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Potential 2019 Head coaches for the Browns

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selby56 said:
Mike McCarthy stats:

- 125-77-2 regular season (.618 win percentage)
- 10-8 playoffs
- 4 NFC Championship game appearances
- 1 Super Bowl
- 3 losing seasons

Sean Payton stats:

- 115-73 regular season (.612 win percentage)
- 7-5 playoffs
- 2 NFC Championship game apperances
- 1 Super Bowl
- 4 losing seasons

Stats don't always tell the whole story, but I find it shocking the amount of hate McCarthy is getting. Both of these coaches began with their respective teams in 2006 and have been paired with an all-time great QB their entire tenure. I have to wonder if people would've trashed Sean Payton as an option in 2016 after he went 7-9 for the third straight year.
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also Your numbers for Payton are off

He’s 122-82 (59.8% win) with 5 losing seasons (all 7-9)

Also over that span

Packers 25.99 PPG, 21.7 points allowed per game

Saints 28.02 PPG, 23.5 points allowed per game

That 2 PPG May not seem like much, but it really makes a difference
 
View: https://twitter.com/sdoerschukREP/status/1069675025039613953


giphy.webp
 
The Wizard of Moz said:
So this is an interesting statistical comparison, but would anyone say that McCarthy is in the same league as an offensive mind as Payton?

And I’m pretty sure there were posters on here talking about trading assets to get Sean Payton during that time. Like almost certain there was.

Sometimes the ol’ eye test matters.
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I think you have to give Payton the nod in terms of offense. His offense hasn't ranked outside of the top 10 in terms of yards since he took over as HC. McCarthy's Packers haven't been bad either though, ranking outside the top 10 only three times, one of those times being last year with Rodgers only playing half the season. McCarthy tends to have a better defense, but who knows how much of that is credited to him or his DC.

My point is more that people keep saying McCarthy underachieved with an all-time QB. Statistically, he is on par with Sean Payton and actually has more deep playoff runs than Payton. I don't see any people saying Payton is underachieving with Brees.
 
What are your guys thoughts on eric bieniemy? Too early for him?
 
The Wizard of Moz said:
So this is an interesting statistical comparison, but would anyone say that McCarthy is in the same league as an offensive mind as Payton?

And I’m pretty sure there were posters on here talking about trading assets to get Sean Payton during that time. Like almost certain there was.

Sometimes the ol’ eye test matters.
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Eye test matters I guess but Wins and Losses mean more. End of the day, the Packers have won a lot of games with McCarthy as a coach.
 
The Wizard of Moz said:
So this is an interesting statistical comparison, but would anyone say that McCarthy is in the same league as an offensive mind as Payton?

And I’m pretty sure there were posters on here talking about trading assets to get Sean Payton during that time. Like almost certain there was.

Sometimes the ol’ eye test matters.
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Yeah, the problem here is that no one is arguing that McCarthy has never been a good coach. The argument is that the game may have passed him by. And if the game has passed him by, bringing him in here would be nothing short of a disaster.

Now, I will say that McCarthy did add a bit to his offense as the season wore on this year, borrowing concepts from teams like the Rams. Felt like too little, too late by the time he did it, but at least we saw some movement toward a modern offense. That's somewhat encouraging, and if we do hire him my hope is that the relationship between him and Rodgers just deteriorated to the point where both guys just couldn't work together, because at least that's a better scenario than McCarthy just being a shitty coach.

But hey, if anyone has ever gone on a long vacation with a friend, or in a long relationship, you know that eventually even people you like will start to get under your skin a bit. Hopefully that's what happened in Green Bay, because like most here I anticipate McCarthy being our next head coach and I might as well start trying to look for the bright side. :chuckle:
 
Phills14 said:
Eye test matters I guess but Wins and Losses mean more. End of the day, the Packers have won a lot of games with McCarthy as a coach.
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So this is obviously the most extreme example there is, but without the eye test people would say Ty Lue was a good coach. Rodgers doesn’t have a James-like impact on the game, but he spent quite a few seasons being a top 3 QB (probably top 1 honestly).

The challenge is to separate how much of the success was Rodgers willing the team and how much was schematic

At the end of the day though, I’m choosing to trust Buddy Boy on this one. If he goes with McCarthy he obviously shares the same vision as where this team can go and how. And I trust Dorsey
 
The Wizard of Moz said:
So this is obviously the most extreme example there is, but without the eye test people would say Ty Lue was a good coach. Rodgers doesn’t have a James-like impact on the game, but he spent quite a few seasons being a top 3 QB (probably top 1 honestly).

The challenge is to separate how much of the success was Rodgers willing the team and how much was schematic

At the end of the day though, I’m choosing to trust Buddy Boy on this one. If he goes with McCarthy he obviously shares the same vision as where this team can go and how. And I trust Dorsey
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My point is, you can talk about offenses, management style, coaching decisions, challenges and whatever else but the bottom line for a head coach does he win or not. McCarthy, whatever his faults are, wins a helluva lot more games than he loses. So if we are talking basic things like eye test, I'm going to put a ton more weight on Win/Loss than the eye test
 
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