So long, David Griffin

[Meatwad]

-1.4 VORP

That is the absolute worst VORP in the NBA, by the way.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pi/shareit/yhpmj

 

[Rich]

54 gp
26.1 mpg
7.6/4.7/1.9
36.4% 3PT (career low)
1.2 WinShare
-1.4 VORP

..on a mediocre Milwaukee team..

Talk about GAG!

Meanwhile Iman Shumpert catcing DNP-CDs in the playoffs, even when an opposing wing is going off.

But yea, David Griffin has been spot on!

 

[Cavsfan1985]

Meanwhile Iman Shumpert catcing DNP-CDs in the playoffs, even when an opposing wing is going off.

But yea, David Griffin has been spot on!

Well to be fair, it was one game. We will see what the plan is tonight. I was pretty happy with the rotations in the first half, but Lou got a little crazy in the second half.

 

[2 For The Brew]

Out of 486 players, the player with the worst VORP this season was ... Delly at -1.4.

54 gp
26.1 mpg
7.6/4.7/1.9
36.4% 3PT (career low)
1.2 WinShare
-1.4 VORP

..on a mediocre Milwaukee team..

Talk about GAG!

In fact Delly had the worst VORP in the NBA. No other player had a VORP worse than -1.2 in the past two seasons.

I don't know if VORP means anything, but in the bottom 22 players in the NBA (out of 492) in 2014-15 are these illustrious names:

471 Henry Sims -.5
473 Derrick Williams -.5
474 Anthony Bennett -.6
475 Carlos Boozer -.6
477 Kendrick Perkins -.6
478 Ramon Sessions -.6
490 Dion Waiters -.9

I think whoever designed VORP hates scrappy white guys from Australia with last names Charley Barkley can't pronounce, current or ex-deadwood on the Cavaliers and ex-Dukies who double-crossed a blind man. If Delly ranks last in an advanced metric, something's off.

 

[Randolphkeys]

54 gp
26.1 mpg
7.6/4.7/1.9
36.4% 3PT (career low)
1.2 WinShare
-1.4 VORP

..on a mediocre Milwaukee team..

Talk about GAG!

Stats conversation for the guy who has always contributed outside of stats.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Birdman was a ball washer little more. Bernie from the Weekend At offered more. It's not hindsight, it was something I wrote in my columns from the beginning of the season. Like maybe give some people credit instead of assuming they were late to their complaints.

Finally, regarding the $3M tags. We used part of the mini-mid to sign RJ to extension and part of it went.... to Mo Williams. GAG!

I think Nene/Dedmon was the MUCH smarter way to spend that money. And Speights would be better than the wet fart that Birdman provided us.

And there were a LOT of vet min PGs who could've outperformed a combo of MO Williams Nada and J-Mac's less than nothing.

Lot of issues before season began, and things he fixed during season were problems he created so not sure how much credit to apportion. Then again, Mozgov/Shump/Smith was like Slocumb for Varitek & Derrick Lowe, so I understand the love.

Mo didn't get any of the Mini-MLE this year. He initially signed a two-year deal with a player option--and that player option which he exercised and refused to retire was what screwed us.

Birdman had way more on the court than most of us expected. He could move, and was agile. He looked like a fine fifth big, and was way more than Perkins, Haywood, or your references.

http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/video/teams/cavaliers/2016/10/30/1477786500486-bird-898775

Credit...

If you guys want to argue over who we should have signed for the vet minimum to get no guaranteed minutes, then feel free to go back there and debate it--but get your facts straight. If Bogut stays healthy, we're not even having this conversation.

 

[Chris Parker]

Mo didn't get any of the Mini-MLE this year. He initially signed a two-year deal with a player option--and that player option which he exercised and refused to retire was what screwed us.

Birdman had way more on the court than most of us expected. He could move, and was agile. He looked like a fine fifth big, and was way more than Perkins, Haywood, or your references.

http://www.nba.com/cavaliers/video/teams/cavaliers/2016/10/30/1477786500486-bird-898775

Credit...

If you guys want to argue over who we should have signed for the vet minimum to get no guaranteed minutes, then feel free to go back there and debate it--but get your facts straight. If Bogut stays healthy, we're not even having this conversation.

Birdman sucked. I'm not looking at some photo of the one time he dunked. how big of a whatever do you need from me. Show me some stats that suggest he wasn't a complete and total zero.

And then explain to me how this team didn't need another big all season while TT is developing tendinitis.

Bogut, guy who's injured most of the season for Dallas suddenly gets injured. Wow, who could've possibly expected that? complete shock. Maybe if he didn't wait to the last moment to address the situation, figuring Channing Frye was fine.... but whatever. you see it different. I see Birdman as borderline malpractice and unlikely to make it through the season. 38 year old big. Geez. Bring back Zadrunas...

 

[InBoobieWeTrust]

Birdman sucked. I'm not looking at some photo of the one time he dunked. how big of a whatever do you need from me. Show me some stats that suggest he wasn't a complete and total zero.

And then explain to me how this team didn't need another big all season while TT is developing tendinitis.

Bogut, guy who's injured most of the season for Dallas suddenly gets injured. Wow, who could've possibly expected that? complete shock. Maybe if he didn't wait to the last moment to address the situation, figuring Channing Frye was fine.... but whatever. you see it different. I see Birdman as borderline malpractice and unlikely to make it through the season. 38 year old big. Geez. Bring back Zadrunas...

To be fair, Bogut snapping his leg was not just "an old injury prone guy getting injured". That was a legitimate bad luck, freak injury from an NBA athlete going full speed directly into his lower leg at an angle and getting all bone.

I think we probably could have done better than Birdman, but I'm not sure how much better realistically...maybe a guy that would have gotten spot minutes once in awhile instead of never..? Possibly. I would have probably at least taken a chance on an athlete...maybe even a Josh Smith or something of that ilk. Just a flyer. Birdman was never giving much. I'll give you that.


And the whole Dedmon/Nene/RJ debate for the mini MLE... hindsight is 20/20 on a guy like Dedmon(especially since S.A. had the inner track on him as a d-league guy) and how do you NOT re-sign RJ after he was a key cog in a newfound Cavs "death lineup" that took down the Warriors? What, so you could sign Nene as your 4th big when you didn't even play a 4th big in the finals? I'm not buying this at all.

I actually think the Tavares kid wasn't a bad signing. Probably would have been better to sign him a long long time ago as the 4th big, especially over Sanders(though I do understand why they gave Larry a look...). Just obviously too late to make any impact on the season. I think the kid will make the team next year and could easily benefit big time playing with LeBron, Bron likes big targets.





SIDE NOTE....


And after we all finally thought the Shumpert/Delly debate was over....Shumpert =comes in and shuts Paul Georges water off.....what a damn roller coaster....maybe now he takes that confidence and rips off a surprisingly good playoff run. Or maybe he gets lazy and starts sucking again. The peaks and valleys of Iman Shumpert....kind of a book title.

 

[inliner311]

Birdman sucked. I'm not looking at some photo of the one time he dunked. how big of a whatever do you need from me. Show me some stats that suggest he wasn't a complete and total zero.

And then explain to me how this team didn't need another big all season while TT is developing tendinitis.

Bogut, guy who's injured most of the season for Dallas suddenly gets injured. Wow, who could've possibly expected that? complete shock. Maybe if he didn't wait to the last moment to address the situation, figuring Channing Frye was fine.... but whatever. you see it different. I see Birdman as borderline malpractice and unlikely to make it through the season. 38 year old big. Geez. Bring back Zadrunas...

I thought Griff should have went after Thomas Robinson instead of Birdman to be TT lite with a better shot. He could plug in for TT and could have been had for minimum salary. Maybe he will be available again for cheap this offseason.

 

[LeShaq]

Birdman can play. The problem with him this year was that he had gained too much weight.

It's a real shame. He could still jump and he has a high BBIQ. But that extra weight probably contributed to his knee injury.

 

[Chris Parker]

To be fair, Bogut snapping his leg was not just "an old injury prone guy getting injured". That was a legitimate bad luck, freak injury from an NBA athlete going full speed directly into his lower leg at an angle and getting all bone.

will give you that, but what do you make of two "freak" accidents on consecutive years.... (while already enduring some kind of recurring hammy/calf thing in dallas?)
From a guy that broke his arm in a freak accident, f'ing up his career.
I mean, obviously, you can't expect that, but the converse is, what, DG had inside info that Bogut would be amenable to the Cavs? because any other situation, that's a big chance we end up right where we are? I mean right? What happened with Joe Johnson? So I don't buy "well, we had Bogut locked up the whole time." But maybe they did and it will come out. Otherwise seems like an unwise risk that we are really paying for now.

Admittedly Dedmon was a bit of a diamond in the rough. But isn't that what a good GM does? And yeah, I"m not talking a huge thing, but someone like Seraphin even on the Pacers seems to be able to spend 8-10 semi non-eventful minutes on floor and can throw around a big body. That would've been a godsend at points during the season I believe, assuming of course, Lue would play him....

 

[InBoobieWeTrust]

will give you that, but what do you make of two "freak" accidents on consecutive years.... (while already enduring some kind of recurring hammy/calf thing in dallas?)
From a guy that broke his arm in a freak accident, f'ing up his career.
I mean, obviously, you can't expect that, but the converse is, what, DG had inside info that Bogut would be amenable to the Cavs? because any other situation, that's a big chance we end up right where we are? I mean right? What happened with Joe Johnson? So I don't buy "well, we had Bogut locked up the whole time." But maybe they did and it will come out. Otherwise seems like an unwise risk that we are really paying for now.

Admittedly Dedmon was a bit of a diamond in the rough. But isn't that what a good GM does? And yeah, I"m not talking a huge thing, but someone like Seraphin even on the Pacers seems to be able to spend 8-10 semi non-eventful minutes on floor and can throw around a big body. That would've been a godsend at points during the season I believe, assuming of course, Lue would play him....

Griffin has said, I believe to Zach Lowe maybe? Not sure exactly who...but he said we had been "working on Bogut for 3 months".

Now, the NBA owners are complaining about the buy-out rules and saying it supports an environment of collusion?

Throw in the Deron buy-out, and now the Liggins getting cut and then signed by Dallas thing on the last possible day.....

I really honestly think the Mavs and the Cavs are definitely linking up behind closed doors and executing a lot of "wink wink" or "handshake" deals.

I think they knew Bogut was a likelihood as long as no team willingly would give Dallas a pick for him with the hope of playing him on their team (Boston?)

I do agree with you somewhat though. Like I said, I would have found somebody who could have given us legitimate force/athleticism at a frontcourt spot. Josh Smith, a guy like Seraphin....whoever really... take your pick...I do think Birdman was way out of shape and should have been retired. Maybe they didn't expect him to remain out of shape for 3 more months after that, who knows.

I think the lack of a 4th big definitely hurt us a little. I think we ultimately paid the price in seeding, because we were forced to choose rest and health, mainly because we didn't have the right pieces to maintain with the issues we dealt with all season.

 

[buzzdog]

Wow. I really don't even know what to say to this. Did you notice all the love when we signed blue collar white guy Chris Andersen? Me neither. Also worth noting that I'm criticizing a white guy general manager.

Yeah, but he's a ginger. Admit it, you're prejudiced against gingers, aren't ya?

 

[Rich]

will give you that, but what do you make of two "freak" accidents on consecutive years.... (while already enduring some kind of recurring hammy/calf thing in dallas?)
From a guy that broke his arm in a freak accident, f'ing up his career.
I mean, obviously, you can't expect that, but the converse is, what, DG had inside info that Bogut would be amenable to the Cavs? because any other situation, that's a big chance we end up right where we are? I mean right? What happened with Joe Johnson? So I don't buy "well, we had Bogut locked up the whole time." But maybe they did and it will come out. Otherwise seems like an unwise risk that we are really paying for now.

Admittedly Dedmon was a bit of a diamond in the rough. But isn't that what a good GM does? And yeah, I"m not talking a huge thing, but someone like Seraphin even on the Pacers seems to be able to spend 8-10 semi non-eventful minutes on floor and can throw around a big body. That would've been a godsend at points during the season I believe, assuming of course, Lue would play him....

That's the thing. Compared to his peers, Griffin didn't find enough help.

The Spurs turn Dedmon into something useful. The Warriors McGee. Meanwhile we didn't get a single useful minute from one vet minimum player until Deron Williams was bought out.

I'm just not sure why some criticism can't be leveled at Griffin for that? I mean we have went an entire season, and now postseason, without a playable 7 footer. That's sad.

 

[The Human Q-Tip]

Yeah, but he's a ginger. Admit it, you're prejudiced against gingers, aren't ya?

But I apparently also am infatuated with Scalabrine, so who the hell knows at this point.