Cedi Osman Goodbye & Good Luck

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

It's just defense. The Cavs could not defend Golden State and they would just score too easily.

Our offense tanked in the playoffs this year. It was bad.

 

[priceFTW]

It was great because we had Lebron and Kyrie; that however does not mean that we couldn't have produced a better offense if Lebron was used more as a cutter and a roll man...because Lebron is better at both than he is at Isolation.

The fact is that Lebron is elite at every single playtype, especially when he is surrounded by such prolific shooters, so we would have produced elite offense regardless of what we ran...it's just that we needed more than that against a team like the Warriors. Playing Iso from the perimeter against them is exactly what they wanted us to do...without Irving at least.

Yes, he is. But the crux of the issue is this: Would playing the way you suggest IMPROVE an already all time offense (even showed glimpses this year with the second best playoff offense ever in a series against the Raps) ENOUGH to beat GS? Statistically, its highly, highly unlikely that we could improve the already really high ceiling offense enough to then topple GS, a team that has a great offense, TWO generational talents, AND a great defense. I think we have a decent shot against anyone else (underdogs against Houston from this year, too).

I agree that less LeBron ISO and more of him as a roll man and off of cuts would lead to an even better offense, but having watched Bron so long, there’s a rhyme and reason to some of his ISO ball. I think playing that helps him set up the chess pieces to create open three point opportunities. One possession gets the defense doing X and then another possession gives the defense another look from the same set. He’s a savant and the end total seems to be more then the sum of its parts.

It’s also unrealistic to have a heavy amount of the offense be based off of Bron cuts or as the roll man as the defense will adjust and I’m not sure I trust whoever has the ball to make the right reads. The Cavs were 9th in frequency of cuts at 7.4% of all plays last year, so they did cut.

1. Warriors, 12.3%
2. Sixers, 9.1% (massive difference between 1st and 2nd)
9. Cavs, 7.4% (657 cuts made and man passed to)
23. Spurs, 6.3% (549 cuts made)
26. Celtics, 6.0% (521 cuts made)

LeBron not as much, but if you have an offense based on Bron cutting to the basket...teams will adjust. Look at the PPP on cuts for everyone. It’s really high, but that's because teams don’t expect them out of most teams’ normal sets. I don’t think it’s possible to create the offense with that. It’s more feasible to to have more Bron as a roll guy, but that, too, would be more limited offense and rely heavily on the ball handler. Who, do you trust on this team to make the right reads if teams choose to blitz the PG like the Heat used to Do?

The thing is, a Bron ISO COULD turn into an open three for someone IF the actions work out that way. Now, people might argue: Why not incorporste both and make them the offense?Maybe they have a point. But to create those offenses that the Cavs did, to me, given the pieces they had and the ages they had, it had to be a constant dose of LeBron Ball. It’s hard to imagine a case in which it’s diluted LeBron Ball mixed with a another system of someone else handling the ball and creating the offense. It could work if we had the right guy. Watch those 2016 to 2017 playoffs games (and against Toronto this year); everyone runs the plays and actions to get to their spots off of LeBron’s actions and it’s based on timing and repetition and frankly, LeBron’s genius. People think that you can just have LeBron break down defenses and find those players. Sometimes that’s true, but take a look at the screens TT set for Kyrie and Love, and how Kyrie would screen for LeBron and LeBron for Kyrie. That 1/4 pick and role was so good with the three around them setting picks and moving to spots where they’re hit with a perfect pass and able to shoot. The rhythm and timing in 2016/2017...don’t know if we get there without the possessions in Bron’s hands.

Even this year, the offense was great with Love at the 5 and without DRose and his ilk playing. 600+minutes, 122.2 ORtg. Warriors had 1,000+ minutes with Curry/KD/Klay at 123.3. It’s very, very, very difficult to make an objective case that the offense would be that much better playing Bron more off the ball.

 

[Cavatt]

Pretty sure the offense off the bench last year would have been better in Cedi's hands than Clarkson's

 

[CSF]

Pretty sure the offense off the bench last year would have been better in Cedi's hands than Clarkson's

Lue had full intentions of playing Cedi in that role until Altman yet again dabbled in the art of trading. I got the vibe from several people I talked with that Lue was basically forced to play all the new guys.

 

[Sebastian]

Lue had full intentions of playing Cedi in that role until Altman yet again dabbled in the art of trading. I got the vibe from several people I talked with that Lue was basically forced to play all the new guys.

Oh?

Pray tell.

 

[Sir'Dom Pointer]

Lue had full intentions of playing Cedi in that role until Altman yet again dabbled in the art of trading. I got the vibe from several people I talked with that Lue was basically forced to play all the new guys.

Oh, your insiders CTown? We all believe you.

This is so bullshit lol..gtfo. Altman is perhaps Cedis biggest fan.

 

[Pjlea28]

Lue had full intentions of playing Cedi in that role until Altman yet again dabbled in the art of trading. I got the vibe from several people I talked with that Lue was basically forced to play all the new guys.

Your still here?

 

[AussieCavFan]

Lue had full intentions of playing Cedi in that role until Altman yet again dabbled in the art of trading. I got the vibe from several people I talked with that Lue was basically forced to play all the new guys.

That must be why Hood saw all that playing time in the playoffs!

 

[Mavaliersfan]

Our offense tanked in the playoffs this year. It was bad.

It all came down to the defensive end IMO.

I re-watched a few of the LBJ Heat games they were airing on NBA TV and the main thing that stood out to me was how versatile they were defensively. That team played hard every damn possession. Then you had very high IQ defenders at every position.

Wade was always all over the place, contesting everything and playing the passing lanes. Battier & Haslem would always check the other team's best forward so Bron could basically roam, rebound, or run out on the break. Bosh's length and mobility was extremely effective guarding against the PNR. I couldn't count how many times he would get deflections that would allow Wade, Chalmers, Bron to get out on the break. That team got a lot of open high percentage shots as well, so they were able to get back and get their defense set.

Offensively, what stood out was all of the screen action that took place away from the ball. Sure Bron would go ISO but at the same time guys were always looking to screen to free guys up, whether it was coming off the PNR, in the corner, or off the back-door. There was just a lot of movement along with the ISO.

To top it off, LeBron did not seem near as refined offensively as he is now, and they were still damn good. Our issues were always the fact we had too many one-damn dimensional players (one dimensional as in they only excelled at one end of the ball), including LeBron's ass.

 

[Cavatt]

How many minutes does Cedi get this year? Did Lue see him play overseas at all? Still rubs me the wrong way seeing this kid tear it up and thinking about how he couldn't get any minutes ahead of the 2 worst playoff performers of all time in Hood and Clarkson.

 

[Mavaliersfan]

How many minutes does Cedi get this year? Did Lue see him play overseas at all? Still rubs me the wrong way seeing this kid tear it up and thinking about how he couldn't get any minutes ahead of the 2 worst playoff performers of all time in Hood and Clarkson.

He should've gotten Tatum and Brown level minutes. Same with Zizic. Seeing how a scrub like Daniel Theiss got major minutes for Boston, let's me know they would've had big plan for Ante had he stayed. Why couldn't they have been groomed all year to be our starters?

We could've had Cedi & Bron as ball Handlers - playmakers.
Zizic could've been our starting 2-way center to free up Love.
Then Rodney could've played off of Cedi and Bron's penetration.

Our finals starting lineup should've been!

Cedi
Hood
LBJ
Love
Zizic

Defensively, Cedi on Durant and LBJ on Curry.

 

[TitleTown]

How many minutes does Cedi get this year? Did Lue see him play overseas at all? Still rubs me the wrong way seeing this kid tear it up and thinking about how he couldn't get any minutes ahead of the 2 worst playoff performers of all time in Hood and Clarkson.

Based on the Cavs marketing and advertising for the next season, it seems like Cedi will be thought of as our #2 option after Love.

I've seen him as the main "face" on numerous things now, and I'm hoping that means that Altman has had discussions with Lue about this as well. Cedi is the best SF we have on this team, and it's time to let him sink or swim with starters minutes.

 

[Cavatt]

Based on the Cavs marketing and advertising for the next season, it seems like Cedi will be thought of as our #2 option after Love.

I've seem him as the main "face" on numerous things now, and I'm hoping that means that Altman has had discussions with Lue about this as well. Cedi is the best SF we have on this team, and it's time to let him sink or swim with starters minutes.

Young Bull is going to get hyped as well.

 

[TitleTown]

Young Bull is going to get hyped as well.

If you go to Cavs.com right now, you'll see Kevin Love and then Cedi. And then if you scroll down you see a post with TT, followed by a Sexton post.

This has been consistent with many of the things the Cavs have put out this summer.

 

[CSF]

Oh?

Pray tell.

Just some guys at work who know other guys who know other guys and a gal or 2