What Will the Next Cleveland Contender Look Like?

[Derek]

You'd miss out, then.. there is truly a reason why left handers have historically earned their reputation in baseball...

I don't know what this means

 

[MadThinker88]

I don't know what this means

Perhaps @Gson is referring to the perception that LHP take longer to develop and reach their full potential..

 

[Derek]

Perhaps @Gson is referring to the perception that LHP take longer to develop and reach their full potential..

Maybe that's true, maybe it's not.

Either way, I don't think that holds any bearing to the current conversation. Nobody is saying to jettison these guys into the sun and never let them pitch again. The odds are simply stacked against a guy like Hentges, who struggles with command and got lit up in AA to stick as a starter.

You can point to Randy Johnson as a counterexample, but he still managed to find success while being wild. There are also guys like Jake McGee and Andrew Miller (among many others) who either made the switch in the upper levels of the minors or after a few failed MLB seasons. Then you have countless guys like Nick Hagadone, who made the switch in the upper levels, had a cup of coffee in the bigs, but never amounted to anything.

I'm hopeful that Hentges falls into the Jake McGee/Andrew Miller class, and not the Nick Hagadone one.

 

[CATS44]

It means that there is a long tradition of lefties blossoming at later stages of their careers.

Cliff Lee...age 29
Randy Johnson...29
Jamie Moyer...32
Koufax, CC, Whitey Ford...all made big jumps at age 25.
Al Lieter...28
JA Happ...32
John Tudor...28

The list goes on and on.

 

[Gson]

Perhaps @Gson is referring to the perception that LHP take longer to develop and reach their full potential..

Lefties are always a little strange.. ALWAYS..

 

[CDAV45]

I'm just saying that you can't be patient with every single player. Some leashes are shorter than others, and patience is earned. There are some extenuating circumstances, but it's a fact that Hentges has had zero success above high-A yet. That's not a guy I'm going to keep throwing out there every 5th day, and hope he figures it out.

Most of all, citing Randy Johnson, one of the greatest pitchers of all time and all-time outlier stories, means nothing at all when it comes to Moss or Hentges.

Hentges had success today so that buys him another start IMO. Nothing is etched in stone so he'll have to continue to show well enough to warrant a spot in the rotation. My point was that you don't relegate a talent like Hentges to a limited role just because he struggles initially or hits a bump or 2 in the road along the way. I think that was CATS' point as well even though using a once in a generation talent as an example might not have been the best example. Point blank, the kid has a golden arm. If he loses his spot in the rotation then I prefer he be optioned to Columbus to continue his development as a starter. The BP is always an option, but I don't see the need to squash his value like that at this time. Especially when the BP is already loaded as CATS stated.

 

[MadThinker88]

@CDAV45
Even if Hentges had struggled today, I don't believe there was another starter already on the 40 man roster ready to step in & make the next start in Sams place.

Do I believe Moss/ Morgan deserve to get a chance in 2021? Yes
Do I believe either is ready for an 80 pitch outing with CLE? Not yet. Most likely in another week or 2.

Thankfully Sam did well enough to figure for another start during this west coast trip (in Anahiem).

 

[CATS44]

Deserving a shot, and getting one, are two different things.

Nobody 'deserves' a shot, if the ones already there are doing well.

I doubt thats gonna be a problem, because in a 162 game season, opportunities usually abound.

But the youngsters have to be prepared when those opportunities appear.

 

[KilgoreTrout]

A few things before I post this:

1) I hope that contender is the 2021 Indians, but I am not overly convinced
2) I am hopeful Jose will still be here when this happens, but that's not how the Indians typically operate
3) We are guessing on prospects, which is hard to do, and not able to include anyone the Indians may acquire
4) This is just for fun...I hope to hear other's thoughts on this as well.

So here's how I think the Cleveland Guardians will look the next time they contend for a World Series:

C – Bo Naylor – I’m keeping him here until the Indians say otherwise.

1B – Nolan Jones – I think Jones ends up finishing the 2021 season as team’s primary 1B, maybe sitting against tough LHP.

2B – Tyler Freeman – If the Indians fall out of it and trade Cesar, Freeman may get a look in the 2nd half.

SS – Andres Gimenez – Gimenez could end up in the utility role I have Miller in, but for now we’ll hope he sticks

3B – Gabriel Arias – He may still end up at SS, but with so many SS in the system I’ll stick him here where his arm would certainly play.

LF – George Valera – Though he could end up in CF or RF, I think he’d play best in LF at Progressive Field.

CF – Daniel Johnson – I’m hoping we see more and more of Johnson in CF as time goes on.

RF – Jordan Luplow – Luplow will be arb-eligible for the first time next year, so he’s around for awhile longer. He’ll at least play against LHP, but possibly every day if he shows he can do enough against righties too.

DH - Franmil Reyes

Utility – Owen Miller – Miller could end up at 2B, SS, or 3B, but for now we’ll say he gets regular at bats all over the field.

Backup 1B – Jake Bauers…just kidding

SP – Shane Bieber – Let us hope an extension of some kind takes place within the next year.

SP – Zach Plesac – I think he’ll continue to develop and be just fine as a #2-3 type

SP – Aaron Civale – I really like Civale’s long-term potential

SP – Daniel Espino – I’m really excited to see him pitch this year and hope he develops into the FOR starter the Indians believe he can be

SP – Ethan Hankins – I know many will go McKenzie here, or maybe Josh Wolf or Tanner Burns, but I’ll go Hankins.

Closer – Emmanuel Clase – “The Indians gave away Kluber for nothing” will end up being a really silly take

Setup – James Karinchak – As long as he doesn’t kill Berto with his cross-ups or go all John Rocker on social media, we’ve got a dominant 1-2 punch to end games

RP – Triston McKenzie – I hope he works out as a starter but I think there are serious durability concerns.

RP – Cal Quantrill – Bullpen still seems like the best fit

RP – Phil Maton – I wish they’d use him more – maybe that will come at some point

RP – Nick Sandlin – If he can stay healthy, I see no reason why he can’t be a pretty good pen arm

RP – Sam Hentges – They’ll try him as a starter and I hope it works, but ultimately, I see him here

RP – Bryan Shaw – TITO WILL NEVER LET GO

Ahem. The Cleveland Spiders.

 

[CDAV45]

The next Cleveland contender looks like this team with either CJ Cron or Jesus Aguilar playing 1B, and Amed Rosario playing SS.

They gave Amed an opportunity to play CF and he's passable now, can the same be done with Owen Miller so we can get his bat up here?

 

[Steve_424]

Ahem. The Cleveland Spiders.

Hate it lol

 

[KilgoreTrout]

Hate it lol

The logo possibilities are endless. WAY better than the Block C.

 

[Derek]

The logo possibilities are endless. WAY better than the Block C.

Considering I love the Block C, I disagree.

 

[FFRva]

Someday

Hentges might figure it out someday...sure...he might. In 2019 he showed absolutely nothing and so far this year his WHIP is 2.0. Showing absolutely nothing. He's here because of the fact Mejia and Moss aren't ready and Allen has been an abortion.

 

[Steve_424]

The logo possibilities are endless. WAY better than the Block C.

I just hate the idea of "Spiders" being the name. There's a very weak connection to Cleveland baseball history (and no connection to this franchise), has nothing to do with Cleveland, and it's not intimidating to anyone other than those with arachnophobia.

Guardians, to me, is the way to go. Keep the colors, keep Block C (or bring back Crooked C), keep the uniform design - just change the script "Indians" on the chest of the home jerseys to "Guardians". You pretty much maintain the branding, which maintains a connection to the team we're cheering for now. It's got a unique connection to the city and the Guardians literally stand outside Progressive Field

It also turns what has become a negative team name into a positive one - guardians can be anyone...they are selfless, looking out for those who need help or safety.

Renaming the Indians the Cleveland Spiders with an all-new look would, to me, feel like starting over...almost like an expansion team. Shifting a tad toward Guardians and keeping so much of the identity we've all grown up to love is a better option to me.