A Closer Look at Derrick Williams

[Norm]

From DraftExpress.com http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Situational-Statistics-the-2011-Forward-Crop-3762#ixzz1Por5eU5F

I love the situational stats breakdowns they are providing

If I'm reading that right, Williams needs major work at creating for himself. Right now he needs to be fed the ball in a rythym offense to be able to score and has no outside shot.

Sounds to much like JJ right now. I'd rather go the PG who can create for himself and can create for others.

If we're able to grab the 2nd pick as well then it'd look like Irving and Williams could be a dangerous combo that would be the building block of our team. Or does Jonas seem better as he's the best C prospect in this draft with the most upside?

We all seen we couldn't get over the hump without a legit PG when we had the most talented SF in the league. I hope we get the PG first and then build around him, even if he's not the superstar. Who was the last team to win it without great PG play? 2006? We need the PG position locked down.

Williams would make better sense for us if we have a PG, not try to find a PG afterwards.

 

[Douglar]

If I'm reading that right, Williams needs major work at creating for himself. Right now he needs to be fed the ball in a rythym offense to be able to score and has no outside shot..

That's not how I read it. I read it as Williams had great results hitting his outside shots because he doesn't settle for contested jumpers. Williams would rather risk a turn over taking the ball to the hole rather that shoot a contested pull up jumper. That's a great plan. JJ Hickson should get it tattooed on his thigh so that he can read it every time he sticks his head in his ass.

 

[Norm]

That's not how I read it. I read it as Williams had great results hitting his outside shots because he doesn't settle for contested jumpers. Williams would rather risk a turn over taking the ball to the hole rather that shoot a contested pull up jumper. That's a great plan. JJ Hickson should get it tattooed on his thigh so that he can read it every time he sticks his head in his ass.

I got that too, but the part about not creating for himself is what worries me. If he plays PF, it's not so much an issue, if he plays SF, it could be a big issue. I have no issue with Williams if we were to draft him, my issue would be "Who's gonna create our offense and get others involved?"

And the part about JJ, totally agree. He knows he's a PF, but at times he looks like he wants to be a SF and that's when our offense really takes a hit. This is my issue with Williams, he says he can play SF and wants to play SF, but is the spotlight gonna be so much that he believes he's a SF and becomes uncoachable when all his measurements and ball handling skills say he's primed to be a PF? Or are all the reports coming out on Williams about his desire to play SF just smoke to help predetermine where he gets drafted (team wise)?

Looking at our team top to bottom, PG and SF are our most glaring weaknesses moving forward as far as youth and potential. Irving is being labeled a "pure PG" where as Williams is labeled as a "Tweener SF/PF". Shouldn't we go with the pure position at #1 and then risk our 2nd pick on someone who doesn't really have a definite position? Like I said earlier, I'd have no problem with Williams, but I don't see how we could take him #1 overall, unless Irving is not medically checking out as he's BPA and just so happens to fill biggest need for a rebuild that we're going through (Or we end up with picks #1 and #2 and take Williams first and Irving 2nd)

 

[Tornicade]

If I'm reading that right, Williams needs major work at creating for himself. Right now he needs to be fed the ball in a rythym offense to be able to score and has no outside shot.

Sounds to much like JJ right now. I'd rather go the PG who can create for himself and can create for others.

If we're able to grab the 2nd pick as well then it'd look like Irving and Williams could be a dangerous combo that would be the building block of our team. Or does Jonas seem better as he's the best C prospect in this draft with the most upside?

We all seen we couldn't get over the hump without a legit PG when we had the most talented SF in the league. I hope we get the PG first and then build around him, even if he's not the superstar. Who was the last team to win it without great PG play? 2006? We need the PG position locked down.

Williams would make better sense for us if we have a PG, not try to find a PG afterwards.

Williams amazingly enough only took 5 pull-up jumpers all season, representing just 1% of his total offense.

This can be viewed as either a positive or a negative. On one hand he refused to settle for these low-percentage opportunities (which with the shorter 3-point line, are truly bad shots in the collegiate game). On the other hand, this may be a part of his game that he'll need to work on, particularly if he's expected to create offense from the perimeter in the NBA as heavily as he did in college.

Its saying he never needed to create his shots from the perimeter therefore is unproven. Williams creates shots for himself by getting to the basket and going to the room. If you dont close he takes a shot if you do close in he is coming in.

 

[RonG]

<object width="384" height="216" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" id="ESPN_VIDEO" data="http://espn.go.com/videohub/player/embed.swf" allowScriptAccess="always" allowNetworking="all"><param name="movie" value="http://espn.go.com/videohub/player/embed.swf" /><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"/><param name="wmode" value="opaque"/><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"/><param name="allowNetworking" value="all"/><param name="flashVars" value="id=6687217"/></object>


Someone schooled him since the first interviews I thought, he doesn't come off near as arrogant.

 

[Tornicade]

<object width="384" height="216" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" id="ESPN_VIDEO" data="http://espn.go.com/videohub/player/embed.swf" allowScriptAccess="always" allowNetworking="all"><param name="movie" value="http://espn.go.com/videohub/player/embed.swf" /><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"/><param name="wmode" value="opaque"/><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"/><param name="allowNetworking" value="all"/><param name="flashVars" value="id=6687217"/></object>


Someone schooled him since the first interviews I thought, he doesn't come off near as arrogant.

Momma said he was nervous. his first interviews. Momma took care of it

 

[red.]

I just don't like the ''star power'' comment.

 

[DrEnoch]

I just don't like the ''star power'' comment.

I don't like the "humble" comment.

 

[JawJuttinAsasin]

No -- that's not what I was saying.

What I said was, IF both Irving and Williams are EQUAL as BPA in terms of potential and talent, then a PG is always more important than a PF.

This is confusing to me. Shouldn't positional importance and scarcity be factored into "BPA in terms of potential?" I guess I am having trouble envisioning equal players who arent actually equal.

Anyway, philosophical framing aside, it seems you are trying to simply say that a PG is able to contribute more to winning basketball games than a PF. I think this goes against traditional NBA dogma that preferred big men. Was there a paradigm shift or did you arrive at such a perspective on your own? Can you expound on why you feel so strongly about such a reordering of positional importance?

 

[Tornicade]

This is confusing to me. Shouldn't positional importance and scarcity be factored into "BPA in terms of potential?" I guess I am having trouble envisioning equal players who arent actually equal.

Anyway, philosophical framing aside, it seems you are trying to simply say that a PG is able to contribute more to winning basketball games than a PF. I think this goes against traditional NBA dogma that preferred big men. Was there a paradigm shift or did you arrive at such a perspective on your own? Can you expound on why you feel so strongly about such a reordering of positional importance?

well just look at the bulls. they took a playoff team to the playoffs with derrick rose
The wizards took a losing team to more losses with John wall
The celtics took a champinship caliber team to the championships with Rajon rondo
and the hornets won 50 games one season with chris paul

it is quite obvious without a gifted point guard a team isnt able to do what it was already doing

because obviously if point guard wasnt so crucial to a team success. kahn wouldnt of drafted three in a row.

 

[3fromthekey]

You have no clue to who DW is. I promise Irving is overrated. He his no Rose or Wall. DW is by far the
best player in this year's draft. Still I expect the Cavs to select Irving. It will be a mistake
mark our words!

 

[Ayatolla of Slamola]

You have no clue to who DW is. I promise Irving is overrated. He his no Rose or Wall. DW is by far the
best player in this year's draft. Still I expect the Cavs to select Irving. It will be a mistake
mark our words!

You are right, Kyrie is no Rose or Wall. He is a true PG unlike the 2 you mentioned who are SFs in a PG body. I would take a guy that makes the other 4 guys on the court better than a guy that can barely create for himself. Williams might score more points but Kyrie will improve the entire Cavs team. Mark my words!

 

[Futuredome]

You have no clue to who DW is. I promise Irving is overrated. He his no Rose or Wall. DW is by far the
best player in this year's draft. Still I expect the Cavs to select Irving. It will be a mistake
mark our words!

I am glad he isn't like Rose or Wall. Having a guy like Irving who will be a floor general and leader, it much better than freak athlete scoring PG's, especially in Scott's system.

 

[Tornicade]

You are right, Kyrie is no Rose or Wall. He is a true PG unlike the 2 you mentioned who are SFs in a PG body. I would take a guy that makes the other 4 guys on the court better than a guy that can barely create for himself. Williams might score more points but Kyrie will improve the entire Cavs team. Mark my words!

Williams opens up your perimeter by forcing an extra man inside.
Williams keeps a man honest. he cant be left open. thats a guy who will have to stick to his man or get burnt.

Williams helps his team get better by forcing opposing dfenses to focus on him.

Williams also looks to get his teammates involved. if its running a screen or setting a pick he improves your offense without een touching the ball.

All we have actually seen from Irving is an isolation guy who can shoot well as a third option surrounded by two All Americans and before that surrounded by two top 20 high school prospects.

The only person Ive seen irving make better is Irving. Outside of a few games after irvings injury its hard to see any noticeable drop off in Duke as they trnsitioned into a tougher schedule.

Irving didnt contribute one thing to the quality of dukes program except a few highlights here and there.

It does look like the cavs end up taking Irving so I hope he translates those highly touted skills into a productive nba career but for me. I want to see how he handles real game pressure that he didnt get the oppurtunity to see in either high school or college because he has been playing with a loaded deck

 

[Norm]

You have no clue to who DW is. I promise Irving is overrated. He his no Rose or Wall. DW is by far the
best player in this year's draft. Still I expect the Cavs to select Irving. It will be a mistake
mark our words!

So, what's your take on Perrry Jones, if he was in this draft?