Tyronn Lue has been fired

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

Fully agree.

I get wanting to go small, but why should that be the starting lineup? GS plays small all the time but their starting lineup is big with a frontcourt of KD, Green, and Pachulia.

With Rose out, I'd rather we give the starting minutes to someone like Tristan over Calderon. Backup minutes go to Zizic. Start with:

Smith
James
Crowder
Love
Thompson

This lineup has defense AND it can spread the floor for shooting.

Smith has guarded point guards numerous times since his time here (we hid Kyrie on defense lots of times).

And run a bench with Wade, Shumpert, Korver, Green, Zizic. Obviously we can mix-n-match starters with the bench. Gives Wade an opportunity to play-make off the bench, while LeBron does it with the starters. We can go small or big for stretches at a time.

why can;t Lebron guard the PG's? 1 on 1 he can guard most PGs and against a pick he can just switch and guard the 4/5.. he doesn't have to do that for a full duration of the game obviously, but it's nice to start the game like that and take the other team completely off their game.

Almost every team in the league would rather create scoring opportunites in PnR situations and Lebron is probably the most versatile defender in the league. If they want to attack him with their 4/5 then go at it.

 

[JMoneyYourHoney]

Fully agree.

I get wanting to go small, but why should that be the starting lineup? GS plays small all the time but their starting lineup is big with a frontcourt of KD, Green, and Pachulia.

With Rose out, I'd rather we give the starting minutes to someone like Tristan over Calderon. Backup minutes go to Zizic. Start with:

Smith
James
Crowder
Love
Thompson

This lineup has defense AND it can spread the floor for shooting.

Smith has guarded point guards numerous times since his time here (we hid Kyrie on defense lots of times).

And run a bench with Wade, Shumpert, Korver, Green, Zizic. Obviously we can mix-n-match starters with the bench. Gives Wade an opportunity to play-make off the bench, while LeBron does it with the starters. We can go small or big for stretches at a time.

Bottom line is that with this depth's team and versatility, there's absolutely no reason to not try different things. We finally have the luxury of deploying all sorts of different looks.

 

[TyGuy]

Rocket Surgeon.

 

[MirORich]

Rocket Surgeon.

Makes little sense as a drive by attack as one of the things Ty is widely credited for is his ATO plays and playoff defensive adjustments made on every team besides GS

 

[ACisKING]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...-handles-dwyane-wade-lineup-change-deft-touch

I think that article does a good job of explaining why Lue did what he did, and why it was the best approach. Managing egos is an underrated part of a head coach's job in the NBA.

 

[MirORich]

Bottom line is that with this depth's team and versatility, there's absolutely no reason to not try different things. We finally have the luxury of deploying all sorts of different looks.

-Difficult to assess whether one is "trying all sorts of different looks" or not after 3 games of an 82 game regular season

-More difficult with IT and Rose out and JR having to leave game 1 with back stiffness, which has now reoccured and may keep him from playing tonight

-Even more difficult when every single "trying out of all sorts of different looks" is greeted with the fan expectation that each move/new look is instantly successful or else it immediately becomes ironclad proof of bad or out of touch coaching.

I have never once stated I thought Ty was a top5 coach. I've never said he's a great coach. One of the main tenets that I've made is simply two fold:

1. One and a half years is an awful short time to grade a coach as "horrible", especially given the end results of those two post seasons
2. Those 1.5 years have also had some fairly specific and unique circumstances(Working for Dan Gilbert/with LeBron James, taking over a team mid season, the sheer number of injuries and roster turnover last year mid season, 8 new players this year+ a shortened preseason+LeBron misses almost all of training camp)

To me, there is simply not a long sample size or overriding evidence to grade Ty Lue as a top10 coach or bottom 10 coach at this point. At the end of this season, that sample size grows by another 40%

 

[kookoo]

Rocket Surgeon.

You've never heard that joke? Brain surgeon. Rocket scientist. Rocket surgeon. C'mon man. I'd expect ORich not to get it...

 

[TyGuy]

You've never heard that joke? Brain surgeon. Rocket scientist. Rocket surgeon. C'mon man. I'd expect ORich not to get it...

Brain scientist.

 

[MirORich]

@kookoo If you're going to continue to turn it away from an actual argument of merit, analysis, and opinions in to just a personal thing, at least figure out how to use the tagging feature correctly.

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

@kookoo If you're going to continue to turn it away from an actual argument of merit, analysis, and opinions in to just a personal thing, at least figure out how to use the tagging feature correctly.

I love that even though you hold different views from certain members of this site you always keep it clean, civil and composed. Or is it the other way around? You are tolerant towards the members that hold different views.. my bad.


Real talk.

 

[czvo]

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/...-handles-dwyane-wade-lineup-change-deft-touch

I think that article does a good job of explaining why Lue did what he did, and why it was the best approach. Managing egos is an underrated part of a head coach's job in the NBA.

Article is exactly what MoFlo said when it was announced Wade was the starter...

People forget that you sometimes have to show people something with their own eyes before you can convince them you're right.

 

[kookoo]

-Difficult to assess whether one is "trying all sorts of different looks" or not after 3 games of an 82 game regular season

-More difficult with IT and Rose out and JR having to leave game 1 with back stiffness, which has now reoccured and may keep him from playing tonight

-Even more difficult when every single "trying out of all sorts of different looks" is greeted with the fan expectation that each move/new look is instantly successful or else it immediately becomes ironclad proof of bad or out of touch coaching.

I have never once stated I thought Ty was a top5 coach. I've never said he's a great coach. One of the main tenets that I've made is simply two fold:

1. One and a half years is an awful short time to think to grade a coach as "horrible", especially given the end results of those two post seasons
2. Those 1.5 years have also had some fairly specific and unique circumstances(Working for Dan Gilbert/with LeBron James, taking over a team mid season, the sheer number of injuries and roster turnover last year mid season, 8 new players this year+ a shortened preseason+LeBron misses almost all of training camp)

To me, there is simply not a long sample size or overriding evidence to grade Ty Lue as a top10 coach or bottom 10 coach at this point. At the end of this season, that sample size grows by another 40%

It's not about where you rank him. It's that you're so quickly dismissive of any criticism of Lue just because he's a 'newer' coach. In that same sense, why not allow our younger players to get more playtime and work through their kinks. If that's how self improvement works? If you want to say Lue won a championship his first time as a head coach, hell... Maybe Cedi will help win a championship his first season...

It's not about the experience. Tons of young coaches have looked more composed as first year coaches. Lue's been around a lot of great coaching his entire career. Phil Jackson, Doc Rivers, Stan Van Gundy, Scott Skiles, Avery Johnson... I don't know how many guys have had the chance to play or work for that much good coaching. Excuses shouldn't be so quick to come up when talking about things he's doing wrong. Any coach with Kevin Love, Kyrie Irving and LeBron James as their 3 top players should be highly criticized when things go wrong. Because there are teams out there with much less talent trying to scrape through. And they should not be beating us, even on a back to back to back to back.

 

[kookoo]

@kookoo If you're going to continue to turn it away from an actual argument of merit, analysis, and opinions in to just a personal thing, at least figure out how to use the tagging feature correctly.

@MirORich I know you watch this thread like a hawk. Why would I need to tag you @MirORich? I'm not sure it's really that necessary @MirORich. @MirORich, you have to understand, anytime someone says something negative about Lue your bat signal shines bright through the streets of Downtown Cleveland and you're there to defend Lue. It's admirable but I just feel like telling you why I don't like Lue as a coach. People shit on me for not liking him. Good for them. It's their opinion. I'll respond if I want, I won't respond if I don't want to. If they make fun of me, I don't really care @MirORich because it's just random people on the internet. I'm not calling you out as a person. Just as a supporter of Lue. @MirORich.

 

[MirORich]

It's not about where you rank him. It's that you're so quickly dismissive of any criticism of Lue just because he's a 'newer' coach. In that same sense, why not allow our younger players to get more playtime and work through their kinks. If that's how self improvement works? If you want to say Lue won a championship his first time as a head coach, hell... Maybe Cedi will help win a championship his first season...

It's not about the experience. Tons of young coaches have looked more composed as first year coaches. Lue's been around a lot of great coaching his entire career. Phil Jackson, Doc Rivers, Stan Van Gundy, Scott Skiles, Avery Johnson... I don't know how many guys have had the chance to play or work for that much good coaching. Excuses shouldn't be so quick to come up when talking about things he's doing wrong. Any coach with Kevin Love, Kyrie Irving and LeBron James as their 3 top players should be highly criticized when things go wrong. Because there are teams out there with much less talent trying to scrape through. And they should not be beating us, even on a back to back to back to back.

I am not dismissive to criticism of moves Lue makes.

What I am dismissive of is how frequently people say that, on the whole, he's a horrible coach, as obviously I disagree. I try to state the reasons I disagree and although I am not the basketball mind that some are on this board, I do my best to make salient, relatable points

If I feel there is a myth involved(like the idea that Pop gives all his rookies instant rotation minutes), I try to illustrate why it is a myth.

I'll leave it at that for now. A lot of this is getting circular and the same people(including me) saying the same things.

 

[MirORich]

@MirORich I know you watch this thread like a hawk. Why would I need to tag you @MirORich? I'm not sure it's really that necessary @MirORich. @MirORich, you have to understand, anytime someone says something negative about Lue your bat signal shines bright through the streets of Downtown Cleveland and you're there to defend Lue. It's admirable but I just feel like telling you why I don't like Lue as a coach. People shit on me for not liking him. Good for them. It's their opinion. I'll respond if I want, I won't respond if I don't want to. If they make fun of me, I don't really care @MirORich because it's just random people on the internet. I'm not calling you out as a person. Just as a supporter of Lue. @MirORich.

See this is good! You are now an expert level Tag function user.

Believe it or not, a lot of my opinions on this have to do with the position of coaching itself and of the circumstances of this job. I'm not particularly fond or unfond of Ty Lue as a person, although I do think he is a good man and has a sly/dry sense of humor, which I always appreciate.