Windhorst on Cavs Trade Talk (2/7)

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Is VC worth the Risk????

Is improving our frontcourt a more pressing issue? And if we do, like by adding a Camby, is AV going to Bolt in the Summer?

these are my questions for Danny Ferry? good luck to that guy...whew

Our frontcourt is more pressing. The back court has Mo and Delonte, both playing exceptional, with Boobie, Sasha, Wally, and Kinsey all as capable backups. The front court only has 33 year old Z and 34 year old Ben Wallace with Varejao as the only legit backup, and a young rookie in JJ. Plus, Delonte is playing much better than Ben is. So, our front court not only need the talent upgrade, but also the depth. I'm pretty sure it's a no brainer. The only way we look at our back court is if we can't get something done in our front court.

If we bring in Camby, AV would still probably get 28 minutes or so per night. Also, I think we could move AV into our starting PF role next year and move Ben to the bench. We don't know if AV is going to stay here for sure anyways. However, I believe we will have all the leverage with AV, and Camby only improves that position.

1) There aren't too many teams with 10+ million in cap space this offseason. With free agents like Boozer and Marion out there, who would go for AV as their first option?

2) Teams with cap space may want to hold on to it for next offseason (2010).

This means that it is HIGHLY unlikely anybody will pay AV more than we are willing to. If he threatens to hold out, we just play with Z, Ben, Camby, JJ, and Darnell for a while. I really think that there is no way we don't have leverage over AV this offseason.

Does that answer your questions?

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

well than you cant say LBJ is "more than likely going to still be with the cavs past 2010" than... if LBJ is here in 2010 and we have Cap Bosh will be here if he isnt already......

I'm pretty sure the best route is a sign and trade with Toronto. This idea has been rehashed over and over, but to sign Bosh to a max deal in 2010, we'd have to pretty much gut our depth, and he'd still be taking a pay cut because we can only give him 8% raises as opposed to Toronto's 10.5% raises.

 

[Mr2400]

i don't believe camby is available. I'd take VC of all those.

 

[Megamansilly]

Probably not. We won't have the picks to trade because we would have traded them for VC.

I wouldnt trade anymroe than 1 pick for VC... he isnt worth it

 

[Megamansilly]

I'm pretty sure the best route is a sign and trade with Toronto. This idea has been rehashed over and over, but to sign Bosh to a max deal in 2010, we'd have to pretty much gut our depth, and he'd still be taking a pay cut because we can only give him 8% raises as opposed to Toronto's 10.5% raises.

gut your depth? andy is all well and ben since I dont think he will play basketball after that.. you have no clue if you thank we have to "gut our depth" its really crazy to say that its you sign andy or you sign bosh a year later. DUHHH and I dont think bosh cares about the little raises since he will have rings and if money is that big of a deal he can sell them plus all the deals he will get with LBJ in TV ads and stuff.

 

[Ziggie123]

Although LA has said that Camby and/or kaman (currently hurt) are not available that simply doesn't make sense from an economic standpoint for a team that is going nowhere. So, I have to beleive that both can be had. Camby shouldn't cost more than Wally or Snow and a 1st.

 

[ohbarrett]

gut your depth? andy is all well and ben since I dont think he will play basketball after that.. you have no clue if you thank we have to "gut our depth" its really crazy to say that its you sign andy or you sign bosh a year later. DUHHH and I dont think bosh cares about the little raises since he will have rings and if money is that big of a deal he can sell them plus all the deals he will get with LBJ in TV ads and stuff.

I appreciate your posts, but goddamn, that airbrushed broad in your avatar is creeping me out.

 

[Megamansilly]

I appreciate your posts, but goddamn, that airbrushed broad in your avatar is creeping me out.

:chuckles: sad thing is it doesnt even look airbrushed if you go look at a playboy photo. :chuckles:

 

[Radar]

Although LA has said that Camby and/or kaman (currently hurt) are not available that simply doesn't make sense from an economic standpoint for a team that is going nowhere. So, I have to beleive that both can be had. Camby shouldn't cost more than Wally or Snow and a 1st.

agree..i just dont understand that...they arent going anywhere and paying all that money...or they may want to wait until next season when their team is healthy......i would be so glad if ferry can somehow get kaman/camby

 

[Mdog1]

gut your depth? andy is all well and ben since I dont think he will play basketball after that.. you have no clue if you thank we have to "gut our depth" its really crazy to say that its you sign andy or you sign bosh a year later. DUHHH and I dont think bosh cares about the little raises since he will have rings and if money is that big of a deal he can sell them plus all the deals he will get with LBJ in TV ads and stuff.

We still can't sign ben, Z, and we may have to decline Delontes player option depending on who we bring in. So Bosh, JJ, DJ3 is our big rotation for 2010 if we sign Bosh.

 

[jason436]

What's the word on Joe Smith? I know he was pushing for a buyout earlier in the year. Hopefully he's bought out after the deadline and he remains fond of his brief stint with the Cavaliers.

The other thing I wouldn't be surprised to see is a deal invovling Amare and Bosh. Amare was with Colangelo so maybe he'd entertain the notion of being the Alpha dog in Toronto. As things are now if Bosh isn't resigning in Toronto and Amare isn't in Phoenix maybe a swap is worth a shot. Now ths might be our best chance for a Bosh deal, by getting in the middle of a three team deal. The Suns might be in a position financially where they are willing to dump salary and pick up a young player, Hickson, instead of a All-Star and the cap figure that comes with it. Again this is a huge "might" but I don't think we have the assets other then ending contracts to make a deal for either one alone.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

gut your depth? andy is all well and ben since I dont think he will play basketball after that.. you have no clue if you thank we have to "gut our depth" its really crazy to say that its you sign andy or you sign bosh a year later. DUHHH and I dont think bosh cares about the little raises since he will have rings and if money is that big of a deal he can sell them plus all the deals he will get with LBJ in TV ads and stuff.

Yes, GUT OUR DEPTH. But since this has been rehashed only about least 50 times over the past two years, let me break it down for you one more time.

The salary cap for 2010-2011, at best guess, should be between 58 and 62 million dollars.

Our guaranteed contracts for 2010-2011 are:

Mo: 9,300,000
Boobie: 4,015,334

The guys we'll obviously keep because they're so cheap are:

JJ: 1,429,200
Darnell: 854,389

Delonte has a team option at $4,500,000. At the rate he's playing, how well he fits in our style of play, and the chemistry he has with our team, there is no way you let him go.

That leaves our salary at $20,098,923.

LeBron's salary will be 30% of the cap. So, let's just go with 60 million as our estimate. That means LeBron's 2010-2011 salary will be 18,000,000.

So, our salary figure is $38,098,923.

Then, add in the salary for our '09 and '10 first round picks, which we'll guess will each be near the end of the first, so we'll jut go with 2 million total, which would be 1 million each.

Our salary figure is now $40,098,923 with just eight men on the roster.

So, you have to add 4x the rookie minimum salary onto our cap figure, to fill out the roster. This is $1,894,416. This leaves us at $41,993,339.

Don't forget, so far this is assuming that we do not sign our second round draft picks, and that we do not sign any players past 2010. Each of these is a pretty big assumption. Also, we could not re-sign Andy.

Now, in order to sign Bosh, you'd have to renounce all of your free agents: Z, Ben, Sasha, and whoever else we'd have on our team next year. This leaves you with enough room to offer Bosh his max salary deal of $18,000,000.

So, your roster looks like:

Mo
Delonte, Boobie
LeBron
Bosh, JJ
Darnell

With our two first round draft picks from 2009, and 2010.

Now, you do not have a MLE or BAE to work with. The only players you are allowed to sign is players who will sign for the MINIMUM salary. So, yes, if we want to go your worthless plan of signing Bosh as a free agent in 2010, our team would have to gut its depth.

Next time, Megamansilly, think before you post. Please do not call me out saying "DUHHH" unless you actually have a morsel of a clue what you are talking about.

 

[Out of the Rafters at the Q]

Special thanks to Megamansilly. You've made me even more upset than I was watching the Cavs lose today.

 

[TruBuckeye22]

hopefully I am wrong but I don't see Amare as a realistic possibility for the Cavaliers so I would hope they could bring in either Camby or Richard Jefferson.

 

[Wes]

Another quick thing that bears pointing out: Next season, the Cavs will be in a similar position, with the expiring contract of Ben Wallace to work with. If the Cavs decide to move Wally for backcourt help this season, then the frontcourt becomes even more of a concern when it's time to possibly move Wallace. Shoring up the frontcourt this season, with the expectation that it's going to take a hit with a potential Ben Wallace trade next season, is something that Ferry is probably dealing with.

As far as my expectations for this deadline, I'd be surprised if Wally is moved for anything substantial, if at all. My feeling is that Ferry will use the trade exception to pick up some frontcourt depth, most likely a player that is a little better than Lorenzen Wright, but not a starter by any stretch. Someone like a Robert Swift type, although I'm not saying him specifically (he makes too much to use the exception on), but a back-up player like him. I just don't think that Ferry wants to miss with the chemistry of a 39-10 team.