Welcome Larry Sanders and So Long

[buzzdog]

I wasn't really looking to debate your post. You are more than entitled to your belief. I would love it if you were right, and the Cavs did get a lot out of him.

I simply quoted your post because I think it's just a tad high when it comes to what we should expect. You are right that the Cavs have more information on him than you or I do. I also think that, if you were to ask the decision makers off the record, they likely wouldn't express anything close to what I've seen posted here. I'm seeing this guy bandied about as the Cavs' defensive savior THIS year. In the playoffs, no less. That's not fair to anyone, Larry included. We aren't talking about a guy that has been injury-plagued for a couple years and has been busting his butt to get back on the floor. We're talking about a guy who hasn't played actual basketball in over two years after walking away on his own accord.

So often we see rookies or young guys make a leap after a full season(s) of playing, and when they are asked why, they almost always say they finally got used to the speed of the game. Well, we are now expecting a guy who hasn't played in over two years to get up to speed after two weeks in the D-League, two weeks of end of the year regular season basketball, and be ready for a title run? I'm sorry, but I'm going to be skeptical.

And I use Dahntay Jones as an example because he played consistently for years to stay somewhat ready for his moment. Larry Sanders has played ZERO basketball. As far as any of us know, he was playing pickup at best. I don't care what the "needs" may be for a guy like Sanders, I simply don't think it's fair to expect him and fill those needs.


I hope to be wrong. I just think people should temper their expectations, as in, don't have any.

You seem to be more than just skeptical. Why would the Cavs even bother to sign the guy if it is as utterly dismal as you make it out to be? Your outlook makes it seem like you believe it's a waste of time to bother with Sanders at all. I think he might give us more than what we would have gotten out of a healthy Birdman this year (faint praise I know) with lots of upside for next year.

 

[iamacavalier]

I wasn't really looking to debate your post. You are more than entitled to your belief. I would love it if you were right, and the Cavs did get a lot out of him.

I simply quoted your post because I think it's just a tad high when it comes to what we should expect. You are right that the Cavs have more information on him than you or I do. I also think that, if you were to ask the decision makers off the record, they likely wouldn't express anything close to what I've seen posted here. I'm seeing this guy bandied about as the Cavs' defensive savior THIS year. In the playoffs, no less. That's not fair to anyone, Larry included. We aren't talking about a guy that has been injury-plagued for a couple years and has been busting his butt to get back on the floor. We're talking about a guy who hasn't played actual basketball in over two years after walking away on his own accord.

So often we see rookies or young guys make a leap after a full season(s) of playing, and when they are asked why, they almost always say they finally got used to the speed of the game. Well, we are now expecting a guy who hasn't played in over two years to get up to speed after two weeks in the D-League, two weeks of end of the year regular season basketball, and be ready for a title run? I'm sorry, but I'm going to be skeptical.

And I use Dahntay Jones as an example because he played consistently for years to stay somewhat ready for his moment. Larry Sanders has played ZERO basketball. As far as any of us know, he was playing pickup at best. I don't care what the "needs" may be for a guy like Sanders, I simply don't think it's fair to expect him and fill those needs.


I hope to be wrong. I just think people should temper their expectations, as in, don't have any.

I haven't seen anyone crown him the defensive savior. I have seen people excited to get a 28 yo with the wear and tear of a 25 year old. A guy who has an impossible 7'7 wingspan (only topped by whiteside currently) and is a known freak athlete. Of course he will take time to adjust. But the difference is he has made that adjustment once already. He has to know how hard it will be.

 

[Man Called X]

I'm excited as fuck for this.

Which means it'll be an utter failure.

 

[czvo]

You seem to be more than just skeptical. Why would the Cavs even bother to sign the guy if it is as utterly dismal as you make it out to be? Your outlook makes it seem like you believe it's a waste of time to bother with Sanders at all. I think he might give us more than what we would have gotten out of a healthy Birdman this year (faint praise I know) with lots of upside for next year.

Quite the opposite, in fact. I think it's a great gamble by this organization. Why would the Cavs bother? Same reason they went after Bynum a few years back. It works out, great. If not, no skin off their back.

My point really has been don't expect anything this year. We know the Cavs had two options at center: Bogut and Sanders. Signing Bogut says, "we know our deficiencies, and we are doing what we can to cover them up for a couple months." That failed. Signing Sanders says, "we know our deficiencies, but we aren't going to be able to cover them up this year. Let's take a chance on a guy that can turn this weakness into a strength next year."

Larry Sanders and Derrick Williams are the exact type of moves the Cavs need to be making. I know vets win championships, but the Cavs have enough vets. They need to start supplementing them with younger players with higher ceilings.


Now, all of that being said, it's still a guy who hasn't played in over two years and left on his own accord (this is clearly a bigger sticking point with me than most). Not only do you have to question his skills/stamina, but you also have to question his desire and, because of his issues, his mental well-being. As Cavs fans, we've seen first hand both the good and bad of employing a player with mental health issues.

 

[Pioneer10]

I get excited thinking about Sanders and then I remember despite all the fluffy talk about his workout they made a sprint in the other direction for Bogut (who has looked old/injured this year for Dallas) when both were available. Oh well high reward/low risk, hopefully Lebron can do his Jedi mind tricks on him but then again even Lebron couldn't save Delonte. Talk myself, Talk myself down with this guy

 

[Snarly]

Quite the opposite, in fact. I think it's a great gamble by this organization. Why would the Cavs bother? Same reason they went after Bynum a few years back. It works out, great. If not, no skin off their back.

My point really has been don't expect anything this year.

To me this has to due with was he working on this before he signed, If he came ready and needs a few "simulation" games before he plays his first in a Cavs uni then we will see him but to expect anything ground breaking is a bit to high, If he can us some defense and allow players not to get the rim like Moses parted the sea then he will have use.

 

[InBoobieWeTrust]

I have optimism for this year, but aside from that.

If Sanders does play well, is productive, etc...then next year is where we really will be getting a huge steal. It'd be a huge boost for us. These are the kind of moves necessary to continue to keep contender around the big 3 for as long as their window is open.

The Cavs would have been silly to pass on Bogut for Sanders. Bogut is a proven elite defensive commodity and he was still good on that end this year. That is not a knock on Sanders, IMO.

 

[czvo]

To me this has to due with was he working on this before he signed, If he came ready and needs a few "simulation" games before he plays his first in a Cavs uni then we will see him but to expect anything ground breaking is a bit to high, If he can us some defense and allow players not to get the rim like Moses parted the sea then he will have use.

But that's the thing, Snarly. It assumes that a few "simulation" games can get a player readjusted to the NBA game after over 2 years off. I can't agree that it does.

And we're basically throwing him to the playoffs immediately, which as EVERYONE on this board has pointed out numerous times throughout this season, is a totally different animal.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

I get excited thinking about Sanders and then I remember despite all the fluffy talk about his workout they made a sprint in the other direction for Bogut (who has looked old/injured this year for Dallas) when both were available.

Exactly where I am. At this point, there basically was nobody else left, so they took a flier. Doesn't mean they saw much more than "what the hell, why not?"

 

[Sebastian]

I have optimism for this year, but aside from that.

If Sanders does play well, is productive, etc...then next year is where we really will be getting a huge steal. It'd be a huge boost for us. These are the kind of moves necessary to continue to keep contender around the big 3 for as long as their window is open.

The Cavs would have been silly to pass on Bogut for Sanders. Bogut is a proven elite defensive commodity and he was still good on that end this year. That is not a knock on Sanders, IMO.

This cannot be said enough. The only thing that has prevented the Big-Three Cavs from being overwhelmingly dominant is the lack of a true blue, elite rim-protector. Mozgov was a good rim-protector but not even close to Sanders in his best Bucks years.

We may not see Sanders at his best this year, but watch out next year if he can keep his head on straight. Skills like shot-blocking, rebounding and overall good defense only degrade if one's body starts going or when one simply doesn't engage in the due diligence of learning the defensive scheme. With a full summer on a NBA conditioning regimen (he needs to gain 15-20 lbs of muscle), LeBron the "Bad-Apple Whisperer" keeping him motivated, and a full-camp, the Cavs should get Sanders as close to 100% as he ever will be.

Again, if his head is in the right place he should be a HUGE addition for next season.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

This cannot be said enough. The only thing that has prevented the Big-Three Cavs from being overwhelmingly dominant is the lack of a true blue, elite rim-protector. Mozgov was a good rim-protector but not even close to Sanders in his best Bucks years.

We may not see Sanders at his best this year, but watch out next year if he can keep his head on straight. Skills like shot-blocking, rebounding and overall good defense only degrade if one's body starts going or when one simply doesn't engage in the due diligence of learning the defensive scheme. With a full summer on a NBA conditioning regimen (he needs to gain 15-20 lbs of muscle), LeBron the "Bad-Apple Whisperer" keeping him motivated, and a full-camp, the Cavs should get Sanders as close to 100% as he ever will be.

Again, if his head is in the right place he should be a HUGE addition for next season.

I don't disagree with any of that, but I don't think we should lose sight of how big an "if" that really is. Sanders seems to be much less of a JR Smith situation than a Delonte West situation -- and seemingly even worse than Delonte. The former was fixable through good coaching and teammates. The latter presented a much more difficult problem.

 

[Snarly]

But that's the thing, Snarly. It assumes that a few "simulation" games can get a player readjusted to the NBA game after over 2 years off. I can't agree that it does.

And we're basically throwing him to the playoffs immediately, which as EVERYONE on this board has pointed out numerous times throughout this season, is a totally different animal.

I agree in terms of what can and should happen but who knows what will. I am always ready for the worse but the best case is he gets that I want to win and play hard if we have him 100 percent next year will be great. However if he gets and knows who is and what he can do he could be productive this year. It all depends on him and that is everyones worry like him or hate him.

We could debate this till we are blue in the face or punching walls the only person who can prove anyone wrong is him. Like I said I give you his body shape and speed of the game is a huge factor. He is not a rookie though he has played the game and most I talk to it is like riding a bike. How will he fit in with his body and ability at this stage, I do not expect much but there is hope he will give something. In the play off if he can give that Dehanty Joned five minutes and knock a "A GS player on their ass and get ejected" he did his part this year.

 

[Snarly]

I have optimism for this year, but aside from that.

If Sanders does play well, is productive, etc...then next year is where we really will be getting a huge steal. It'd be a huge boost for us. These are the kind of moves necessary to continue to keep contender around the big 3 for as long as their window is open.

The Cavs would have been silly to pass on Bogut for Sanders. Bogut is a proven elite defensive commodity and he was still good on that end this year. That is not a knock on Sanders, IMO.

This is my point if nothing else Sanders shocks us and gives us what we needed from Bogut. It is not a reach either as it is unlikely but as we seen with the Cavs time and time again they keep making it happen. I love the option on his contract really like I said the rest is on Sanders, plain and simple.

 

[The Process God]

My question is: does a two-year contract such as the one we have with Larry Sanders provide us with his bird or early bird rights at the end of it? If he ends up being serviceable, why not try to keep him?

 

[Spencer Hawes]

If GS can play JaVale McGee meaningful minutes, I have faith that Larry Sanders can play meaningful minutes as well.