2018 Buckeyes Football

[col63onel]

At least Joey played in that meaningless Battlefrog Fiesta Bowl game... which no sane person would've blamed him if he didn't. And that targeting ejection was garbage.

Sure, Nick was a great player, although it was sort of a weird career here with not even starting his first two years. Again, if he's not healthy, it is what it is. Not going to blast the kid for not wanting to play through the injury, risk making it worse, and jeopardize his NFL career. But if he knew he would be fully healed by November and still just chose to quit... that to me is just another story entirely.

Agree, in general. Listing accolades is not the same. Terrelle Pryor and JT Barrett are 2 of the most accomplished OSU QBs of all time. But ask what their legacies are, and it's complicated. Saying Nick Bosa's legacy is being in his brother's shadow doesn't seem like a stretch.

 

[Surge]

Yep. I don't hold it against him. Just an unfortunate situation.

Silver lining is that by supporting this decision publicly, it could help land high end recruits later on.

Sort of like how Calipari always pushes his players to go pro at the expense of possibly winning more games the next season.

 

[AZ_]

At least Joey played in that meaningless Battlefrog Fiesta Bowl game... which no sane person would've blamed him if he didn't. And that targeting ejection was garbage.

Sure, Nick was a great player, although it was sort of a weird career here with not even starting his first two years. Again, if he's not healthy, it is what it is. Not going to blast the kid for not wanting to play through the injury, risk making it worse, and jeopardize his NFL career. But if he knew he would be fully healed by November and still just chose to quit... that to me is just another story entirely.

Fully healed, yes.

Without having adequate conditioning and at risk for another injury? Yes.

Even if he weren't, hard to fault a guaranteed Top 5 pick for doing so when he has absolutely no financial incentive to do so.

I understand the concern of "leaving your team," but its a business even if the NCAA would hate to admit as such.

 

[Ohio]

Silver lining is that by supporting this decision publicly, it could help land high end recruits later on.

Sort of like how Calipari always pushes his players to go pro at the expense of possibly winning more games the next season.

Oh, absolutely. You have to support the decision publicly if you're Urban. He handled this perfectly from a PR perspective (surprisingly).

 

[TheLand1287]

Agree, in general. Listing accolades is not the same. Terrelle Pryor and JT Barrett are 2 of the most accomplished OSU QBs of all time. But ask what their legacies are, and it's complicated. Saying Nick Bosa's legacy is being in his brother's shadow doesn't seem like a stretch.

I'm getting off topic, but man... Terrelle Pryor's best legacy here was simply committing to play here. He was SO high profile. His lasting legacy was unfortunately tattoo-gate. In between, he was a good collegiate QB, but never quite lived up to the hype. His overall record was good, he won a few BCS games, but he came up small in some huge games under the biggest lights that led to playing in BCS games rather than BCS Championship games. His record at Michigan was perfect, but it was also during the Rich Rod era, so...

JT Barrett era I'll always look back on with fond memories. Sure, it went on for 50 years, and his lack of an elite arm hurt us in some big games... but unlike Pryor there was little to no hype with him. He came in for Braxton a week before the 2014 season started and it looked like it would be a lost year. After a rough start he was a Heisman contender and helped get to the B1G Title game where Cardale did the rest. He rewrote the OSU record book. He won big games. He never lost to Michigan in an era where they had good teams. IMO, most of the criticism with Barrett is due to us becoming extremely spoiled in the Urban Meyer era.

As good as Haskins has been, I think we're seeing there was an aspect of JT's game that this year's team is sorely missing with the run game and short yardage situations. I really wish Urban would start to try working Tate into the 3rd/4th/GL and short situations to make the running game less predictable. Sort of like what he did with Tebow at Florida when Chris Leak was their starting QB.

 

[Ohio]

We're getting off topic here, but man... Terrelle Pryor's best legacy here was simply committing to play here. He was SO high profile. His lasting legacy was unfortunately tattoo-gate. In between, he was a good collegiate QB, but never quite lived up to the hype. His overall record was good, he won a few BCS games, but he came up small in some huge games under the biggest lights that led to playing in BCS games rather than BCS Championship games. His record at Michigan was perfect, but it was also during the Rich Rod era, so...

Wow. I don't agree with this at all. Do you forget how Ohio State was looked at nationally after the two consecutive Championship Game beatdowns? It was ugly. Pryor's legacy, to me, was restoring Ohio State as an elite program in the eyes of the public. He didn't just win the Big 10 every year, he didn't just beat Michigan every year, but he carried us to b2b BCS bowl wins against great teams. He single handily shed Ohio State of the "can't win big games" and "can't beat anyone outside the Big Ten" labels. Sure, his career had an unfortunate ending, but I honestly never gave a shit about Tatgate and I still don't. Will never hold anything against those guys.

JT Barrett era I'll always look back on with fond memories. Sure, it went on for 50 years, and his lack of an elite arm hurt us in some big games... but unlike Pryor there was little to no hype with him. He came in for Braxton a week before the 2014 season started and it looked like it would be a lost year. After a rough start he was a Heisman contender and helped get to the B1G Title game where Cardale did the rest. He rewrote the OSU record book. He won big games. He never lost to Michigan in an era where they had good teams. IMO, most of the criticism with Barrett is due to us becoming spoiled in the Urban Meyer era.

So, basically...Pryor is a dick and JT is a good guy. And JT played for 10 years. There's the difference between the two. Both won a shitload of games, including big games. Both lost some games they never should have and both had a couple limp dick performances in big games.

Think we can all agree JT had a lot more to work with than Pryor ever did, though. I don't think I'd say JT underachieved, but I do think Pryor did what he did with much less.

As good as Haskins has been, I think we're seeing there was an aspect of JT's game that this year's team is sorely missing with the run game and short yardage situations. I really wish Urban would start to try working Tate into the 3rd/4th/GL and short situations to make the running game less predictable. Sort of like what he did with Tebow at Florida when Chris Leak was their starting QB.

Was discussing this at the post-game tailgate on Saturday. I think it's potentially a really good idea, as long as Haskins would be 100% on board with it. The most important thing is you can't screw up what we have with him. In an ideal world, you find another way to solve the issue...but I'm not sure there is one.

 

[MGMT]

Wow. I don't agree with this at all. Do you forget how Ohio State was looked at nationally after the two consecutive Championship Game beatdowns? It was ugly. Pryor's legacy, to me, was restoring Ohio State as an elite program in the eyes of the public. He didn't just win the Big 10 every year, he didn't just beat Michigan every year, but he carried us to b2b BCS bowl wins against great teams. He single handily shed Ohio State of the "can't win big games" and "can't beat anyone outside the Big Ten" labels. Sure, his career had an unfortunate ending, but I honestly never gave a shit about Tatgate and I still don't. Will never hold anything against those guys.


So, basically...Pryor is a dick and JT is a good guy. And JT played for 10 years. There's the difference between the two. Both won a shitload of games, including big games. Both lost some games they never should have and both had a couple limp dick performances in big games.

Think we can all agree JT had a lot more to work with than Pryor ever did, though. I don't think I'd say JT underachieved, but I do think Pryor did what he did with much less.


Was discussing this at the post-game tailgate on Saturday. I think it's potentially a really good idea, as long as Haskins would be 100% on board with it. The most important thing is you can't screw up what we have with him. In an ideal world, you find another way to solve the issue...but I'm not sure there is one.

Wouldn’t it be odd for a highly paid coaching staff to be super confused about what to do to be better on 3rd and short if you don’t have a running quarterback?

Not saying your comment is confusing per se but the sentiment itself is just a bit bewildering to me.

 

[Ohio]

Wouldn’t it be odd for a highly paid coaching staff to be super confused about what to do to be better on 3rd and short if you don’t have a running quarterback?

Not saying your comment is confusing per se but the sentiment itself is just a bit bewildering to me.

Doesn't seem like it should be this hard, but apparently it is. Why the hell we won't just put Haskins under center and push him a yard, I have no idea. Urban's explanation for not doing that was pretty weak. Fucking practice it if you have to.

 

[billmac91]

What’s Nick Bosa’s legacy here?

I’ll never condemn the McCaffery’s of the world for sitting out the Sun Bowl, or even Ward for sitting out the Cotton Bowl. They’re glorified exhibition games at the end of the day.

But if you’re truly healthy enough to play by mid-November and your team is 11-0 getting ready to play your biggest rival at home for a chance to play for a Big Ten Championship, CFB playoff appearance, and National Championship... and you’re good on all of that? That’s super fucking weak to me.

I can’t say I’ll look back on Nick’s time here with a fond memory of him. Great player and all, but no real legacy left behind.

I don't think people are giving enough respect to the actual injury he sustained......as an FSU grad, it's been super disappointing following George Campbell's career after he came in as a 5 star, elite athlete. He had a "core" injury that cost him his 2016 season, they thought he was healthy in 2017 but he re-aggravated it costing him most of that season, and then he re-aggravated it again this spring during off-season conditioning.

Sports hernias/core injuries are extremely sensitive. As much time as you can give it to heal is the best approach, and even with that, it's extremely common to re-aggravate the initial injury, based on the repetitive movements and muscles these guys use on a day to day basis.

Nick is sitting on a lotto ticket for millions of dollars. I don't begrudge him a single bit. I've seen a lot of people state they'd prefer he stay in school and leave the door open in the event we make the CFB. It's just not worth the risk, IMO.....could he dominate an Alabama offensive line and put himself squarely in the top 3? Yeah maybe. But he also might be top 3 anyways. But the downside is he re-aggravates the injury and raises a significant red flag about the injury going forward.

He is significantly better off just sitting out the rest of the year, letting the injury heal, focusing on the draft, and not doing anything to further damage his draft stock.

 

[Huber.]

Is Nick's legacy getting ejected in his final game?

No, so Nick's legacy will be as another great Buckeye.

Big Ten LOY
ACA All-American
Top 10 pick
etc.

Is Joey's legacy getting ejected in his final game?

 

[NorthCoastBias]

View: https://twitter.com/11W/status/1052292147473510401

 

[billmac91]

Doesn't seem like it should be this hard, but apparently it is. Why the hell we won't just put Haskins under center and push him a yard, I have no idea. Urban's explanation for not doing that was pretty weak. Fucking practice it if you have to.

This is overly simplistic, IMO. We are a power-spread team, and that has been Meyer's MO since taking on the HC position at Bowling Green.

The issue in a power spread system, especially in short yardage, is how to gain the advanatge numbers wise against the defense. Meyer has always been about "out-leveraging" the defense and getting a numbers advantage, especially in short yardage.

The problem he has currently, is you lose that numbers advantage when the defense doesn't have to account for the QB. We used to be able to spread the defense wide with 4 WR's, put a TE as a flank on the end, put JT ISO'd in the backfield, and essentially run a RB wham behind the TE block. And everyone knew exactly what we were running, but it didn't matter because of the #'s advantage we created in the box.

I agree the current solution is to let Martell handle 3rd and 4th and short in the opponents side of the field. Putting a mobile QB in that situation gives Meyer the comfort he likes in his playcalling, and it puts OSU in a much better position to execute the plays. It also makes Weber and Dobbins signifcantly more dangerous because the OLB and Safety's now have reads to make.

Taking a power-spread system, and forcing them to work from under center, getting new timing down, teaching them the proper spacing, teaching Haskins the proper footwork from center to the RB, working with the O-line to make sure they don't trip the QB on their steps immediately out of the snap, getting the center comfortable with snapping to Haskins while also needing to get leverage on the Nose Tackle and drive block...........all of that shit. It sounds so simple to say, lets go to a "jumbo set" put Haskins under center and run a QB sneak.....it's really not that easy or simplistic.

I'm all for Tate executing plays in specific situations where the offense doesn't need to change philosophies, you just have a better QB for executing the run game in those situations. If anything, you tee it up to Haskins that they're saving him from the hits he really shouldn't be taking as a pocket QB. Cal didn't run Jared Goff into stacked fronts, and we shouldn't be doing that with Haskins either....

 

[col63onel]

The best thing about our offense is Haskins slinging the ball, but now on crucial downs we're gonna take him out? No, that's out thinking yourself. Plenty of teams don't can convert short yardage without having a running QB.

 

[inliner311]

View: https://twitter.com/11W/status/1052292147473510401

Nick's people probably should have lead with this story. I still think Nick could be haunted by little things with his draft stock. One of the mocks I looked up had 10 out the top 15 being D-linemen. Little things come into play when a draft is so stacked with one group. I'm not saying major sliding but with how the rookie pay scale is structured a couple spots can be alot of money.

It's alot easier to say that he was going to sit out the playoff/bowl season because he wasn't going to be playing in the regular season and would have to come in cold to the hardest game(s) of the season.

 

[inliner311]

The best thing about our offense is Haskins slinging the ball, but now on crucial downs we're gonna take him out? No, that's out thinking yourself. Plenty of teams don't can convert short yardage without having a running QB.

I agree you don't want to pull Haskins off the field or even change personnel on 4th down to let the defense set up. There has to be something creative that you can involve Haskins in that isn't him running the ball.

They just have to come to terms that he isn't a running QB. They just need build a default formation for the situation. The moment they run something like a screen from that formation on 4th down that will soften up defenses going forward. They other things like direct snap to the RB while Haskins pretends to call out protections. Which that can turn to a pitch from the RB back to Haskins if teams ignore him. TE goes in motion and gets a inside hand off. There are a ton of things they can run but if they don't try anything but a Haskins run or simple handoff to the RB out of the shotgun, they won't find something that works.