Ben can contribute this year. Plus no one can even guess at this point how Leon will bounce back from surgery and what he'll have in the tank once he's ready to go.

Anyway, you'd better be wrong, 'cause Shaq's going to have to be a serious bust for your prediction to come true and make the most dominating center in league history become less valuable then an undersized hustle guy.

 

[cab]

Re: Training Camp News *West Reports, Post #495*

wine & gold: do you know if west kept from the scrimmage to keep him away from the media or because he had a set back? also do you know how he looks from a basketball standpoint?

 

[Chris]

Gettin amped, every Browns loss just gets me more amped.

 

[Gimme Some Mo]

Are they practicing today? I haven't heard any updates.

 

[neyvit]

Update from Windy on LBJ/Edwards "feud." I assume this is during today's training camp.

PDcavsinsider LeBron just ripped Braylon Edwards for (allegedly) punching his friend last night. Called Edwards "jealous" of him and "childish."

I can totally see ESPN blowing this out of proportion to try to build up the drama.

 

[sjeppe]

Instead of Braylon being Jealous of Lebron, he should be thinking if i caught my damn passes and scored some TDs Cleveland will love me and i will get paid.
Its not that hard, you think he would be smart enough to understand, if you perform you will be loved and will get his $$.

If it was me and i wanted to be Loved like Lebron i would work my ass off to be the best i can be and the rest would come, how can he be so dumb to think that hitting someone is going to make it better.

 

[Gimme Some Mo]

If there is camp today, why no update on if Delonte is there?

 

[hud11]

as if braylon needed any more reason for the city of cleveland to hate him, now he's got lebron ripping on him.