JJ Hickson: AKA "4 TIMES THE SHYTTTTTTTTT"

[Damage]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

I disagree with your assessment of him "not giving a shit".

He's just very frustrated. He was a very arrogant young man and Byron Scott is really pushing his buttons. This is the same way he developed David West into the mean-spirited tough-nosed player that he is today. I've made the comparison before and will do so again. Once David West figured out how to channel all of his rage at Scott towards the basketball court, there was no looking back. At the time, it fractured their relationship and David West helped lead a crusade to run him out of town. Now, David West has realized what Scott did for him and from the way I've seen them interact towards each other since he was fired, and there is a high level of respect there.

It's a progression and it's not easy to do with a guy like JJ who is so young and still so arrogant and very far behind on a developmental curve because of the teams and coaches he's had the past few years. Byron is very close to "breaking him" and when it happens there's going to be an explosion.

And as I've said, the Cavs have every reason to be patient with this one no matter how impatient fans may be(throwing out damning generalizations and conclusions about him after 8 games and then drastically changing those same conclusions after 8 more).

Great post. I don't think JJ doesnt give a shit, I just think he's moody and immature. Problem is, he cares too much where it hurts his game

 

[Pierre Pan]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

He's totally lost confidence in his jumper. In addition, he's regressed back to his "patented" "2 hands-on-the-ball-simultaneously" attck on the rim; which is easy fodder for rejection from virtually every other NBA power forward. His offensive production of last year was clearly the beneficiary of Lebron drawing so much attention. He still has so much difficulty in creating his own shot. Don't even get me started on his lack of fundamentals when it comes to blocking out and securing rebounds.

 

[MYoung23]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

It's not going to change anytime soon.

Hickson is not being put in a position to succeed right now. He is a player who first and foremost wants to get to the basket and the Cavaliers have him floating on the perimeter with a lineup that cant space the floor at all and fails to create any easy basket. Varejao in "the hub" destroys the pick-n-roll game. Anyone seen that this year? Against Indiana the Cavaliers tried running middle pick-n-roll with Williams and Varejao and Pacers blew it up every time by ignoring the corner wing at the arc. All I have seen so far is incessant pick-n-pops. That's good for Jamison but not Hickson. When was the last time Hickson rolled to the basket with same fervor as last year? I cant remember. He is pretty much picking and popping every time like Z used to.

Does he get a lot of post touches? No.

Do the starters push the ball and fill lanes? No.

Does he have room to slash to the basket off the dribble or off the ball? No.

Does he have the spacing to run pick-n-roll and actually roll? No.

So what's left? An endless of settling of jumpers which isn't the strength of his game.

He's not David West who can score 12-14 on jumpers in a game. He needs to be out on the floor with threats that will open up what he wants to do. The two players he needs to play with on the floor namely Gibson and Jamison he plays no minutes with. With the exception of Jamison, who has been in the offense for years, and Gibson is anyone thriving in the Princeton? No.

Hickson's confidence is in the toilet and everything falls apart for him when that happens. He is clearly not the same player from this summer, the preseason or earlier in the season. It's not laziness or not caring. I have seen twit pics and tweets about Hickson being on the first Cavalier on the floor before games shooting and getting work in.

We saw the same thing last year when Mike Brown would blame him for everything. When Hickson was allowed to just play he blossomed and grew last year. Scott knows his confidence is shot right now which is why he hasn't said anything about him in a while. No need to just keep beating him in the ground.

Players have to be put in a position to succeed and that isnt happening for Hickson and just about everyone on the roster. What Scott is trying to do just simply isn't working. It was a good idea in theory but the practice has been a disaster. Going into the Orlando game the Cavaliers were 27th in offensive efficiency and 25th in eFG%. Part of that is a lack of talent and part of it is the apparent insistence of pounding some square pegs in round holes. If Scott wants to lay down his foundation regardless of whether anything fits as far as lineups and cohesive units (sans any with Gibson and Jamison) fine but don't tell me there aren't real systematic issues going on offensively.

It really doesn't matter anyway. 60% of the Cavaliers rotation is 28 and older with 3 guys 30 and older and they can barely compete. You'd be hard pressed to rationalize more than 4 guys in the 10 man rotation being here in 2 years. The only development going on with a team that's going nowhere is the backup combo guard.

Other than having 'Cleveland' on the front of the jerseys I really have no reason to watch this stuff.

 

[Mr. Orange]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

It's not going to change anytime soon.

Hickson is not being put in a position to succeed right now. He is a player who first and foremost wants to get to the basket and the Cavaliers have him floating on the perimeter with a lineup that cant space the floor at all and fails to create any easy basket. Varejao in "the hub" destroys the pick-n-roll game. Anyone seen that this year? Against Indiana the Cavaliers tried running middle pick-n-roll with Williams and Varejao and Pacers blew it up every time by ignoring the corner wing at the arc. All I have seen so far is incessant pick-n-pops. That's good for Jamison but not Hickson. When was the last time Hickson rolled to the basket with same fervor as last year? I cant remember. He is pretty much picking and popping every time like Z used to.

Does he get a lot of post touches? No.

Do the starters push the ball and fill lanes? No.

Does he have room to slash to the basket off the dribble or off the ball? No.

Does he have the spacing to run pick-n-roll and actually roll? No.

So what's left? An endless of settling of jumpers which isn't the strength of his game.

He's not David West who can score 12-14 on jumpers in a game. He needs to be out on the floor with threats that will open up what he wants to do. The two players he needs to play with on the floor namely Gibson and Jamison he plays no minutes with. With the exception of Jamison, who has been in the offense for years, and Gibson is anyone thriving in the Princeton? No.

Hickson's confidence is in the toilet and everything falls apart for him when that happens. He is clearly not the same player from this summer, the preseason or earlier in the season. It's not laziness or not caring. I have seen twit pics and tweets about Hickson being on the first Cavalier on the floor before games shooting and getting work in.

We saw the same thing last year when Mike Brown would blame him for everything. When Hickson was allowed to just play he blossomed and grew last year. Scott knows his confidence is shot right now which is why he hasn't said anything about him in a while. No need to just keep beating him in the ground.

Players have to be put in a position to succeed and that isnt happening for Hickson and just about everyone on the roster. What Scott is trying to do just simply isn't working. It was a good idea in theory but the practice has been a disaster. Going into the Orlando game the Cavaliers were 27th in offensive efficiency and 25th in eFG%. Part of that is a lack of talent and part of it is the apparent insistence of pounding some square pegs in round holes. If Scott wants to lay down his foundation regardless of whether anything fits as far as lineups and cohesive units (sans any with Gibson and Jamison) fine but don't tell me there aren't real systematic issues going on offensively.

It really doesn't matter anyway. 60% of the Cavaliers rotation is 28 and older with 3 guys 30 and older and they can barely compete. You'd be hard pressed to rationalize more than 4 guys in the 10 man rotation being here in 2 years. The only development going on with a team that's going nowhere is the backup combo guard.

Other than having 'Cleveland' on the front of the jerseys I really have no reason to watch this stuff.

Lots of good points in this thread.

Look, the Cavs, Gilbert, Grant, Scott...alll in tough spots this year. They lost the team MVP, starting and backup centers, and backup SG. This was a vet team built to "win now" to appease LeDickface. They have done a decent job of putting something out there.

Cavs made a decent trade with Hot Sauce, got a couple guys who can help this year. Maybe keep the team competitive until Jan 1st. They needed to do that to keep the fans interested. We have assets and a good owner. Right now they are buying time with the fans until they can get a plan in place. It's tough with some bad contracts on our books.

Moon and Parker are gone next year. And Jamison is a big expiring next year. We realistically are looking at having a team in the 2012-2013 season, assuming we have decent offseasons. In the meantime, I think Coach Scott is EXACTLY what we need. He is gonna teach these young guys how to play the right way. Hickson will come around. Boobie is only 24. Kid Congo might be able to play. Kaun is still ours.

Best news? We have a good owner and GM now. And a good coach. It is going to take 2-3 years. Give them time. In two years we will have cap space and a lot of draft picks. It's a first class organization. Fans just have to keep supporting. Yes, it is tough to watch this year, but I still think we can get 30 wins. Next summer we can start to formulate a plan. This year was more of a disaster recovery plan.

 

[Jon]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

None of this is really a concern until after the season when we can first start talking to him about a contract extension. Even without the change in the offense, JJ's dip is not unexpected as he transitions from a guy feeding off of defensive inattention to a higher volume player in new systems.

 

[johnnycake44022]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

From my perspective, I think Byron is trying to get JJ to focus on rebounding and defense, both areas he has failed in during his years here, which has resulted in his lack of production offensively. Defense and rebounding is all about mental focus and toughness which JJ lacks based on his age and just general personality. I agree if someone pushes him as he matures, he may develop that but right now, its just not there consistently right now.

 

[ice cream man]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

I disagree with your assessment of him "not giving a shit".

He's just very frustrated. He was a very arrogant young man and Byron Scott is really pushing his buttons. This is the same way he developed David West into the mean-spirited tough-nosed player that he is today. I've made the comparison before and will do so again. Once David West figured out how to channel all of his rage at Scott towards the basketball court, there was no looking back. At the time, it fractured their relationship and David West helped lead a crusade to run him out of town. Now, David West has realized what Scott did for him and from the way I've seen them interact towards each other since he was fired, and there is a high level of respect there.

It's a progression and it's not easy to do with a guy like JJ who is so young and still so arrogant and very far behind on a developmental curve because of the teams and coaches he's had the past few years. Byron is very close to "breaking him" and when it happens there's going to be an explosion.

And as I've said, the Cavs have every reason to be patient with this one no matter how impatient fans may be(throwing out damning generalizations and conclusions about him after 8 games and then drastically changing those same conclusions after 8 more).

Definitely agree with the last paragraph, but it's not a good thing when he's making more than just mental mistakes. The lack of effort on the defensive end and boxing out needs to change. He seems a little selfish to me (though last night he did pass a little more). He rarely passes the ball no matter what the situation is. He'll fight his own teammates for rebounds. He gets the ball, and he just holds it (Jawad and Joey Graham have this problem too, and it could be for several reasons).

Like you said, we should be patient, but it's not a good sign that JJ hasn't reacted well to this frustration. The least he could do is channel it into greater effort on the court.

 

[PIP]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

You guys are crazy... This is kid is so damn lazy it's not even funny..

A player with that size and athleticism..6'9" 240 pounds or so and he snags 5 boards and 0 blocks a game ? Forget this young talk, he's in his 3rd year, has all the opportunity in the world and he's about as lethargic of a big man as you can fine.... Nothing more than a check collector IMO...

He's a 21 year old and plays like he's 35...No heart, no desire, no hustle-- just gets out there, runs around a little bit, might make a nice play here or there, but lets not kid ourselves, you can tell by the way he plays and acts he's very content just being out there and that's it.... Absolutely no desire to be a great player.. A little bit of hustle, combined with those physical gifts and he might have a chance to be a great player.....

His confidence is gone ? I'm sorry, but if he played hard like he's supposed to and actually give a damn, the coach wouldn't be riding his ass and forcing his weak mental ass to "lose confidence".... He's nothing more than another young lazy player...Shows flashes, but has absolutely no desire to do anything else and it shows...

BTW, I can care less that the offense is tailor made for a 35 year old slow tweener PF..... JJ should just defend and rebound and let the rest come on it's own....

 

[Cavatt]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

JJ definitely doesn't get enough touches. AI totally agree with Myoung in that he doesn't get the ball where he can be successful. He needs it closer in and the guards need to be aware of him inside instead of trying to get layups against all the shotblockers. Sessions and Hickson could be a great pick and roll tandem if they would just try it.

 

[elcheato]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

And if he has a good game tonight PIP will change the title to JJ Hickson: All-Star in the making

 

[Three6Pavia]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

I'm pretty sure the only time I've ever heard PIP be positive was when he was talking about the Stankees.

 

[Oreos]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

I'm pretty sure the only time I've ever heard PIP be positive was when he was talking about the Stankees.

He was also positive when we finally got rid of big Z.

 

[1B4IGO]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

I'm pretty sure the only time I've ever heard PIP be positive was when he was talking about the Stankees.

So soon you all forget the sweet stroke of Lukr Jackson.

 

[JSS2306]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

You guys are crazy... This is kid is so damn lazy it's not even funny..

A player with that size and athleticism..6'9" 240 pounds or so and he snags 5 boards and 0 blocks a game ? Forget this young talk, he's in his 3rd year, has all the opportunity in the world and he's about as lethargic of a big man as you can fine.... Nothing more than a check collector IMO...

He's a 21 year old and plays like he's 35...No heart, no desire, no hustle-- just gets out there, runs around a little bit, might make a nice play here or there, but lets not kid ourselves, you can tell by the way he plays and acts he's very content just being out there and that's it.... Absolutely no desire to be a great player.. A little bit of hustle, combined with those physical gifts and he might have a chance to be a great player.....

His confidence is gone ? I'm sorry, but if he played hard like he's supposed to and actually give a damn, the coach wouldn't be riding his ass and forcing his weak mental ass to "lose confidence".... He's nothing more than another young lazy player...Shows flashes, but has absolutely no desire to do anything else and it shows...

BTW, I can care less that the offense is tailor made for a 35 year old slow tweener PF..... JJ should just defend and rebound and let the rest come on it's own....

Yeah over the years I've found that if a guy doesn't want it, especially at 21 years old, then you're going to see more disappointments than progressions.

JJ should change his outlook and get focused. Get a script, get inspired, whatever. His stock is diving.

 

[Sergio]

Re: JJ Hickson: Progressing like a fat Snail...

Well since we have so many other young players we could spend our time developing...yeah! Let's throw him off the boat and keep on keepin-on!

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