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2023 NBA Playoffs 1st Round: Cavs vs. Knicks

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What will the series result be?

  • Total voters
    142
  • Poll closed .
godfather said:
A lot of elite teams, without their best player, aren't likely to get beyond the first round. That doesn't really speak to the team not being good. I thought those teams were really good. We had three all-stars. Some pretty good role players. Perfect team, no... Not suggesting they were one of the best teams put together.

I always wanted to see what happen in 2015, after the Shump, Moz, and JR moves, where they went like on a 34-3 run, or something absurd like that. That may have been the one great team we had, and I think the best LeBron team ever, here, by far. Injuries made it not to be unfortunately, otherwise, I'm very confident we win it all that season. We are then sitting at 2 titles, during the LeBron era, second time around, and history looks at us much better.

I thought we were pretty damn good, with some bad luck here and there. Health the first year, then Durant going to the Warriors.

And once Warriors got Kevin Durant, no team had a chance. Yeah, LeBron was/is great. It wasn't just him.
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The title team was the best, thanks to Frye, RJ, and RJ/Shump. That was a great team with basically everything you'd want on a title team. 3 big time stars and one of the best offensives ever plus enough guys who could still play D.

The injuries and Durant signing shouldn't diminish what they had and oddly the fact they came back from down 3-1 to a 73 win team and one of the most memorable game 7 in any sport that Cavs team has more of a legacy than what is suggested by one title. Even people in LA talk about that series and title still.

It is said that I think that Cavs team would have taken down last years GS team, the Bucks, and Toronto fairly easily IMO.
 
george_killer said:
This team is going nowhere with our atrocious bench. Most of those guys wouldn't be rotation players on other teams. Cedi Osman, Isaac Okoro, Ricky Rubio (still not 100%), Dean Wade (good if healthy), Robin Lopez, Raul Neto, Danny Green, Lamar Stevens. It's just awful. Thankfully, the offseason will give Altman the opportunity to improve it.

I'm honestly surprised we've made it this far with that bench, it's nothing short of a miracle.

Making it this far shows how talented our starting line-up is & that we're well coached. With an upgraded bench, we instantly become title contenders.

I'm high on Travers & Diop, they will bolster our second unit. I'd like to see us go after Jordan Clarkson. We have some pieces to offer in a S&T.

This is not a post to put the blame on Altman. He's done a great job, clearly has a plan & a vision. I can't wait to see what he does this offseason. The Mitchell trade cost us depth, but it was so worth it.
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I really don’t see how one could be “high on Travers & Diop”. To me, that belongs in the same file as thinking that a healthy Windler would be the answer. As far as going after Jordan Clarkson, virtually the entire board despised his presence when he was here (I was not one of them, by the way), but that ship has sailed . We gave the future 6th man of the year away for fucking Dante Exum and that was 4 years ago . I don’t mean to attack your post, but this seems like one of those the grass is always greener on the other side posts.
 
Wham with the Right Hand said:
Had we won Game 1 we'd be right on track; tied 2-2 and two of the remaining three at home. We lost Game 1 because JBB put in Wade and Rubio, who clearly aren't up for this. Rubio was -9 in six minutes and Wade was a disastrous -14 in seven. We lost by four points, 101-97.

After 82 games JBB should know the best rotation, in fact, he talked about reducing it to fewer players for the playoffs. In Game 2 Wade and Rubio did not play and we won by 27. I think JBB putting in Wade and Rubio cost us the first game and it may cost the series.

The reason for optimism is that despite playing on the road and Mitchell having the "second or third" worst game of his career we only lost by 9 points, and that's also with the Knicks getting 17 offensive rebounds. If Mitchell just has a normal game, nothing spectacular, say 20 points and 3 turnovers instead of 11 points and 6 turnovers we win Game 4.

There's no reason we can't win Games 5 if we go with the same lineup as Game 2. There's no reason we can't win Game 6 if Mitchell just has a normal game. Also, Garland only scored 2 points in the first half Sunday because he sat out a lot of it due to foul trouble. Then he scored 21 in the second half.

This isn't over yet. If the Cavs win Wednesday it will put a lot of pressure on the Knicks in Game 6. But Bickerstaff needs to make better decisions.
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So playing Dean for 7 minutes caused the Cavs to lose a game and possibly the series? Was Dean responsible for every turnover and missed shot on offense during that sequence? Were you expecting him to shutout the Knicks on defense? Have the Knicks not scored over any of the starters? Come on Wham. You are better than this!
 
KansasCavFan said:
So playing Dean for 7 minutes caused the Cavs to lose a game and possibly the series? Was Dean responsible for every turnover and missed shot on offense during that sequence? Were you expecting him to shutout the Knicks on defense? Have the Knicks not scored over any of the starters? Come on Wham. You are better than this!
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His minutes in game 1 were dreadful. We can admit that.

I challenge you to go back and watch them if you disagree. Wham never said he lost the Cavs the series, but he’s correct that game 1 was lost primarily in that horrible stretch in the first half where the second unit got run off the floor. Yes, Dean Wade was a big part of that, along with Rubio, as Wham said.

I think you would be wise to read the post before telling someone what they said and that they are better than that. I get that it’s likely personal for you, but nothing Wham said was inherently wrong.
 
KansasCavFan said:
So playing Dean for 7 minutes caused the Cavs to lose a game and possibly the series? Was Dean responsible for every turnover and missed shot on offense during that sequence? Were you expecting him to shutout the Knicks on defense? Have the Knicks not scored over any of the starters? Come on Wham. You are better than this!
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Wade was clearly not ready to play in this series. He was a -14 in 7 minutes. He air-balled his only shot - a wide open 3-pointer. Since Game 1 he has only played 4 minutes - garbage time at the end of Game 3 when the Cavs were down by 20 points.

I'm not blaming Wade. I'm blaming Bickerstaff. After 82 games he should have realized Wade and Rubio are not up to this. Both had significant injuries and missed a lot of time this season. After 82 games a coach should know who he can count on in the playoffs and who he can't. Bickerstaff wasn't sure, so he put in Wade and Rubio with disastrous results. It was a tactical mistake that probably cost the Cavs a win in Game 1 and that may have cost the Cavs the series.
 
george_killer said:
This team is going nowhere with our atrocious bench. Most of those guys wouldn't be rotation players on other teams. Cedi Osman, Isaac Okoro, Ricky Rubio (still not 100%), Dean Wade (good if healthy), Robin Lopez, Raul Neto, Danny Green, Lamar Stevens. It's just awful. Thankfully, the offseason will give Altman the opportunity to improve it.

I'm honestly surprised we've made it this far with that bench, it's nothing short of a miracle.

Making it this far shows how talented our starting line-up is & that we're well coached. With an upgraded bench, we instantly become title contenders.

I'm high on Travers & Diop, they will bolster our second unit. I'd like to see us go after Jordan Clarkson. We have some pieces to offer in a S&T.

This is not a post to put the blame on Altman. He's done a great job, clearly has a plan & a vision. I can't wait to see what he does this offseason. The Mitchell trade cost us depth, but it was so worth it.
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I agree about the bench but I don't know how much can be done. They don't have cap space or draft picks and LeVert is a free agent. We have no tradable draft picks of any value. Who wants to give us good players for the bench guys we have?
 
Cassity14 said:
His minutes in game 1 were dreadful. We can admit that.

I challenge you to go back and watch them if you disagree. Wham never said he lost the Cavs the series, but he’s correct that game 1 was lost primarily in that horrible stretch in the first half where the second unit got run off the floor. Yes, Dean Wade was a big part of that, along with Rubio, as Wham said.

I think you would be wise to read the post before telling someone what they said and that they are better than that. I get that it’s likely personal for you, but nothing Wham said was inherently wrong.
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LeVert's minutes in Game 1 were worse. Far worse. He's starting now.
 
Wham with the Right Hand said:
I agree about the bench but I don't know how much can be done. They don't have cap space or draft picks and LeVert is a free agent. We have no tradable draft picks of any value. Who wants to give us good players for the bench guys we have?
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They have the MLE and BAE. One of Wantabe, DiVencenzo, or Bruce Brown should be available for the MLE. Then go get a discount stretch 4 (Saric?) with the BAE. Maybe see if the Lakers want to trade Bamba (assuming they pick up his contract). Plumlee needs a new deal.

The primary issue with our bench is the absent of shooters and legitimate backup center. They can fix that.
 
Wham with the Right Hand said:
Wade was clearly not ready to play in this series. He was a -14 in 7 minutes. He air-balled his only shot - a wide open 3-pointer. Since Game 1 he has only played 4 minutes - garbage time at the end of Game 3 when the Cavs were down by 20 points.

I'm not blaming Wade. I'm blaming Bickerstaff. After 82 games he should have realized Wade and Rubio are not up to this. Both had significant injuries and missed a lot of time this season. After 82 games a coach should know who he can count on in the playoffs and who he can't. Bickerstaff wasn't sure, so he put in Wade and Rubio with disastrous results. It was a tactical mistake that probably cost the Cavs a win in Game 1 and that may have cost the Cavs the series.
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We were down by 3 at the half. So that was insurmountable......LMAO.....if being down by 3 at the end of the first half of the first game was a deal breaker we have a BAD team and coach. And if you go back and replay it that wasn't a wide open 3. If he had ball faked him and got him to runby it would have been then. Other than the one shot he was fine. It was one of the few 5 minutes periods that the Knicks have shot well in the whole series.
 
Cassity14 said:
His minutes in game 1 were dreadful. We can admit that.

I challenge you to go back and watch them if you disagree. Wham never said he lost the Cavs the series, but he’s correct that game 1 was lost primarily in that horrible stretch in the first half where the second unit got run off the floor. Yes, Dean Wade was a big part of that, along with Rubio, as Wham said.

I think you would be wise to read the post before telling someone what they said and that they are better than that. I get that it’s likely personal for you, but nothing Wham said was inherently wrong.
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I have watched several times. Have you? Hmmm
 
CavsFaninNJ said:
We also had Garland, Mobley, and Allen - and were totally relying on a massive leap from Mobley to even be a top 6, non play in team this year.

When you’re a market like Cleveland and you won’t use your picks to get a 26 year old Mitchell, under contract for years, and who is willing to play in Cleveland - what the hell are you going to use the picks for? He’s a fringe top 10 guy - you may never be able to get a top 6-7 guy under similar circumstances. Luka, KD, Giannis, Embiid, Jokic, Steph…those guys are not coming through the door. Lucky enough to get a Dame or Mitchell. I still make that deal any day of the week.
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Why did the Jazz want to trade him if he's such a must have commodity?
 
HammerGold said:
Why did the Jazz want to trade him if he's such a must have commodity?
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Why does any team trade a top 10-12 player? It happens.

We know he has limitations. In the playoffs - guys who are 6'6" plus are more consistent. Steph is the only outlier - a playoff killer in a guard's frame. You don't let the Lukas of the world go with no trade request. But you can let a Mitchell go for the right price. What more can I say?

Again - the guys that teams are not letting go with no trade request - Luka, KD, Giannis, Embiid, Jokic, Steph - good luck having them request a trade to Cleveland. The Cavs had to pick from that second tier. Dame, Mitchell, Shai, De'Aaron Fox.
 
CavsFaninNJ said:
Why does any team trade a top 10-12 player? It happens.

We know he has limitations. In the playoffs - guys who are 6'6" plus are more consistent. Steph is the only outlier - a playoff killer in a guard's frame. You don't let the Lukas of the world go with no trade request. But you can let a Mitchell go for the right price. What more can I say?

Again - the guys that teams are not letting go with no trade request - Luka, KD, Giannis, Embiid, Jokic, Steph - good luck having them request a trade to Cleveland. The Cavs had to pick from that second tier. Dame, Mitchell, Shai, De'Aaron Fox.
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Usually they demand a trade. But the Jazz decided they couldn't win a championship building around Mitchell as their best player.
 
HammerGold said:
Usually they demand a trade. But the Jazz decided they couldn't win a championship building around Mitchell as their best player.
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You basically need one of those top 6-7 guys to win a title - add Tatum to the ones I listed. So that makes sense.

Everyone agrees that for the Cavs to win a chip, Mobley needs to be at least as good as Mitchell. A lot of people think he's on a trajectory to do so.
 
HammerGold said:
Usually they demand a trade. But the Jazz decided they couldn't win a championship building around Mitchell as their best player.
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I think this had more to do with Rudy than Mitchell. Rudy could get schemed out of the playoffs, the Jazz did a terrible job giving him any defensive support on the perimeter, and now he is old. Minny walked up and basically sold their kingdom for a half eaten baguette. Wouldn't you take that and decide to blow it all up too?
 
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