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Happy 60th Birthday To The GOAT.

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The GOAT is that one goat Robert Sarver let into his GM's office that shat on the desk
 
PIP said:
Could LeBron dominate in the 80’s & 90’s ? Without question…. But he would be beat up considerably on a nightly basis…. I wonder if he would have the same longevity?
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PIP said:
But he would still dominate…
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Lebron would have obliterated the league in the 80s and 90s. He’s basically a stronger, more skilled, faster version of Magic Johnson. The rules differences about physicality would just have freed him up to impose his will physically that much more. And his durability is not in question.
 
jjvors said:
ENTJ here. That's a unique take, invalidated by thousands, if not millions of Myers Briggs tests, the results of which are on the internet.

Humorous diversion from the thread topic.

Carry on.
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Yeah, Niednagel's approach is different for sure. He didn't administer tests to players like LeBron and Jordan, but typed them through their motor skills. Niednagel believes people can be typed with 100% objectivity by the way they move. He eschews the traditional tests because they're subjective and people often end up as a type that isn't accurate.

The problem with his "50% of all people are actually ENTP" hypothesis is that humans are so diverse that, if such a hypothesis is actually true, it renders the 16 type system not especially meaningful. That's a lot of people to be one singular type. And that's not even addressing the ramifications of his insistence upon James being ESFP, Jordan being ISTP, and ISTP being judged as an objectively better basketball type overall than ESFP. Niednagel made a lot of strong claims about his type system that make it very controversial and hard for people to understand and apply. But it was fascinating to learn about, and I was into it for awhile, like Danny Ainge.
 
PIP said:
Honestly ? I don’t know if the 1960’s Wilt or 70’s Wilt is any better than the best centers of the 90’s…

I say this because Wilt (like Shaq) never had to really develop his game because he was more physically gifted than everyone else.

Shaq had the spin move, and turn around bank shot, but everything else was back down and dominate…

The players in the 60’s couldn’t handle that with Wilt. Shaq would have destroyed that league. Those players also didn’t have to deal with a player like Robinson who could hit 18 footers all game long or a Hakeem, with every move on the block…

I’ve seen Wilt pull down a rebound and dribble down the floor in transition — very impressive— I’m just not sure how skilled he was in the post asides from being just so much bigger…. Shaq (was a far more physical presence) and teams were able to handle that…

So I’m not sure if Wilt dominates his era like Shaq would dominate Wilt’s era…

That’s what floors me about this game today… Yes Jordan didn’t shoot 3’s, but he was a master at getting to whatever spot he wanted and could destroy you…. That’s like saying Kobe couldn’t dominate this era…. Hell, that’s like saying DeMar DeRozan is not currently dominating this season with a inside the 3 point line style of game….

Could LeBron dominate in the 80’s & 90’s ? Without question…. But he would be beat up considerably on a nightly basis…. I wonder if he would have the same longevity?

But he would still dominate…
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LOL! I didn't compare Shaq and Wilt directly. But now I will. On offense, Wilt was stronger, faster and had more endurance. He had a fade-away jumpshot and a finger roll, which Shaq didn't have. On defense, I've already mentioned Wilt averaged over 8 blocks a game on the games of his we've recorded. He also averaged 22 rebounds a game for his career.

So I don't think there is any comparison on individual skill.
 
cavsfever said:
Lebron would have obliterated the league in the 80s and 90s. He’s basically a stronger, more skilled, faster version of Magic Johnson. The rules differences about physicality would just have freed him up to impose his will physically that much more. And his durability is not in question.
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So are you suggesting LeBron would have been a better version of himself in that era ?

I’m not disputing it. Just wondering.
 
cavsfever said:
Lebron would have obliterated the league in the 80s and 90s. He’s basically a stronger, more skilled, faster version of Magic Johnson. The rules differences about physicality would just have freed him up to impose his will physically that much more. And his durability is not in question.
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Yeah I’ve never understood why people always see the physicality of the 80s as something that would’ve hurt LeBron and not helped him. Miami LeBron was like 6’9 275 pounds. Now he gets to be more physical, especially when he’s guarding players on defense? Sheesh.
 
KilgoreTrout said:
INTJ here, and I’m making a judgment.

LeBron is the GOAT.
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Yes. Such judgments cannot be proven or disproven, which is why this argument has gone on since Wilt vs Bill Russell. There's a case to be made for MJ, Lebron, Wilt, Kareem, and Russell. It depends on the assumptions you make. I don't think the other candidates measure up to those 5.
 
2 For The Brew said:
I said 13 - 11 as a player and 2 as a coach. I deliberately double counted 2 seasons he won as player-coach. I’m well aware he didn’t win the title 2 of 13 years.
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Ah, thanks for the explanation. I took it to mean he never lost in his career.
 
LeBron would have had to develop a post game quicker. Nobody would have let LeBron just go down hill on them.

Fastbreak ? Yes of course. Within the half court ? Doubt it
 
Why is Michael Jordan being talked about in a LeBron thread? And LeBron's birthday was in December. Turrible NBA fandom going on here.
 
PIP said:
LeBron would have had to develop a post game quicker. Nobody would have let LeBron just go down hill on them.

Fastbreak ? Yes of course. Within the half court ? Doubt it
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Right. It'd be similar to Detroit's defense against him in the Eastern Championship. With more fouling. Every game. I know. I watched a lot of basketball in the 80s. No flagrant fouls, just double technicals.

But he'll still pass out of double-teams and still beat any defender one-on-one.
 
jjvors said:
LOL! I didn't compare Shaq and Wilt directly. But now I will. On offense, Wilt was stronger, faster and had more endurance. He had a fade-away jumpshot and a finger roll, which Shaq didn't have. On defense, I've already mentioned Wilt averaged over 8 blocks a game on the games of his we've recorded. He also averaged 22 rebounds a game for his career.

So I don't think there is any comparison on individual skill.
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I get it. Wilt played basically 10 seasons in the NBA when there was between 8-10 teams in the entire league.

The man averaged over 25 shot attempts per game 8 times in his career. Shaq averages over 20 attempts only 2 times. I mean Wilt almost averaged 40 attempts 1 season.

I just think Shaq could have dominated in Wilt’s era more than Wilt could have dominated in Shaq’s era on both sides of the floor.
 
PIP said:
I get it. Wilt played basically 10 seasons in the NBA when there was between 8-10 teams in the entire league.

The man averaged over 25 shot attempts per game 8 times in his career. Shaq averages over 20 attempts only 2 times. I mean Wilt almost averaged 40 attempts 1 season.

I just think Shaq could have dominated in Wilt’s era more than Wilt could have dominated in Shaq’s era on both sides of the floor.
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It's possible. We can't prove anything with my hypothetical thought experiment. It's just how I compare players, moving them to different times and teams. It all comes down to our opinions.
 
Ill make the argument a bit better when I am not starving, but I think the top 4 has to be Russell, Kareem, MJ, LeBron. I like to pick either Kobe or Shaq to be the 5th guy to be annoying, but those two guys are more like 10 rather than 5
 
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