Cavs Actively Shopping Everyone

[Area Code 330]

Keeping it cryptic with the "…for now." Nice.

@realcavsfans
When the Cavs are sending out "thank you" cards don't forget Robert Pera. He's taken the heat off of Dan Gilbert... for now.

 

[MirORich]

Kyrie is such a problem player. So sick of him. No way there is this much smoke around the guy and it's all bullshit.

That said, I'd much rather he stay here and get better + we start contending than trade him, unless we are getting a big haul (doubtful). Just tired of reading about how discontent this guy is. He isn't even that good. Someone called him a "great" player. Pretty sure great players play more than one end of the floor.

So for you and other posters in this thread, I understand the issue with how freely the word "great" and "superstar" get thrown around when being appllied to NBA players. It is an overused term. So is Kyrie yet a superstar like a Kobe, Jordan, LeBron, Hakeem, Shaq, Garnett, etc.?

NO. Obviously not, he's still growing and learning and has a very long journey(as do all young players) untill we truly know what we're dealing with.

Was Dirk not a great player prior to the 2011 final?
Is Melo not a great player?
How about Chris Paul?

When additions are made this offseason and when the younger guys continue to grow with Kyrie, the team will win. Once they win and compete in the playoffs over the course of a few years, we'll have a better sense on what type of player Kyrie is and if he truly is and can be great.

But the level of downgrading and minimizing Kyrie's current talent and potential future greatness is just absurd, especially when half of it is driven by the insecurity caused by hacks and rumormongers like Vecsey, Mitch Lawrence, etc. Jesus christ guys, its only going to take less than 6 weeks for Kyrie to own up to committing to the franchise long term or not. Can you at least save the vitriol until his actions dictate it? If Kyrie were on any other team in the NBA, this entire board would be SALIVATING at the opportunity to trade for him or sign him to a restricted offer sheet next season. The entire board would be talking about how Kyries team had provided him with bad coaching, too many coaches, not enough good players, no vets, etc. We'd be dying to get a player of his talent in.

 

[RedBlackAttack]

Kyrie is such a problem player. So sick of him. No way there is this much smoke around the guy and it's all bullshit.

That said, I'd much rather he stay here and get better + we start contending than trade him, unless we are getting a big haul (doubtful). Just tired of reading about how discontent this guy is. He isn't even that good. Someone called him a "great" player. Pretty sure great players play more than one end of the floor.

I consider myself a Kyrie fan and I have to agree with your sentiments here. There is a lot of smoke and, if Kyrie is making it known the Cavs "have to get better for him to stay," I will call it what it is... a sense of entitlement when he should have a sense of responsibility.

He hasn't been good enough to be the best player on a playoff caliber team yet and that's just the cold, hard truth. He needs to spend more time looking in the mirror than it seems he does. Again, I say "it seems," because of all these reports -- not just the NY media ones. Windhorst was saying this shit months ago.

He has the chance to be a really great NBA player and I don't say that lightly. However, if he spends his career blaming the situation and not working on his game, he's destined to be Deron Williams 2.0 and it won't matter where he's playing.

 

[Chris]

So for you and other posters in this thread, I understand the issue with how freely the word "great" and "superstar" get thrown around when being appllied to NBA players. It is an overused term. So is Kyrie yet a superstar like a Kobe, Jordan, LeBron, Hakeem, Shaq, Garnett, etc.?

NO. Obviously not, he's still growing and learning and has a very long journey(as do all young players) untill we truly know what we're dealing with.

Was Dirk not a great player prior to the 2011 final?
Is Melo not a great player?
How about Chris Paul?

When additions are made this offseason and when the younger guys continue to grow with Kyrie, the team will win. Once they win and compete in the playoffs over the course of a few years, we'll have a better sense on what type of player Kyrie is and if he truly is and can be great.

But the level of downgrading and minimizing Kyrie's current talent and potential future greatness is just absurd, especially when half of it is driven by the insecurity caused by hacks and rumormongers like Vecsey, Mitch Lawrence, etc. Jesus christ guys, its only going to take less than 6 weeks for Kyrie to own up to committing to the franchise long term or not. Can you at least save the vitriol until his actions dictate it? If Kyrie were on any other team in the NBA, this entire board would be SALIVATING at the opportunity to trade for him or sign him to a restricted offer sheet next season. The entire board would be talking about how Kyries team had provided him with bad coaching, too many coaches, not enough good players, no vets, etc. We'd be dying to get a player of his talent in.

Those players aren't one of the worst defenders in the league. Even if they aren't great defenders, they aren't black holes, either.

You're asking me to put my head in the sand and just disregard ALL of the negative, malcontent crap we've heard about Irving all season long and even before the season, all because...why? I'm not even advocating getting rid of him, unless you're getting a deal you can't refuse. I am just not a fan of Kyrie Irving at this point. As much as I want to be, I can't justify it. Needs to show me a lot more, on and off the court. Needs to start acting like a franchise player if that is what he thinks he is. And if he doesn't want to be here, I am not opposed to granting his wish at all. I just want something in return.

 

[Tornicade]

I actually liked watching the Mike Brown coached team at the end of the season. its odd we only saw it in spurts when kyrie was on the floor. He wants to stop the ball or walk it up every possession.. not play defense . which worked fine until Defenses got his number and adjusted.

Plus if hje was committed to making things work with Dion why did he wait until Waiters had proved himself as a starter without him (again, people have short memories). Instead Irvings post game interviews came across as mocking and surly.

I was disappointed in Irving this season. hopefully not so much next season if he is still here but he isnt as representative of the Cavs as Dion.

 

[RDriesen]

So for you and other posters in this thread, I understand the issue with how freely the word "great" and "superstar" get thrown around when being appllied to NBA players. It is an overused term. So is Kyrie yet a superstar like a Kobe, Jordan, LeBron, Hakeem, Shaq, Garnett, etc.?

NO. Obviously not, he's still growing and learning and has a very long journey(as do all young players) untill we truly know what we're dealing with.

Was Dirk not a great player prior to the 2011 final?
Is Melo not a great player?
How about Chris Paul?

When additions are made this offseason and when the younger guys continue to grow with Kyrie, the team will win. Once they win and compete in the playoffs over the course of a few years, we'll have a better sense on what type of player Kyrie is and if he truly is and can be great.

But the level of downgrading and minimizing Kyrie's current talent and potential future greatness is just absurd, especially when half of it is driven by the insecurity caused by hacks and rumormongers like Vecsey, Mitch Lawrence, etc. Jesus christ guys, its only going to take less than 6 weeks for Kyrie to own up to committing to the franchise long term or not. Can you at least save the vitriol until his actions dictate it? If Kyrie were on any other team in the NBA, this entire board would be SALIVATING at the opportunity to trade for him or sign him to a restricted offer sheet next season. The entire board would be talking about how Kyries team had provided him with bad coaching, too many coaches, not enough good players, no vets, etc. We'd be dying to get a player of his talent in.

Question for you as this is something I don't know. How many teams have won a championship where their best player was great or worse? It takes a certain type of mentality to be a superstar in the NBA, IMO, and not many players have it. That is fine if Kyrie doesn't have it. We need to bring in someone who does who can get the most out of Kyrie though. That is my only problem with him. He should be the guy getting the most out of everyone else on his team.

 

[DatDudeZ3]

Vecsey is a hack and just trying to start stuff like the rest of the NY media. He said we won the lottery because the league knew Kyrie was leaving... I find it strange Kyrie tweeted "very exciting" about winning the lottery if he was leaving. Also, at the end of the season, Kyrie posted a picture that said "Clevelan's kid", not really indications of him leaving. The only indication of him leaving is from the media which has been shot down by Kyrie countless times. As I also heard, why would the Cavs not offer Kyrie a contract? It wouldn't make them look bad if they offered and Kyrie turned it down? It would make Kyrie look bad. Makes no sense what Vecsey was saying.

The media is always trying to make life miserable for Cleveland and always trying to get the stars out of Cleveland. If twitter didn't exist, you wouldn't hear any of this bullshit.

Also, I guess the "rumor" isn't coming out today thanks to Robert Pera?

 

[MirORich]

Those players aren't one of the worst defenders in the league. Even if they aren't great defenders, they aren't black holes, either.

You're asking me to put my head in the sand and just disregard ALL of the negative, malcontent crap we've heard about Irving all season long and even before the season, all because...why?

Kyrie is not the worst defensive player in the league. He's bad. Not the worst. Two coaches in three years doesn't help. Missing the ACC schedule as a college player didn't help. He showed some minor defensive improvement this year and need a lot more work and effort, but he's definitely not the worst and has the tools to be average. The beauty of adding an Embiid potentially on our backline is that it makes all of the defenders better. Notice the defensive suckage of OKC with Ibaka out for two games? That's like us right now. Throw Embiid in there and the defensive instantly becomes simpler for all player.

Kyrie is not a black hole. Is the NBA is made up of 29 pass first point guards and then Kyrie? By what standard do you consider him a black hole. Because when I hear "Black Hole", I take it literally. There are black hole players in this league, Kyrie is not one of them.

As far as the negative malconent stuff. I agree. Where there is smoke, there is fire. But where there is unsubstantiated smoke, there is a whole cottage industry of gossip mongers posting twitter opinions based on ZERO actual sources or connections. If you allow that multiplication to make you go over the edge, that's on you. Has he handled things well? No. Is it time to give up on him or jettison him now because of that. Also no.

As far as asking you to bury your head in the sand, not at all. have your opinion. I just think it's funny people can't handle waiting 6-7 weeks to when the contract can be offered and then accepted/rejected before going all in on Kyrie like we should just toss him to the side and replace him.

 

[MirORich]

Question for you as this is something I don't know. How many teams have won a championship where their best players was great or worse? It takes a certain type of mentality to be a superstar in the NBA, IMO, and not many players have it. That is fine if Kyrie doesn't have it. We need to bring in someone who does who can get the most out of Kyrie though. That is my only problem with him. He should be the guy getting the most out of everyone else on his team.

Does Cleveland have the luxury to kick Kyrie to the curb and just bring in the long line of true superstar players that are waiting to come aboard?

Whether I think Kyrie is or can be a true #1 leader and #1 option on a Championship doesn't matter. In assembling a championship level team, you need multiple talents. When in Cleveland you have to draft, trade for, develop and keep those talents. We have one of those talents in Kyrie(warts and all) We need to keep him, continue to develop him, surround him with better talent, and work towards a championship. We can not afford to just let him go unless we're kicking back the clock 2-3 years.

 

[KI4MVP]

Kyrie is such a problem player. So sick of him. No way there is this much smoke around the guy and it's all bullshit.

That said, I'd much rather he stay here and get better + we start contending than trade him, unless we are getting a big haul (doubtful). Just tired of reading about how discontent this guy is. He isn't even that good. Someone called him a "great" player. Pretty sure great players play more than one end of the floor.

you mean you're tired of the (NY) media portraying him as discontent? I've never heard a single quote directly attributed to him.

 

[gratefuldead]

So I guess this rumor never surfaced unless it's the Kyrie is leaving stuff

 

[AMC]

So I guess this rumor never surfaced unless it's the Kyrie is leaving stuff

It's not even 7:00PM on a holiday, we still have time. Don't insult Ben by saying his nugget of info is from the NYDN.

 

[Chris]

Kyrie is not the worst defensive player in the league. He's bad. Not the worst. Two coaches in three years doesn't help. Missing the ACC schedule as a college player didn't help. He showed some minor defensive improvement this year and need a lot more work and effort, but he's definitely not the worst and has the tools to be average. The beauty of adding an Embiid potentially on our backline is that it makes all of the defenders better. Notice the defensive suckage of OKC with Ibaka out for two games? That's like us right now. Throw Embiid in there and the defensive instantly becomes simpler for all player.

Kyrie is not a black hole. Is the NBA is made up of 29 pass first point guards and then Kyrie? By what standard do you consider him a black hole. Because when I hear "Black Hole", I take it literally. There are black hole players in this league, Kyrie is not one of them.

As far as the negative malconent stuff. I agree. Where there is smoke, there is fire. But where there is unsubstantiated smoke, there is a whole cottage industry of gossip mongers posting twitter opinions based on ZERO actual sources or connections. If you allow that multiplication to make you go over the edge, that's on you. Has he handled things well? No. Is it time to give up on him or jettison him now because of that. Also no.

As far as asking you to bury your head in the sand, not at all. have your opinion. I just think it's funny people can't handle waiting 6-7 weeks to when the contract can be offered and then accepted/rejected before going all in on Kyrie like we should just toss him to the side and replace him.

Um, I said one of the worst, and yes, he is one of the worst. At least at his position.

If you call this me "going over the edge" I just don't know what to say. I'm basically saying I don't give a crap if Kyrie stays or goes, unless we lose him for nothing. I am not attached to Kyrie Irving, at all. He has taken the Cavs nowhere and right now we are just banking on his potential to get way better. This reminds me of the whole LeBron thing. People denied he was leaving right up to The Decision even though there was more smoke to it than Carmelo Anthony's living room. Myself included. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice...

I try not to get attached to these priamdonna star players anymore. Just not worth it. At this point the Cavs may not even view him as a max player. If that is fact, a lot of the smoke about his drugs, partying, locker room cancer, etc concerns must be valid. If the Cavs offer him a max though and he signs...you won't hear me complaining about it.

you mean you're tired of the (NY) media portraying him as discontent? I've never heard a single quote directly attributed to him.

If you're just going to pretend that Windhorst and others haven't said there is a lot of smoke about Irving/his family wanting out the past 2 years, I don't know what to tell you.

Who knows if this is just his family, or if it's him, too. I don't really care. Until Irving commits to the Cavs long term, and proves the rumors wrong, I'm not going to just pretend the talk isn't out there.

 

[Willard513]

I don't think kyrie is leaving, but if he does, I could see us drafting Jabari Parker, he seems to be someone to build around if embiids back isn't 100%. Also he fits that mold of small market star with his Mormon background. But I also assume we are gonna have to get 80 cents on the dollar for kyrie so we could get another great player, but I am almost 100% sure we are keeping kyrie.

 

[RedBlackAttack]

Until Irving commits to the Cavs long term, and proves the rumors wrong, I'm not going to just pretend the talk isn't out there.

To remain fair to Kyrie, he hasn't had the opportunity yet to commit to the Cavs longterm and there is a lot of uncertainty with the franchise right now. I mean, he doesn't even know who the head coach is going to be. I don't exactly blame him for not coming out and saying, "I'm definitely staying here longterm" with so much up in the air.

I'm not going to beat him up too badly. I thought the critiques from this past season became a little too harsh for a 21-year-old still finding his way. And, there were positive signs, like his major cutting down of unforced turnovers, better work off the ball, better effort defensively (which shows in the advanced stats too, btw), and his playing 70+ games. It wasn't a total loss of a season for him like some portray.

It's fair to be critical of Irving in some areas, but let's not go totally overboard. He's still one of the best talents in the NBA under 25. And, that's not something you want to give up on so soon.