Let's talk defense!

[Tornicade]

Well, Brooklyn pretty much proves it.

And? Your correction only bolsters my point
96.8 pace - 93.3 =3.5

What does GS playing at 100 pace Change about that. Cavs play more iso

 

[Jstock12]

And? Your correction only bolsters my point
96.8 pace - 93.3 =3.5

What does GS playing at 100 pace Change about that. Cavs play more iso

I don't know what you're talking about. I was agreeing with your point that high pace doesn't necessarily correlate to winning.

 

[bboy]

Folks...it's not about effort, and you can't turn it on like a faucet. You can tell when weak defense is just due to poor effort because teams will turn on the effort to get key fourth quarter stops to preserve a lead. Do you have any confidence in this team to get key fourth quarter stops? Do you really believe that they didn't care if Boston beat them the other day at Boston? Do you think they didn't care if Atlanta came back from 23 points down to win? Do you think the 29 points Boston hung on us in the 4th to win that game were because the Cavaliers weren't trying? Do you think the 42 points Atlanta hung on us in the 4th to make it a one point game with two minutes to go were because the Cavs weren't trying?

Our D blows and it will continue to blow in the playoffs. Bogut will help but Kyrie can't stop anyone causing a cluster you know what of switching to cover up his inability to defend. Going under picks is an effort thing per example Shump giving Thomas a wide open look in Boston. We might have to put up 120 a night to get wins...I want to see how we defend Houston...they may score 150 on us

 

[Adam]

Looking down the roster it's clear offense is the priority and so I'll wait until the playoffs to see how much defensive game planning and effort can make a difference. But I think they don't really have the personnel to be a top defense this year

 

[Tornicade]

I don't know what you're talking about. I was agreeing with your point that high pace doesn't necessarily correlate to winning.

Bwig says he would like to see how many more possessions the caves have this season.
I responded to the difference between last season and this season.

You then corrected me on the actual number for this season but didn't cite the number for last season but decided to include golden state pace rating for this season.

I then responded that the differential increase was essentially the same.

so the topic for that line of post is .... does the increased pace impact the defensive rating difference between last season or this season. not if having a high pace in general impacts anything

so are you thinking that because GS has a 100 pace and have a top 5 defensive efficiency the Cavs shouldn't be impacted by an increase pace which is still lower than Golden states?
Your correction post omitted the comparison of increased pace from last season to this season and then included overall rankings specifically for this season.

because to that I reply the difference pace wise between the two teams is that the Cavs run more isolation than golden state even though they are running less iso than last season.

 

[BimboColesHair]

I'm curious about @BimboColesHair's opinion on the defensive coaching problem after tonight's game. At some point there has to be accountability... you don't play LeBron for almost 40 minutes in games like tonight if you're just experimenting.

So I'm now watching the game...things I noticed...

1. LeBron may be playing 38 minutes a night, but if you really watch him, they are a very easy 38 minutes. Guy is putting in 0 effort in on the defensive end, save for a few situational moments. But they stuck him on Thabo most of the night and he just floated out there on that end all night last night.

2. We are an awful, awful defensive rebounding team without Kevin right now. An underrated part of being a good defensive team is defensive rebounding and limiting the opposing team to just 1 shot. I can count multiple possessions within just the first 6+ minutes of the game alone where multiple Hawks get inside position on us for offensive rebounds.

3. Too often we have no "last line of defense". For some reason, on multiple occasions, a big stuck on Dwight Howard around the elbows above the foul line, and Hardaway, Thabo, and Schroeder just walked to the rim for a layup with no big there to protect the rim. Teams have no business sticking with Dwight that far away from the basket. This is that whole "not knowing personnel" thing that I talk about, which isn't a problem in the playoffs.

4. Taking a lot of 3s and being lazy getting back in transition is a terrible, terrible combination. Long boards are ready made breaks for the other team, and we give opposing teams like 5 of those a night.

5. We are really small. Bogut should help with that, as should JR and Kevin when they return.

6. About halfway through the 3rd, you could see the team ease up. They eased up, dicked around, and blew the lead. This is a common occurrence over the last 3 regular seasons that just doesn't really happen during the playoffs...this team in the regular season just doesn't look to expend the energy to step on the other teams throat and not let them back up, but they've shown that they can do it rather easily in the playoffs.

7. We got lazy, reached and swiped, and sent them to the line 30 times.

A lot of the problems right now are regular season problems, IMO. Lack of consistent effort and attention to detail on both ends of the floor for a full 48 minutes, not knowing your personnel, our best all-around defensive player hiding on the opposing teams worst player and putting in 0 effort on that end, and just a generic, vanilla game plan to stop the opposing team.

The problems that aren't regular season problems; lack of rebounding, lack of an interior presence, poor perimeter defense...those are personnel problems for us, that are mostly there because our best rebounder is currently hurt, our best interior presence was just signed and hasn't played yet, and the guy who evolved into arguably our best perimeter defender last season has played less than half of the season to this point.

I think our defense is going to be fine come playoff time, barring health...the simplified defense just works for us, and even more so when we heavily game plan and tune in on just one team, and expend the energy needed over 48 full minutes, which you can't do in the regular season.

 

[dark2332]

Looking down the roster it's clear offense is the priority and so I'll wait until the playoffs to see how much defensive game planning and effort can make a difference. But I think they don't really have the personnel to be a top defense this year

I guess I don't see that.

Sure, there hasn't been that focus so far this season save a few moments, but I think we do have the personnel.

When committed, LeBron James is one of the best and most versatile defenders in the league. Playoff LeBron is DPOY caliber.

Andrew Bogut is still one of the elite rim protectors in the NBA, which we will find out shortly, even in limited minutes.

Tristan Thompson is very versatile defensively and a difference maker on that end of the floor due to his ability to switch and guard perimeter players when forced to. At the basket, opponents shoot 10.7% worse against Tristan than on average, and 7.1% worse out to ten feet. So, he gets it done on that end. It's more the team focus that has hurt him thus far this season.

JR Smith has been our best wing defender in his Cavaliers tenure and he will be a big get when he's back healthy.

Richard Jefferson has shown to still be a good defender of 3's and 4's, which we will see again in the playoffs this year.

Derrick Williams has been a pleasant surprise on that end so far, and I see no reason to think he can't continue to be a matchup factor when teams go small. Frankly, if he stays playing the way he has, the dude is a weapon.

As much as I hate him, Iman Shumpert is still a good on-ball defender when given a set role come postseason time.

Deandre Liggins is probably truly our best perimeter defender, and even he can be used in a situational role in limited action.

Love, having his best season on that end, actually makes a difference and he and Korver are both pretty solid team defenders.

Hell, even Kyrie is a different defender in the playoffs.

So, I guess I have trouble seeing that we don't have the personnel for it. The only putrid defenders on our team are Channing Frye and James Jones.

If our team gets healthy and focused eventually, I see no reason we couldn't be a better defensive team.

 

[Adam]

I guess I don't see that.

Sure, there hasn't been that focus so far this season save a few moments, but I think we do have the personnel.

When committed, LeBron James is one of the best and most versatile defenders in the league. Playoff LeBron is DPOY caliber.

Andrew Bogut is still one of the elite rim protectors in the NBA, which we will find out shortly, even in limited minutes.

Tristan Thompson is very versatile defensively and a difference maker on that end of the floor due to his ability to switch and guard perimeter players when forced to. At the basket, opponents shoot 10.7% worse against Tristan than on average, and 7.1% worse out to ten feet. So, he gets it done on that end. It's more the team focus that has hurt him thus far this season.

JR Smith has been our best wing defender in his Cavaliers tenure and he will be a big get when he's back healthy.

Richard Jefferson has shown to still be a good defender of 3's and 4's, which we will see again in the playoffs this year.

Derrick Williams has been a pleasant surprise on that end so far, and I see no reason to think he can't continue to be a matchup factor when teams go small. Frankly, if he stays playing the way he has, the dude is a weapon.

As much as I hate him, Iman Shumpert is still a good on-ball defender when given a set role come postseason time.

Deandre Liggins is probably truly our best perimeter defender, and even he can be used in a situational role in limited action.

Love, having his best season on that end, actually makes a difference and he and Korver are both pretty solid team defenders.

Hell, even Kyrie is a different defender in the playoffs.

So, I guess I have trouble seeing that we don't have the personnel for it. The only putrid defenders on our team are Channing Frye and James Jones.

If our team gets healthy and focused eventually, I see no reason we couldn't be a better defensive team.

I didn't say we wouldn't be better I just said we wouldn't be top everyone improves defensively in the playoffs

 

[dark2332]

I didn't say we wouldn't be better I just said we wouldn't be top everyone improves defensively in the playoffs

I apologize then if I misunderstood.

I thought you were comparing the roster to last year, when our playoff defense was good enough to win a championship.

And from a personnel standpoint versus last year, we have mostly the same players, plus a few who have even upgraded us defensively.

 

[Adam]

I apologize then if I misunderstood.

I thought you were comparing the roster to last year, when our playoff defense was good enough to win a championship.

And from a personnel standpoint versus last year, we have mostly the same players, plus a few who have even upgraded us defensively.

we aint got no delly though

I am drunk right now so i appologise, but i miss the aussie wolverine

 

[JMoneyYourHoney]

3. Too often we have no "last line of defense". For some reason, on multiple occasions, a big stuck on Dwight Howard around the elbows above the foul line, and Hardaway, Thabo, and Schroeder just walked to the rim for a layup with no big there to protect the rim. Teams have no business sticking with Dwight that far away from the basket. This is that whole "not knowing personnel" thing that I talk about, which isn't a problem in the playoffs.

This has been my gripe about TT acting as a starting 5. It's a joke, frankly. I'm fine with it against the Warriors, where's he such a precious luxury, but this guy is just not cut out to be a starting center.

I really don't see the downside in starting Bogut but pulling him quickly. Use him to establish a defense tone and prevent guard penetration, then bring in TT to feast on backups. Worked like a gem when we had Mozgov...

 

[BimboColesHair]

This has been my gripe about TT acting as a starting 5. It's a joke, frankly. I'm fine with it against the Warriors, where's he such a precious luxury, but this guy is just not cut out to be a starting center.

I really don't see the downside in starting Bogut but pulling him quickly. Use him to establish a defense tone and prevent guard penetration, then bring in TT to feast on backups. Worked like a gem when we had Mozgov...

He's more than cut out for it...for the playoffs...there's a reason his block numbers are much better in the playoffs than the regular season, and a reason he is just a much better defensive player in the playoffs in general. Most of which has to do with scheme, attention to detail, and knowing personnel better than you do in the regular season.

Guarantee in a playoff series, if we saw the Hawks, Tristan would be planted under the paint whenever Dwight is out towards the perimeter and would be there to contest those layups he didn't last night.

Has nothing to do with Tristan's ability to defend as a 5, or supposed lack thereof...everything to do with not preparing as much as you should for opponents in the regular season just because you don't have the time to properly prepare for all 82 games.

 

[ChicagoCavFan]

The level of confidence around here is nice to see but getting a little crazy...you don't think we need to play elite basketball in May, AKA the Eastern Conference Finals and Semifinals?

You do realize the other playoff teams in the Eastern Conference are actual high-level NBA teams and are not actually required by league rules to let us win, right?

Meant March / April....thats why I said 1st or 2nd round. We don't need to be elite in the 1st round IMO. Thought that might be obvious...

 

[PIP]

Not as tenacious as I had hoped

 

[roozy]

Frye is really bad, that's all I'm gonna add for now.