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The Official Game of Thrones [A Song of Ice and Fire] Thread (includes spoilers)

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Rich said:
I get the man is trying to write a good piece of fiction, and these books are long, but it doesn't take what will now be 12 years total to write two books. 6 years in between books 4 and 5 and 5 and 6. I mean you can write at a slow, leisurely pace and still produce a quality piece of work in, you know, half the time.

It's not just screaming "write faster!!!" It's just screaming write.
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Martin's problem is that, while he's a brilliant writer, he's also lazy as fuck.
 
Jack Brickman said:
Martin's problem is that, while he's a brilliant writer, he's also lazy as fuck.
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It still amazes me he was able to churn out the first three books (and arguably his best works) within a five year span. Now here we sit, 16 years later, and we are still waiting for the 6th book to be published.

I blame it on the show becoming as successful as it is. More eyeballs interested = more pressure on Martin...not to mention he loves basking in the fame (multiple comic-con & talk show appearances, etc.). I just hope he releases TWOW before next season because at that point, i may have lost all interest in learning everyone's fate in the books when i've already experienced most of it on-screen.
 
Kbiz8288 said:
It still amazes me he was able to churn out the first three books (and arguably his best works) within a five year span. Now here we sit, 16 years later, and we are still waiting for the 6th book to be published.

I blame it on the show becoming as successful as it is. More eyeballs interested = more pressure on Martin...not to mention he loves basking in the fame (multiple comic-con & talk show appearances, etc.). I just hope he releases TWOW before next season because at that point, i may have lost all interest in learning everyone's fate in the books when i've already experienced most of it on-screen.
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I think he's just gotten lazier as he's grown more popular. Back when he wrote the first three books, he basically had to write to live comfortably. Now he's rich as fuck and he doesn't have to meet deadlines to sustain his lifestyle.

He wrote several other non-GOT books as well that were all good, by the way. I've enjoyed basically every book I've read by him. Ice and Fire is his masterpiece, but he's a really good author when he actually gets motivated enough to finish shit.
 
Jack Brickman said:
I think he's just gotten lazier as he's grown more popular. Back when he wrote the first three books, he basically had to write to live comfortably. Now he's rich as fuck and he doesn't have to meet deadlines to sustain his lifestyle.

He wrote several other non-GOT books as well that were all good, by the way. I've enjoyed basically every book I've read by him. Ice and Fire is his masterpiece, but he's a really good author when he actually gets motivated enough to finish shit.
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The fact that the show is about to ruin his epic saga for the fans he first gained through his literary excellence should be enough motivation, IMO. That's why its such a surprise to me.

I'll admit i hadn't heard of ASOIAF until the first season of GOT but i ripped through AGOT, ACOK, ASOS, AFFC after the first season aired and it was one of the best reading experiences i've ever had. It's a shame to think that those experiences will be marginalized for book fans if they choose to watch the last two seasons of the show as they air. It's even more depressing that it's next to impossible to avoid spoilers on the internet regarding plot points on the show. Quite the conundrum for book readers.
 
He's writing had slowed to a crawl long before HBO made him money. A Storm of Swords was published in 2000, and it was five years until A Feast for Crows was published. His first contact with HBO/ D&D wasn't until 2006.

Besides him not working as much as he gets older, the biggest problem was that he had to abandon his plan for the books. He was going to put a five year gap in the story to allow the characters to age, and have some other development. Worked on it for a couple of years before abandoning it as unworkable.

The underlying problem is that the stories in Westeros and Essos really don't sync up in terms of character/plot development. So, he had to invent subplots/threads that were never envisioned just to keep them in sync in terms of having enough to write about each character, and he's had a fuck of a hard time resolving them. The "Meereenese Knot" was the best known of those.

So now, he's got a bunch of plot threads that he didn't really want, and he's got to make them interesting, resolvable, and all in sync with other events.
 
Jack Brickman said:
Martin's problem is that, while he's a brilliant writer, he's also lazy as fuck.
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Martin did an interview with Stephen King and King says he writes 6 pages a day. Martin said it takes him 6 months to write 1 chapter. He also asked how King can write so many pages in 1 day. Doesn't he eat, go to the bathroom etc.
 
BooyaCS said:
Martin did an interview with Stephen King and King says he writes 6 pages a day. Martin said it takes him 6 months to write 1 chapter. He also asked how King can write so many pages in 1 day. Doesn't he eat, go to the bathroom etc.
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King is also a volume writer. That dude pumps out a book a year at minimum. Quality is less important for him than quantity. He has some good books, to be sure, but he has a lot of crap as well.
 
Jack Brickman said:
King is also a volume writer. That dude pumps out a book a year at minimum. Quality is less important for him than quantity. He has some good books, to be sure, but he has a lot of crap as well.
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True, but King is a professional writer. I am sure there are other writers that pump out books at a similar pace as well. Heck even Harry Potter JK Rowling released 7 books in 10 years.

My concern is that he is going to be like Robert Jordan with the Wheel of Time and get so involved with the story that 7 books can't finish it and then he croaks and someone else has to come in and finish the books.
 
BooyaCS said:
True, but King is a professional writer. I am sure there are other writers that pump out books at a similar pace as well. Heck even Harry Potter JK Rowling released 7 books in 10 years.

My concern is that he is going to be like Robert Jordan with the Wheel of Time and get so involved with the story that 7 books can't finish it and then he croaks and someone else has to come in and finish the books.
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Yeah, there are plenty of authors who output a high volume of work, but few of them have created a world as complex as Martin's. That's not excusing his slowness, of course. I think he's just gotten lazy as he's gotten older, and his story has gotten too convoluted even for himself to handle. That said, when you read other fantasy series, few of them even come close to having the depth that Martin's world seems to have where so much of the history feels vivid and mapped out.

As for Rowling, the Harry Potter books were much, much more simplistic than anything Martin has written. I'd use someone like Joe Abercrombie, who writes epic adult fantasy but does so at a much swifter pace. Abercrombie's work isn't quite as good as Martin's, but his best stuff is at least close. Then there's a guy like Brandon Sanderson who pumps out an absurd volume of work at a somewhat lower quality. I actually like Sanderson's work a lot (Mistborn and Stormlight Archives are both great and unique fantasy works), but there's no denying that it's nowhere near as well-written, clever, or deep as A Song of Ice and Fire.

I tend to agree with Rich's observation that Martin has kind of written himself into a corner. He stacked up so many subplots and interesting characters and scenarios that it's very difficult to work them all out in a timely and satisfying manner.
 
Jack Brickman said:
Yeah, there are plenty of authors who output a high volume of work, but few of them have created a world as complex as Martin's. That's not excusing his slowness, of course. I think he's just gotten lazy as he's gotten older, and his story has gotten too convoluted even for himself to handle. That said, when you read other fantasy series, few of them even come close to having the depth that Martin's world seems to have where so much of the history feels vivid and mapped out.

As for Rowling, the Harry Potter books were much, much more simplistic than anything Martin has written. I'd use someone like Joe Abercrombie, who writes epic adult fantasy but does so at a much swifter pace. Abercrombie's work isn't quite as good as Martin's, but his best stuff is at least close. Then there's a guy like Brandon Sanderson who pumps out an absurd volume of work at a somewhat lower quality. I actually like Sanderson's work a lot (Mistborn and Stormlight Archives are both great and unique fantasy works), but there's no denying that it's nowhere near as well-written, clever, or deep as A Song of Ice and Fire.

I tend to agree with Rich's observation that Martin has kind of written himself into a corner. He stacked up so many subplots and interesting characters and scenarios that it's very difficult to work them all out in a timely and satisfying manner.
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Not that I don't agree that there are authors that push out an absurd number of books at much lower quality. However there are a few authors that have had an unique world and quality story. I think Frank Herbert was one of them and he took 20 years to write 6 books (Dune was released in 1965 and Chapterhouse Dune was released in 1985) and the books were infinitely better than any move/series released about Dune.
 
BooyaCS said:
Not that I don't agree that there are authors that push out an absurd number of books at much lower quality. However there are a few authors that have had an unique world and quality story. I think Frank Herbert was one of them and he took 20 years to write 6 books (Dune was released in 1965 and Chapterhouse Dune was released in 1985) and the books were infinitely better than any move/series released about Dune.
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Oh, plenty of authors have had unique worlds and quality stories. I'm just saying that very few series have the depth that Martin's does. There are numerous websites and forums filled with theories and essays about Martin's world. That's unique. There aren't many other series that have that kind of devotion and fan following, let alone the depth to back up all the debates among fans.
 
Got an HBO Now trial just so I could start watching this show. So, I've been binge watching trying to get done in the 30 days. Just finished season 5. Fuck that bitch boy Ollie and the rest of the watch. Snow is dead, what do I have to live for now?
 
D-Wreck said:
Got an HBO Now trial just so I could start watching this show. So, I've been binge watching trying to get done in the 30 days. Just finished season 5. Fuck that bitch boy Ollie and the rest of the watch. Snow is dead, what do I have to live for now?
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Ok, I'm back on board.
 
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