#52 DeShone Kizer

[Randolphkeys]

Everyone with the exception of maybe Rodgers played in a less simplistic offensive era.

You're going back 15-20 years or more on almost all of these guys.

Should I assume you misspoke? Each year the NFL becomes less simplistic and more complex in both offense and defensive schemes.

 

[Pick6]

We will never be able to answer the question about what happens to a quarterback when you start them "too early". In recent history is there any evidence of a guy who started as a rookie and was absolute ass, but shook off that stink and whose problems turned out to be correctable?

I don't know stats off the top of my head, so while some of the losing was certainly due to the QB and some was certainly due to the rest of the team (same circumstances as any young Browns QB that has been thrown out there...), Derek Carr started out his career 0-10 and Marcus Mariota led the Titans to the #1 pick his rookie year.

 

[Sebastian]

I don't know stats off the top of my head, so while some of the losing was certainly due to the QB and some was certainly due to the rest of the team (same circumstances as any young Browns QB that has been thrown out there...), Derek Carr started out his career 0-10 and Marcus Mariota led the Titans to the #1 pick his rookie year.

I think it boils down to if he is ready to start he starts. If he is good enough to beat out Kessler than why wait?

That said, if he isn't clearly better then no need to rush him.

 

[Jack Brickman]

I think it boils down to if he is ready to start he starts. If he is good enough to beat out Kessler than why wait?

That said, if he isn't clearly better then no need to rush him.

One nice thing is that we should have an offensive line that doesn't get him murdered like most of our past QBs.

 

[Matches]

One nice thing is that we should have an offensive line that doesn't get him murdered like most of our past QBs.

Were our guards so bad in the Thomas-Mack-Schwartz era? Is that why our QBs got murdered?

If Kizer is not ready to handle NFL pressure he will make this allegedly amazing offensive line we have look very bad.

 

[Triplethreat]

I think it boils down to if he is ready to start he starts. If he is good enough to beat out Kessler than why wait?

That said, if he isn't clearly better then no need to rush him.

As simple and cut and dry as it gets.

It's all on the coaches to decide when that time is. I trust them.

 

[The Oi]

I think if he isn't ready, all the more reason to start him. Booing him will give the fans something to get behind.

 

[sportscoach]

I think if he isn't ready, all the more reason to start him. Booing him will give the fans something to get behind.

I actually think for a change, they can get behind an at least semi-competent playing team with the Browns! That's something we haven't had in a long time!!

 

[AZ_]

Were our guards so bad in the Thomas-Mack-Schwartz era? Is that why our QBs got murdered?

If Kizer is not ready to handle NFL pressure he will make this allegedly amazing offensive line we have look very bad.

No, they got murdered because they sucked.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Lets be fair: Mack and Thomas were beasts, but the guards had injuries all throughout. Remember Pork Chop Warmack? Jason Pinkston? Schwartz didn't really become a positive on the line until his free agency year, classic Browns move. Guards were indeed a problem.

As for the QBs, McCoy thought he was a dual threat and always looked to run, often finding out college defenders are three steps slower than the pros. Weeden had the pocket presence of an old balogna sandwich you forgot about last Tuesday. Hoyer had more success than the other chumps, but problems staying healthy his first year and then a GM who hated his guts/ no center worth playing.

On we all move, this looks like a hedged bet that might work out in 2017, but definitely sets the franchise up for success in 2018.

 

[sportscoach]

Lets be fair: Mack and Thomas were beasts, but the guards had injuries all throughout. Remember Pork Chop Warmack? Jason Pinkston? Schwartz didn't really become a positive on the line until his free agency year, classic Browns move. Guards were indeed a problem.

As for the QBs, McCoy thought he was a dual threat and always looked to run, often finding out college defenders are three steps slower than the pros. Weeden had the pocket presence of an old balogna sandwich you forgot about last Tuesday. Hoyer had more success than the other chumps, but problems staying healthy his first year and then a GM who hated his guts/ no center worth playing.

On we all move, this looks like a hedged bet that might work out in 2017, but definitely sets the franchise up for success in 2018.

Honestly Hoyer wasn't a bad QB at all for us, but the higher ups, went against Pettine's wishes as a coach, drafted Manziel and likely demanded he would start. When the FO of a team takes power away from a coach to make on field decisions and decisions away from who he plays, then you will always fail as a team. We went 7-2 at one point, but missed the playoffs. That tells me the higher ups didn't care about Petrine, they just wanted to use him as a puppet.

 

[Randolphkeys]

Honestly Hoyer wasn't a bad QB at all for us, but the higher ups, went against Pettine's wishes as a coach, drafted Manziel and likely demanded he would start. When the FO of a team takes power away from a coach to make on field decisions and decisions away from who he plays, then you will always fail as a team. We went 7-2 at one point, but missed the playoffs. That tells me the higher ups didn't care about Petrine, they just wanted to use him as a puppet.

I know someone on the Browns payroll and I believe him when I hear Haslam has changed as an owner. He lets the football people do their jobs, he wants the best coaches possible and doesn't want others interfering. But those first two or three years, man... they were still sending plays down to the coaches, like it's a game of Madden. Hoyer is a low level starter, but he is solid in the pocket. Shanahan hand-picked him here in S.F. for a good reason. Some of his deep balls could be more accurate, but other than that he's a vertical passer who plays to his strengths and makes the right reads. Browns should have kept him. Oh well, hoping Kizer develops in the pocket and I don't have to consider the Hoyer teams "the good old days."

 

[sportscoach]

I know someone on the Browns payroll and I believe him when I hear Haslam has changed as an owner. He lets the football people do their jobs, he wants the best coaches possible and doesn't want others interfering. But those first two or three years, man... they were still sending plays down to the coaches, like it's a game of Madden. Hoyer is a low level starter, but he is solid in the pocket. Shanahan hand-picked him here in S.F. for a good reason. Some of his deep balls could be more accurate, but other than that he's a vertical passer who plays to his strengths and makes the right reads. Browns should have kept him. Oh well, hoping Kizer develops in the pocket and I don't have to consider the Hoyer teams "the good old days."

The body language on that team wasn't right especially in the second year Pettine was here. It wouldn't surprise me if he told Hoyer to get out of Cleveland. Hoyer is a solid QB, but never will be a franchise guy, but I also wish we just didn't draft Manziel and let the coach do his job.

I honestly don't care who ends up taking the reigns of this team as long as we have someone just do a good job overall. Dalton in Cincinnati isn't a flashy QB, but he does what is needed. Hopefully we don't have to keep drafting QBs

 

[Randolphkeys]

The body language on that team wasn't right especially in the second year Pettine was here. It wouldn't surprise me if he told Hoyer to get out of Cleveland. Hoyer is a solid QB, but never will be a franchise guy, but I also wish we just didn't draft Manziel and let the coach do his job.

I honestly don't care who ends up taking the reigns of this team as long as we have someone just do a good job overall. Dalton in Cincinnati isn't a flashy QB, but he does what is needed. Hopefully we don't have to keep drafting QBs

One thing Browns fans need to work on is valuing a mid-tier quarterback. Hoyer has spent the years since being a Brown being serviceable enough to help the positional players around him develop. The Browns didn't value that and assumed it was easily replaceable even if Manziel didn't pan out. Well, as it turns out a QB who finishes between 20th and 30th in the league is very valuable and not that easy to replace after all.

 

[The Oi]

One thing Browns fans need to work on is valuing a mid-tier quarterback. Hoyer has spent the years since being a Brown being serviceable enough to help the positional players around him develop. The Browns didn't value that and assumed it was easily replaceable even if Manziel didn't pan out. Well, as it turns out a QB who finishes between 20th and 30th in the league is very valuable and not that easy to replace after all.

I'm willing to work on this. How do I start?

Is there an audiobook or podcast I should be checking out while I mow the lawn or drive to work?